The Aisin AW F8FXX 8 speed transmission is in everything! Is it reliable?

S

SC Maintenance

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Jun 8, 2022
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So was researching potential new to me used vehicles and I ran into this wiki article on the Aisin transverse 8 speed. I already own one of these - in our 2019 Rav4.

I would have figured Toyota and Lexus - but this thing is in everything - GM, Jag, Land Rover, Mits, Volvo, VW and even the small BMW's - I would have thought all the BMW's would be all ZF?

So, who else has one. Any issues with it? Given that small cars and CVT's are becoming so prevalent - this I think is good news. If its reliable, it should also mean parts should be available for a long time if needed?

Here is the list:

en.wikipedia.org

AWF8F35 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
I've never heard of an issue with that transmission. Seems like a pretty run of the mill automatic these days, tiny torque converter that locks out really low for clutches. Similar design used by pretty much everything with a geared non-DCT transmission these days.
 
My wife's '22 X1 has one, and it drives me nuts. It goes into neutral right before it stops moving (not auto stop/start) and while stopped. It makes a bump when you let off the brake pedal as it goes back into gear. I find myself rolling a lot of stop signs to try to drive around the issue. It makes it almost impossible to stop smoothly. It works normally if you put the shifter into sport mode, but it downshifts firmly and runs around in too low a gear. No other complaints about the way it drives.

We drove a lot of small SUV's before buying this one. She didn't want to move up to an X3. We both wanted to like Lexus but didn't. We're not entry level buyers, but it's what she liked.
 
Gus_Mahn said:
My wife's '22 X1 has one, and it drives me nuts. It goes into neutral right before it stops moving (not auto stop/start) and while stopped. It makes a bump when you let off the brake pedal as it goes back into gear. I find myself rolling a lot of stop signs to try to drive around the issue. It makes it almost impossible to stop smoothly. It works normally if you put the shifter into sport mode, but it downshifts firmly and runs around in too low a gear. No other complaints about the way it drives.

We drove a lot of small SUV's before buying this one. She didn't want to move up to an X3. We both wanted to like Lexus but didn't. We're not entry level buyers, but it's what she liked.
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Its a learning transmission. Possibly it needs to be reset back to factory settings and try again? When the current Rav4 came out there were a number of complaints on the Toyo boards on what sounds similar - like a really jerky rolling stop / restart? Is that about right?
 
SC Maintenance said:
Its a learning transmission. Possibly it needs to be reset back to factory settings and try again? When the current Rav4 came out there were a number of complaints on the Toyo boards on what sounds similar - like a really jerky rolling stop / restart? Is that about right?
Click to expand...
Yes that’s correct. It seems to function acceptably except for stops and starts. It is for sure dropping out of gear, but nobody but a car guy would understand. Even most at the dealers don’t understand. I will talk with the advisor next “free” oil change and ask about an update or a reset of the transmission adaptive tables. I should probably see if the issue is addressed in a service bulletin.
 
8 speeds widely used, but the tuning is problematic to some end owners. in the tmc sphere, it likes to jump to the highest gear, chugging and you end up with induced nvh. Some folks got a reset, others added harmonic dampers on the exhaust, others claimed running high octane gas cured it, and i think the best way was making sure to drive in sport mode for those who have a lightfoot.

The newest iterations though, the tuning has gotten better, and I dont need see as many complaints.
 
Ewww, I think this is the transmission that @StevieC had in his Highlander that he absolutely hated.

StevieC said:
I didn't end up keeping the Highlander because the 8-speed transmission I just couldn't live with but it was a good test case for the couple thousand miles I had it in there.
Click to expand...
 
Have one in the wife's 2017 Buick Lacrosse, now with over 60k miles. Did have dealer do dump and fill of fluid about 10k mi ago. Certainly no major complaints with it. Have had both more and less satisfying ATs
 
Seems like GM tried the “drop to neutral at stops” thing in the 80s - I don’t remember the models, but I want to say it ended is dismal wear on one of the clutches, leaving the programming design short-lived. I’m surprised to hear of it now, even though it’s certainly baked into the auto start/stop processes.

I would note that i doubt aisin dictates the programming, but rather the manufacturers get to do that.
 
meep said:
Seems like GM tried the “drop to neutral at stops” thing in the 80s - I don’t remember the models, but I want to say it ended is dismal wear on one of the clutches, leaving the programming design short-lived. I’m surprised to hear of it now, even though it’s certainly baked into the auto start/stop processes.

I would note that i doubt aisin dictates the programming, but rather the manufacturers get to do that.
Click to expand...
software is mfg based for the intended program its going into.
 
The AW55-50 in my Wifes old Saab 95 used to drop into neutral when you let off the throttle while moving. Was a bit weird! Although not as weird as my 2020 BMW 5 series that would shut the engine off completely and coast, that was unnerving.

The TF71-SC in my Volvo V40's would drop into neutral when you were stopped, then quickly grab 1st as you came off the brake. It was almost seamless and a 'normal' person wouldn't probably notice.
 
The 8 speed ZF transmission, That thing seems to be in everything from trucks, SUVs to cars.
The Asisin 8 speed seems to be mostly be used by Toyota. The wiki page lists mostly European models and it's not that long anyways, so I don't think it's that popular.
But it does prove how manufacturers collaborate behind the scenes, while the fan boys argue who's "the best".
 
Gus_Mahn said:
My wife's '22 X1 has one, and it drives me nuts. It goes into neutral right before it stops moving (not auto stop/start) and while stopped. It makes a bump when you let off the brake pedal as it goes back into gear. I find myself rolling a lot of stop signs to try to drive around the issue. It makes it almost impossible to stop smoothly. It works normally if you put the shifter into sport mode, but it downshifts firmly and runs around in too low a gear. No other complaints about the way it drives.

We drove a lot of small SUV's before buying this one. She didn't want to move up to an X3. We both wanted to like Lexus but didn't. We're not entry level buyers, but it's what she liked.
Click to expand...

The X1 is probably the best in that class IMO. I know it’s not a pure bmw rwd I6 platform but it still drives well and the awd is good. But then again I have been underwhelmed by the CX5 that magazines and other try to say is so good just feels like any old small suv to me
 
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