title twist. 1.7 lower mpg with b20
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Your title is misleading, it is 1.7 percent lower MPG (fairly insignificant if you ask me) and possibly fuel filter clogging.
What's the price difference b/n B20 and ULSD? If it is more than 1.7% + cost of filters + cost of maintenance - you have a winner.
What's the price difference b/n B20 and ULSD? If it is more than 1.7% + cost of filters + cost of maintenance - you have a winner.
I respectfully disagree. The title of the article "Study : no difference between b-20 and ulsd" is misleading.
It then goes on to say that there was a 35% increase in maintenance costs and a 1.7% mpg decrease.
In my opinion this is a huge difference to fleets. A 35% increase in main. cost, not to mention risk of downtime can be huge.
A 1.7 mpg decrease for a semi that travels 100k a year at 6 mpg @ $4.50 fuel cost is fuel cost differntial of $1271. For one truck.
It then goes on to say that there was a 35% increase in maintenance costs and a 1.7% mpg decrease.
In my opinion this is a huge difference to fleets. A 35% increase in main. cost, not to mention risk of downtime can be huge.
A 1.7 mpg decrease for a semi that travels 100k a year at 6 mpg @ $4.50 fuel cost is fuel cost differntial of $1271. For one truck.
Originally Posted By: salesrep
I respectfully disagree. The title of the article "Study : no difference between b-20 and ulsd" is misleading.
It then goes on to say that there was a 35% increase in maintenance costs and a 1.7% mpg decrease.
In my opinion this is a huge difference to fleets. A 35% increase in main. cost, not to mention risk of downtime can be huge.
A 1.7 mpg decrease for a semi that travels 100k a year at 6 mpg @ $4.50 fuel cost is fuel cost differntial of $1271. For one truck.
Until recently I was putting about 55k miles/year on my Golf TDI, using about 1350 gallons of ULSD. A 1.7% decrease in fuel economy would be nearly 23 gallons, so at $4.50/gallon an additional cost of over $100. I don't care to throw away $100 for no good purpose.
My own experience has been limited to a few tanks of B100. The fuel mileage reduction was more like 4.0%, so I only bought B100 when it was significantly cheaper than ULSD. It was cheaper on occasion, but not regularly.
I bought several gallons of B100 to use as an additive, but recently dumped it all in the tank to get rid of it, it was starting to smell nasty. A local station has B02, I will fill up there if the price is right.
I respectfully disagree. The title of the article "Study : no difference between b-20 and ulsd" is misleading.
It then goes on to say that there was a 35% increase in maintenance costs and a 1.7% mpg decrease.
In my opinion this is a huge difference to fleets. A 35% increase in main. cost, not to mention risk of downtime can be huge.
A 1.7 mpg decrease for a semi that travels 100k a year at 6 mpg @ $4.50 fuel cost is fuel cost differntial of $1271. For one truck.
Until recently I was putting about 55k miles/year on my Golf TDI, using about 1350 gallons of ULSD. A 1.7% decrease in fuel economy would be nearly 23 gallons, so at $4.50/gallon an additional cost of over $100. I don't care to throw away $100 for no good purpose.
My own experience has been limited to a few tanks of B100. The fuel mileage reduction was more like 4.0%, so I only bought B100 when it was significantly cheaper than ULSD. It was cheaper on occasion, but not regularly.
I bought several gallons of B100 to use as an additive, but recently dumped it all in the tank to get rid of it, it was starting to smell nasty. A local station has B02, I will fill up there if the price is right.
I have been using a B11-B15 mix in my semi for a couple of years now. let's see... over 21,000 gallons of fuel a year for two years.... That's around 5000 gallons of bio has gone thru my truck. My fuel mileage is on par with anything I got using just petro diesel. There was an initial clean out of the fuel system that caused me to go thru a couple of extra fuel filters, but then settled down to normal.
Fuel system is nice and clean, injectors doing well, engine runs a little smoother, less soot in exhaust.
I'll stay with it. Been using it year round and have had no problems. Been using it as well in my '06 Jeep Liberty Diesel. have no problems with EGR like a lot of other owners have had and the Jeep runs great. Even the MAP sensor stays cleaner, longer. Same is true for the MAP sensor, EGR sensor tubes, and EGR on my Cummins ISX.
Not a "scientific" study, but with the results I have had, I will continue using a bio blend up to 20% on a regular basis.
Fuel system is nice and clean, injectors doing well, engine runs a little smoother, less soot in exhaust.
I'll stay with it. Been using it year round and have had no problems. Been using it as well in my '06 Jeep Liberty Diesel. have no problems with EGR like a lot of other owners have had and the Jeep runs great. Even the MAP sensor stays cleaner, longer. Same is true for the MAP sensor, EGR sensor tubes, and EGR on my Cummins ISX.
Not a "scientific" study, but with the results I have had, I will continue using a bio blend up to 20% on a regular basis.
Any gelling issues running bio?
I haven't had any gelling issues. I am presently in Wisconsin and it is -25F. The truck is running just fine and I have a B5 blend in the tanks. Matter of fact, this makes the second night of this low of temps. A lot of trucks are gelled up along I80 in Iowa and I35 up to the Twin Cities. I have NEVER gelled up in 30 years at this game including 10 years driving in Alaska. But then I spec the truck right... got a heated Davco primary fuel filter in place of the normal cheapie primary that Cummins likes. Also, no matter whether using bio blend or straight dino juice... you got to have in a good additive. Personally, I used Howe's for years, but am having really good results from Schaeffer's for the last two years. I had to get the B5 because I wasn't able to get to my normal stops that had B10.
The place you purchase is critical also. The Pilot truck stop in Des Moines had over half of its pumps down due to fuel gelling and filters clogging up today. They are running a B5 blend. The Love's truck stop just down the road in Newton is selling the same blend and I filled up there twice in the last two days and have no problem in the cold weather. It handled -29F last night. Pilot is notorious for plain cheap fuel. A lot of the better outlets will winterize the fuel at the terminal before delivery. Casey's convenience stores are good for that.
Always ask questions of your fuel dealer. If they won't give you an answer or fudge on the issue, then best to find a different outlet. A few cents difference is easy to swallow compared to sitting on the side of the road with a clogged filter and gelled up fuel in the tanks.
The place you purchase is critical also. The Pilot truck stop in Des Moines had over half of its pumps down due to fuel gelling and filters clogging up today. They are running a B5 blend. The Love's truck stop just down the road in Newton is selling the same blend and I filled up there twice in the last two days and have no problem in the cold weather. It handled -29F last night. Pilot is notorious for plain cheap fuel. A lot of the better outlets will winterize the fuel at the terminal before delivery. Casey's convenience stores are good for that.
Always ask questions of your fuel dealer. If they won't give you an answer or fudge on the issue, then best to find a different outlet. A few cents difference is easy to swallow compared to sitting on the side of the road with a clogged filter and gelled up fuel in the tanks.
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Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
A few cents difference is easy to swallow compared to sitting on the side of the road with a clogged filter and gelled up fuel in the tanks.
Copy that.
Good information, thank you. I religiously use additive, and currently use FP plus. I try to fuel on I80/94 in NW Indiana where there is heavy turnover. In fact, there is a Pilot as well as a Travel Center right across the border. Any history in this area?
A few cents difference is easy to swallow compared to sitting on the side of the road with a clogged filter and gelled up fuel in the tanks.
Copy that.
Good information, thank you. I religiously use additive, and currently use FP plus. I try to fuel on I80/94 in NW Indiana where there is heavy turnover. In fact, there is a Pilot as well as a Travel Center right across the border. Any history in this area?
Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
I haven't had any gelling issues. I am presently in Wisconsin and it is -25F. The truck is running just fine and I have a B5 blend in the tanks. Matter of fact, this makes the second night of this low of temps. A lot of trucks are gelled up along I80 in Iowa and I35 up to the Twin Cities....
The Pilot truck stop in Des Moines had over half of its pumps down due to fuel gelling and filters clogging up today. They are running a B5 blend. The Love's truck stop just down the road in Newton is selling the same blend and I filled up there twice in the last two days and have no problem in the cold weather. It handled -29F last night. Pilot is notorious for plain cheap fuel.
I filled up at that Love's truck stop in November, added just a normal amount of Power Service, and had no troubles. Then on December 20th I filled up at a Kum & Go near Grinnell and my fuel gelled up the next day (about -8° that morning). They were nice enough to pay for my towing, but I won't be buying fuel from them in cold weather.
Right now I am filling up at the New Century Farm Service pumps in Grinnell, All the school buses, all the city trucks use these pumps. They have two blends -- $2.219 for unblended #2 ULSD (about 42 cetane), and $2.449 for premium blended diesel, #1 and #2 plus antigel additives plus cetane booster plus emulsifier.
I paid the extra 23 cents/gallon and did not add any of my own additive. But I do carry a quart of Diesel 911, just in case. If I'd had some with me on the day of the gelling problem, I had enough warning I think that it would have saved me from calling the tow truck.
Question: Love's in Newton and New Century in Grinnell post the same prices, +/- 1 or 2 cents. But NC charges more for their super-dooper winterized fuel. How well treated is the usual winterized fuel at most truck stops, and do they charge more than the posted price for a special blend?
I haven't had any gelling issues. I am presently in Wisconsin and it is -25F. The truck is running just fine and I have a B5 blend in the tanks. Matter of fact, this makes the second night of this low of temps. A lot of trucks are gelled up along I80 in Iowa and I35 up to the Twin Cities....
The Pilot truck stop in Des Moines had over half of its pumps down due to fuel gelling and filters clogging up today. They are running a B5 blend. The Love's truck stop just down the road in Newton is selling the same blend and I filled up there twice in the last two days and have no problem in the cold weather. It handled -29F last night. Pilot is notorious for plain cheap fuel.
I filled up at that Love's truck stop in November, added just a normal amount of Power Service, and had no troubles. Then on December 20th I filled up at a Kum & Go near Grinnell and my fuel gelled up the next day (about -8° that morning). They were nice enough to pay for my towing, but I won't be buying fuel from them in cold weather.
Right now I am filling up at the New Century Farm Service pumps in Grinnell, All the school buses, all the city trucks use these pumps. They have two blends -- $2.219 for unblended #2 ULSD (about 42 cetane), and $2.449 for premium blended diesel, #1 and #2 plus antigel additives plus cetane booster plus emulsifier.
I paid the extra 23 cents/gallon and did not add any of my own additive. But I do carry a quart of Diesel 911, just in case. If I'd had some with me on the day of the gelling problem, I had enough warning I think that it would have saved me from calling the tow truck.
Question: Love's in Newton and New Century in Grinnell post the same prices, +/- 1 or 2 cents. But NC charges more for their super-dooper winterized fuel. How well treated is the usual winterized fuel at most truck stops, and do they charge more than the posted price for a special blend?
Hi Red! I live just a hop away from your location. North of Kellogg.
I have really been disappointed with the farm coop outlets when it comes to diesel pricing. I frequent the Love's in Newton a lot...... like over 1000 gallons a month! But I get a good pricing with them that is not reflected at the pump. No one else in the immediate area will sell me diesel at the price Love's will sell it to me. They will sell it to me at between .15 and .18 below the pump cash price. But it is volume pricing.
I usually will put in a additive when it gets down right cold... usually when I know it will be below 0F. But the truckstops will have the fuel meet the expected temps more often than the other retailers. They have to keep a lot of big buying clientele happy or they will lose a lot of business. Also, since they are going thru tankers of the stuff each day, they will have their tanks full of fresh fuel that meets the expected weather conditions. I have only had one gell up in 30 years (including 10 in Alaska) and that was this winter when I got fuel at the TA truckstop in Walcott, IA. I have never had a problem with Love's. Casey's in Newton has pump prices that are usually below Love's and they are pretty good about having treated fuel in the tank. Never had a problem with them either. But, like I said, I get a preferred pricing deal with Love's so I use them more often than not.
I have really been disappointed with the farm coop outlets when it comes to diesel pricing. I frequent the Love's in Newton a lot...... like over 1000 gallons a month! But I get a good pricing with them that is not reflected at the pump. No one else in the immediate area will sell me diesel at the price Love's will sell it to me. They will sell it to me at between .15 and .18 below the pump cash price. But it is volume pricing.
I usually will put in a additive when it gets down right cold... usually when I know it will be below 0F. But the truckstops will have the fuel meet the expected temps more often than the other retailers. They have to keep a lot of big buying clientele happy or they will lose a lot of business. Also, since they are going thru tankers of the stuff each day, they will have their tanks full of fresh fuel that meets the expected weather conditions. I have only had one gell up in 30 years (including 10 in Alaska) and that was this winter when I got fuel at the TA truckstop in Walcott, IA. I have never had a problem with Love's. Casey's in Newton has pump prices that are usually below Love's and they are pretty good about having treated fuel in the tank. Never had a problem with them either. But, like I said, I get a preferred pricing deal with Love's so I use them more often than not.
Originally Posted By: ChiTDI
Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
A few cents difference is easy to swallow compared to sitting on the side of the road with a clogged filter and gelled up fuel in the tanks.
Copy that.
Good information, thank you. I religiously use additive, and currently use FP plus. I try to fuel on I80/94 in NW Indiana where there is heavy turnover. In fact, there is a Pilot as well as a Travel Center right across the border. Any history in this area?
Yep. have probably taken on about 20,000 gallons of fuel in that area over the years. I would highly recommend the Flying J in Lake Station (exit 15) or the one in Gary (exit 9) as good fuel stops. The Steel City chain (exit 9) isn't bad. I have gotten gun shy of the TA and Pilot chains over the years. I am not convinced they always have quality fuel. Pilot especially.
FP is a good additive. Most of the additives out there are pretty good. Just shop for good pricing and use it when your gut tells you to.
Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
A few cents difference is easy to swallow compared to sitting on the side of the road with a clogged filter and gelled up fuel in the tanks.
Copy that.
Good information, thank you. I religiously use additive, and currently use FP plus. I try to fuel on I80/94 in NW Indiana where there is heavy turnover. In fact, there is a Pilot as well as a Travel Center right across the border. Any history in this area?
Yep. have probably taken on about 20,000 gallons of fuel in that area over the years. I would highly recommend the Flying J in Lake Station (exit 15) or the one in Gary (exit 9) as good fuel stops. The Steel City chain (exit 9) isn't bad. I have gotten gun shy of the TA and Pilot chains over the years. I am not convinced they always have quality fuel. Pilot especially.
FP is a good additive. Most of the additives out there are pretty good. Just shop for good pricing and use it when your gut tells you to.
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