I understand. I know you are very, very smart and know about outdoor circumstances .
I will share with you that I never considered cold water and being in a boat until I was in my early 30s.
I went out in a John boat when it was in the middle of winter in 1996. The blizzard of 1996 had taken place a week before and we had to break ice to get to open water. I never thought about flipping a boat and what could happen. That same winter I went freshwater fishing with my friends Danny and David… Ice forming on your fishing line as you reeled it in… Stupid cold. Water probably 35 degrees.
It is a real consideration and having kids in a boat is a different matter all together.
Seriously though they do make wider John boats that are really awesome. If I were looking at a boat that’s what I would want to have. Then it gives you the ability to go on larger lakes and know it will be safer.
I’d save a canoe for like small creek or small river trips aka less then 200 feet across . Like the Dragon Run which is 20-40 feet across near where I lived in Gloucester County. People did that there all the time. I did a canoe trip with my step father down the Rivanna River to the James River in 1991. That was a lot of fun.
Just to be clear, I’d never take the kids, or go myself if the water was that cold. This would probably be a May-June, and sept-October thing primarily, simply because being out in direct sun at any time of the day that’s practical (I did crew in college and afterwards, so been there done that with rowing too early and too late) and cool doesn’t exist otherwise, and in the heat of the summer, we go to our beautiful, town pool from after work until close.
Also, I’m talking town lakes and ponds. Not canoeing on the Delaware or Hudson River. And I’m not sure Id even go on a job oat on those because of the issues with smaller Jon boats and wakes….
I have been in a 17 foot Grumman square stern. It’s been years. It was a friends and he used it for fishing With a small electric motor. Both of us canoed regularly. It was pretty much a normal canoe for stability but it was extremely inefficient to actually paddle. The electric motor moved it along fine however.
I agree it was the worst of all worlds. It was unstable like a canoe but inefficient for paddle power. It’s amazing how much that rear wake sucks you backwards. I was shocked. It was also pretty heavy.
I would either get a Jon boat if you want to motorize or get a lightweight canoe if you want to paddle. If it were me. I switched to Kayaks instead.
Thats exactlynwhat I was interested in/concerned about, The Grumman sport boat is different from a square stern canoe, but looks much similar. Are you sure you weren’t in one of those? I have read that the sport boat hull design isn’t efficient for paddling. My prior experience paddling canoes hasn’t been bad, including in open water in Barnegat Bay.
Canoes get faster and more stable the longer they are. I can't say I've ever been in a square back one, but seen a few out on the lakes. If you are never portaging the canoe and don't mind a trailer, then maybe just a boat is better to putter around in those ocean bays. I would be pretty comfortable staying along the mainland shore and going up some the rivers and streams, but heading across to the sand bar and islands, wouldn't be fun if much of a west wind came up... If you want all 4 of you to go into some fresh water lakes a 17.5-18' kevlar canoe can still be 50-55lbs and carry 2 adults, 2 kids with a week or two of camping stuff, and you can put it on top of any car.
If you get into some rough water the two paddlers should have their knees on the bottom and the kids sitting on the bottom, keep your paddles in the water and you can handle pretty big waves, if they aren't breaking over the sides. A canoe course is good to take too, as there's a few techniques and habits that make it pretty easy and tipping isn't a worry. We've been in pretty rough water a few times and it was water coming over the sides was the potentially scary part, not tipping.
Stuff like the J stroke too, it makes paddling on a bigger lake even in a bit of wind, not a big deal once you get some experience.
Good feedback. Never thought about canoe courses, that’s a great idea.
I can tip a canoe just looking at it. I’m a Jon boat fan for that reason. Don’t have anything to add otherwise.
Except that jonboats that are too narrow can also be somewhat tippy, they would be almost impossible to flip back once over and you’re in the water, and the low sides make them easier to swamp. Dont get me wrong, I have tons of miles going up rivers and back down when I was coaching crew… I like them. But if I was going anyplace where tipping was an issue, say, the Delaware River up in the Poconos, or south If Philadelphia and into the Delaware bay, I don’t know that I’d run a jonboat there… a 14ft v-hull maybe… but if I was going to go to actual Rivers, I’d probably go for a 13ft tiller drive whaler.
