Like this guy, sentenced to a 110 year sentence. His employer came out clean.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna9603
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna9603
Truck towing a double has a accident that shuts down the highway
- Thread starter GON
- Start date
Many years ago a friend from New York came out west to visit and noticed that we allowed triple trailer semis on the highways. He had never seen those before.
I don’t see them around here in Washington anymore. The state may have put the kibosh on them.
I don’t see them around here in Washington anymore. The state may have put the kibosh on them.
I personally drove professionally for 40 years and my father drove longer than that. I don’t know how many friends, relatives and co-workers I’ve known and talked with in the trucking industry. My information is not second hand. I’ve got the t shirt, ball cap and the coffee mug. It’s not from I know someone who knows someone.
"Push to the limits" and exceeding legal hours are two different things. Any Federal agency or insurance company can walk in to corporate and pull computerized logs. Going to be hard to explain how "this truck" reached "this location" logged by GPS - it would show the hours were exceeded for the truck to reach a location in that amount of time.
And then we are not even mentioning most commercial trucks are governed at not that far above the legal speed limit-insurance companies demand it. (Again we are talking the MAJOR CARRIERS).
There are no such things as keeping two sets of log books anymore.
ELDs …. ^^^^^^^^^^^^
. I have listened to an overnight trucking show on the radio… ATN… Steve Summers on there talked about ELDs a WHOLE lot when they first got implemented in the trucks.
By the way… I have called in and gotten a good amount of airtime on ATN a few times back 4-5 years ago. . I got a radio voice.
. I have listened to an overnight trucking show on the radio… ATN… Steve Summers on there talked about ELDs a WHOLE lot when they first got implemented in the trucks.
By the way… I have called in and gotten a good amount of airtime on ATN a few times back 4-5 years ago. . I got a radio voice.
Your experience is your experience, but it doesn’t mean it matches every other trucker’s experience. Maybe your routes were very predictable or you just had one or few.
I know I trucker that used to deliver auto parts from Ontario Canada to Detroit. He had to be exactly on time because of Just In Time manufacturing, so he knew his route inside and out and didn’t have to deal with dispatchers “encouraging” him.
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It’s not that simple though. Many have satellite communication, but my FIL gets called on his cellphone whenever they want something from him that they don’t want to be on the record.
GPS logs are only checked if there is a complaint and even then I’m pretty sure feds would need a warrant as this is company property and information. Log books are the official time management tool that feds and police can ask at any time and that is managed and filled out by the driver.
So like I mentioned earlier, it is the driver that gets penalized most of the time, not the company.
I used to triple tow all the time. 5th wheel plus bassboat. Perfectly safe, but you have to pay attention to what your doing, and drive the conditions
dnewton3
Staff member
I didn't see much information that would help us understand how that accident occurred as a root cause (in the OPs story post).
Here is a potential cause that most don't think about, and it can be very common ...
To "double tow" safely, there should be a set of brakes on both towed trailers. First and foremost, both towed units should have brakes (typically electric, but can be hydraulic if it's a larger boat trailer). Many times, small boats on smaller trailers don't even have brakes. That would not be an issue if only a single load were being towed, but it's a HUGE problem if it's a double-tow.
The set up of braking systems in double-towing is critical. Proper towing means that the rear-most trailer has to have a tiny bit more "pull" (brake effect) than what's in front of it; this keeps the tow vehicle and towed trailers aligned when slowing/stopping. If not, then there is a "push" effect from the lesser-braking unit causing disruption in the alignment. In large commercial rigs which double-tow, this can be accommodated with adjustments to the brakes and air systems. But in personally-owned vehicles, this rarely if ever is addressed because of the variations of combinations of towed-trailers.
When a single vehicle tows a single trailer, it's very easy to get that setup done right. This is why most good systems today have adjustable gain, etc. But when you double tow, both trailers should be shouldering their own load in braking, plus be able to bias the braking to the rear-most unit. But it's nearly impossible to get this set up right with electric brakes. Why? Mainly because of voltage drop.
Electric brakes operate on a principle of variable voltage causing magnets to "drag" against the drum face, torquing the arm to apply the pressure to the drum shoes. When you double tow, the first trailer behind the tow vehicle always gets a bit more voltage than does the second trailer (because of voltage drop), hence the braking will always be a tad stronger in the first trailer more than the second. So, you get "push" from the rear most trailer. That push causes all manner of problems because it's going to move the tail of the first trailer, which then causes the nose of the first trailer to start a sway effect into the tow vehicle. And (pardon the pun ...) it's all downhill from there.
AS LONG AS you don't operate a double-tow system near its limits, you can usually control the entire train of vehicle/trailers fairly well. But if you get near or over the limits of the system, once it becomes "unbalanced" and starts braking sway, there's no recovery unless you were to release the brake and hit the gas, causing pull to straighten the load out. Even vehicles today with sway control systems are designed with the understanding of sway relative to ONE towed unit, not two. The sway-control systems are not made to do the complex "counter reaction" required for a double tow application.
In this story that GON posted, it's not clear if a mechanical system failed, or if poor set-up existed, or unsafe operation was present, or some combination of the three. But I suspect once something started going wrong, the brake capability/capacity of the total load was exceeded in sway control, and it just got out of hand past what the driver and/or the sway control system (if present at all) could handle.
Double towing can be done safely IF AND ONLY IF the entire brake system as a whole is set up properly. Because most folks don't understand how to do this, it's just an accident waiting to happen. Even if they did, it's almost impossible to get it set right with electric brakes because of voltage drop in a traditional system. It could be compensated for with complex voltage control circuits, etc, but most common Joe's will never pay for that, nor understand how to properly set it up.
But then again, if you've ever watched the YT channel called "Just Rolled In", you'd understand that there are a LOT of unsafe vehicles all around us, every day. So these double-tow vehicles are not alone in the danger they present to the rest of us.
Here is a potential cause that most don't think about, and it can be very common ...
To "double tow" safely, there should be a set of brakes on both towed trailers. First and foremost, both towed units should have brakes (typically electric, but can be hydraulic if it's a larger boat trailer). Many times, small boats on smaller trailers don't even have brakes. That would not be an issue if only a single load were being towed, but it's a HUGE problem if it's a double-tow.
The set up of braking systems in double-towing is critical. Proper towing means that the rear-most trailer has to have a tiny bit more "pull" (brake effect) than what's in front of it; this keeps the tow vehicle and towed trailers aligned when slowing/stopping. If not, then there is a "push" effect from the lesser-braking unit causing disruption in the alignment. In large commercial rigs which double-tow, this can be accommodated with adjustments to the brakes and air systems. But in personally-owned vehicles, this rarely if ever is addressed because of the variations of combinations of towed-trailers.
When a single vehicle tows a single trailer, it's very easy to get that setup done right. This is why most good systems today have adjustable gain, etc. But when you double tow, both trailers should be shouldering their own load in braking, plus be able to bias the braking to the rear-most unit. But it's nearly impossible to get this set up right with electric brakes. Why? Mainly because of voltage drop.
Electric brakes operate on a principle of variable voltage causing magnets to "drag" against the drum face, torquing the arm to apply the pressure to the drum shoes. When you double tow, the first trailer behind the tow vehicle always gets a bit more voltage than does the second trailer (because of voltage drop), hence the braking will always be a tad stronger in the first trailer more than the second. So, you get "push" from the rear most trailer. That push causes all manner of problems because it's going to move the tail of the first trailer, which then causes the nose of the first trailer to start a sway effect into the tow vehicle. And (pardon the pun ...) it's all downhill from there.
AS LONG AS you don't operate a double-tow system near its limits, you can usually control the entire train of vehicle/trailers fairly well. But if you get near or over the limits of the system, once it becomes "unbalanced" and starts braking sway, there's no recovery unless you were to release the brake and hit the gas, causing pull to straighten the load out. Even vehicles today with sway control systems are designed with the understanding of sway relative to ONE towed unit, not two. The sway-control systems are not made to do the complex "counter reaction" required for a double tow application.
In this story that GON posted, it's not clear if a mechanical system failed, or if poor set-up existed, or unsafe operation was present, or some combination of the three. But I suspect once something started going wrong, the brake capability/capacity of the total load was exceeded in sway control, and it just got out of hand past what the driver and/or the sway control system (if present at all) could handle.
Double towing can be done safely IF AND ONLY IF the entire brake system as a whole is set up properly. Because most folks don't understand how to do this, it's just an accident waiting to happen. Even if they did, it's almost impossible to get it set right with electric brakes because of voltage drop in a traditional system. It could be compensated for with complex voltage control circuits, etc, but most common Joe's will never pay for that, nor understand how to properly set it up.
But then again, if you've ever watched the YT channel called "Just Rolled In", you'd understand that there are a LOT of unsafe vehicles all around us, every day. So these double-tow vehicles are not alone in the danger they present to the rest of us.
Absolutely. There’s not enough information in the OP to determine what happened. Larger trucks with air brake systems have proportion valves in the brake system that activate the brakes on the rear trailer first, then the second one and then the tractor when using the foot valve. All of this happens in miliseconds. With electric brakes the gain setting that works for one trailer may lock the brakes up on the other or not be enough to even slow it down.
As far as the carrier requiring drivers to exceed their hours of service, FMCSR states that “No carrier may require or permit any driver to exceed the hours of service regulations“. We were required to have a copy of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations and Hazardous Materials Response Guide in the truck with us at all times. I recycled mine when I retired.
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