Valvoline Restore and Protect, HPL, for an old 3.5 Ecoboost

[sandcritter]

What would you do?

WWYD?

This winter: Valvoline Restore and Protect 5w30 vs. repeat HPL Premium Plus 0w40

You may recall my neglected-by-previous-owner-I-learned-the-hard-way-let-this-be-a-lesson gen 1 3.5 ecoboost rehab project. 5k oci on HPL PCMO/Prem Plus, filter q 1600mi will fill pleats about 25% with carbon debris - no joke. Silly, I know, but it’s my truck and runs great. Timing chain 80k mi ago. Mileage sucks, around 14mpg, but….

181k miles, parked most of past summer, finally goes in shop this week for manifolds/turbos/downpipe & exhaust refresh (again, silly, i get it, no need to rub it in).

Have run HPL the past 50k mi, producing copious carbon in filters. Barely slackened over this time. But I wonder:

What about running Valvoline Restore and Protect 5w30 for this winter, typically run about 10k mi winters. Oci 3k, filter halfway as have had to do (PITA but necessary). The point is, it’s unclear how much good HPL does on rings, and this engine is tough on rings. Does HPL clean everything else? No doubt - got filters full of it. But I wonder if Valvoline Restore and Protect may benefit me / ring packs?

Versus, HPL Premium Plus 0w40 is superior oil on paper, for a stored-outside winter (NW and South Central MT), and great HTHS for the engine’s ridiculously long timing chain.

I go back and forth. What do you think?

 

[fantastic]

You won't know until you run the R&P. In general I'd use a 40 grade though.

 

[sandcritter]

Exactly. If Valvoline Restore and Protect came in Xw40 it’d be a simple decision; just try it. But, it doesn’t. So I debate split hairs with self.

 

[Jetronic]

I'd run Valvoline Restore and Protect over winter, and if the vehicle isn't used much in summer, all year....

Timing chains don't care about HTHS, chain guides will though.

 

[buster]

If you're doing 10k oci I'd stick with HPL.

 

[Glenda W.]

Any oil consumption? If so four 5k oci’s with Valvoline Restore and Protect. It’s worth a try.

 

[Hohn]

What would you do?

...

Have run HPL the past 50k mi, producing copious carbon in filters. Barely slackened over this time. But I wonder:

If the HPL or Valvoline Restore and Protect was better, how would you know? Are you intending to use UOA to compare? You probably know that's going to be difficult.

How do you know the source of the carbon in your filters? I don't think you can say whether HPL is cleaning rings or not. It seems probable that it is, since that's one of the most deposit-prone parts of any engine.

I can see a couple ways to slice this question. First: if you're already getting cleaning fast enough to force a filter change at 1600 miles, what are you hoping to gain from Valvoline Restore and Protect?

Alternatively: why are you spending PPPCMO oil dollars to use it as an expensive flush? It hurts my soul a bit to see PPPCMO drained at 5k.

I realize that especially with oil, what feels right and what makes economic sense are often not the same thing, and I'm still using premium oils in 20 year old vehicles with one foot in the boneyard when the cheapest generic oil would still let the engine outlast the rest of the vehicle. It's not always about dollars.

JMO, but I'd be inclined to "restore" with Valvoline Restore and Protect and "protect" with HPL. That said, if the dollars aren't an issue for you, by all means continue with HPL and enjoy superior winter flow and excellent HTHS.

 

[Patrick0525]

Returned from Walmart this morning and Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30 is low stock with just one jug remaining. Too many are reading the BITOG forums.

 

[hemioiler]

HPL is very effective at cleaning. You're already running it, Valvoline Restore and Protect isn't going to do anything other than downgrade to a lesser oil everywhere else. HPL > Valvoline Restore and Protect in every way, why would it not work on rings? If you can afford it you're doing the right thing IMHO.

 

[mt23]

Perhaps adding HPL engine cleaner to your current HPL regimen will speed up the cleaning process? If filters are collecting crud each time, slow clean is best clean

 

[jetman]

I've used both oils
HPL for sure

 

[sandcritter]

If you're doing 10k oci I'd stick with HPL.

No. Expect about 10k mi travel summers and 10k mi each winter.

With HPL I go 5k changes - not because it couldn’t go longer obviously, but because it’s a demonstrably dirty-azz engine, plus being gas turbo DI it’s a hearty diluter, and common rule of thumb for this engine is 5k changes.

VRP, am sure it’s fine oil, but there’s some question as to how robust it is in such conditions. Fortunately it’s relatively inexpensive. Reckon if try it, I’d 3k oci the stuff.

 

[sandcritter]

HPL is very effective at cleaning. You're already running it, Valvoline Restore and Protect isn't going to do anything other than downgrade to a lesser oil everywhere else. HPL > Valvoline Restore and Protect in every way, why would it not work on rings? If you can afford it you're doing the right thing IMHO.

This is what I wonder.

Not aware of a factual answer, however. Just supposition.

 

[buster]

No. Expect about 10k mi travel summers and 10k mi each winter.

With HPL I go 5k changes - not because it couldn’t go longer obviously, but because it’s a demonstrably dirty-azz engine, plus being gas turbo DI it’s a hearty diluter, and common rule of thumb for this engine is 5k changes.

VRP, am sure it’s fine oil, but there’s some question as to how robust it is in such conditions. Fortunately it’s relatively inexpensive. Reckon if try it, I’d 3k oci the stuff.

Well in that case VRP. It's designed and proven to clean rings back to OE cleanliness. I thought you were pushing drains out to 10k miles in which case would favor HPL.

 

[hemioiler]

Perhaps adding HPL engine cleaner to your current HPL regimen will speed up the cleaning process? If filters are collecting crud each time, slow clean is best clean

HPL's actual oil is already a much stronger cleaner than their "engine cleaner" product.

 

[barbersurgeon]

You’ve given the HPL 50k of oci’s and it still is showing that much in the filter, wow.

I’d be dropping the oil pan and checking the pick up tube at this point.

 

[Hohn]

You’ve given the HPL 50k of oci’s and it still is showing that much in the filter, wow.

I’d be dropping the oil pan and checking the pick up tube at this point.

It’s possible that the condition of the filters is being exaggerated. It seems HIGHLY improbable to me than an engine that’s super dirty is being cleaned fast enough to nearly plug a filter in 1600 miles and ALSO still doing so at 50k miles.

IF this engine is that dirty, it needs to be on VRP and 2k OCIs with 1k FCIs until the filters are clean.

 

[sandcritter]

It’s possible that the condition of the filters is being exaggerated. It seems HIGHLY improbable to me than an engine that’s super dirty is being cleaned fast enough to nearly plug a filter in 1600 miles and ALSO still doing so at 50k miles.

IF this engine is that dirty, it needs to be on VRP and 2k OCIs with 1k FCIs until the filters are clean.

Agree completely, Hohn. You can read the backstory, and see the media photos, under my posts (aren’t that many), but what you suggest is essentially what have been doing for 52,000mi at this point, except using HPL and silly-frequent filter changes.

Yes, it’s ridiculous.

But a new truck is not in the cards right now, so onward I go.

 

[Hohn]

Agree completely, Hohn. You can read the backstory, and see the media photos, under my posts (aren’t that many), but what you suggest is essentially what have been doing for 52,000mi at this point, except using HPL and silly-frequent filter changes.

Yes, it’s ridiculous.

But a new truck is not in the cards right now, so onward I go.

You asked for our advice, but honestly just do what seems right in your own eyes. You are using a superb oil and being quite fastidious in the filter condition. The engine seems to be running quite well and improving, right? Sounds to me like “stay the course” is the best option.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

No. Expect about 10k mi travel summers and 10k mi each winter.

With HPL I go 5k changes - not because it couldn’t go longer obviously, but because it’s a demonstrably dirty-azz engine, plus being gas turbo DI it’s a hearty diluter, and common rule of thumb for this engine is 5k changes.

VRP, am sure it’s fine oil, but there’s some question as to how robust it is in such conditions. Fortunately it’s relatively inexpensive. Reckon if try it, I’d 3k oci the stuff.

You’ll likely be shocked if you actually test the proper HPL grade and sample at a “sane” OCI. Not speaking for any other application or OCI, but HPL No VII Euro went nearly 3x what Ravenol DXG did, and passed with flying colors compared to Ravenol’s red flag for out-of-spec (thin) viscosity…

This coming from the guy who tested Ravenol, Amsoil, and others including HPL on a 3.5 EcoBoost…