Snow Thrower worm gearbox lubricant?

[flatlandtacoma]

I was wondering what the proper lubricant would be for the gearbox on my snow thrower. Here is an exploded view:

I see part number 7 is an oil seal. Does that mean it takes gear oil? I have 80w90 in there now but I was wondering if it is the right stuff. My manual is completely silent on the topic. Snow Thrower is a Noma 27" two stage and is about 15 years old. Thanks in advance.

 

[Bill Kapaun]

If it doesn't leak out, you're good!

 

[Thorn]

I don't know why, but the owner's manual for my several year old Toro specifically warns against using synthetic gear oil in my gearbox. I think it calls for 80w-90.

 

[BarkerMan]

Check to see if the manufacturer calls for a non-corrosive gear oil. That would make it different from a lot of common gear oils. The bottle will state ‘non-corrosive’ if it is.
I think that the Wally World house brand gear oil is in fact non-corrosive.

 

[Mike_dup1]

I have Amsoil synthetic gear lube in my 1999 13hp Ariens since new and have used in all of them back to 1975ish. None have failed. So any company that says not to use synthetic got its head in the sand in my opinion.

Thats like saying don't use radial tires if you want better ride and handling.

 

[flatlandtacoma]

That's the thing, the manual only says
Quote:
Auger Gear Box - The auger gear box has been factory lubricated for life. If for some reason lubricant should leak out, have the auger gear case checked by a competent repairman.


The box has a single 1/4" pipe plug for filling (and draining?) It started getting a little noisy so I topped it off with some Mystik JT-7 (80w90, GL-5) I had and it quieted right down. I just wonder if it is close to the right lube or not.

 

[MolaKule]

I would recommend a 50 weight Powershift (TO-4) type oil for the wormgear, about SAE 50 weight or 18 cSt minimum.

 

[Thorn]

Originally Posted By: Mike_dup1
I have Amsoil synthetic gear lube in my 1999 13hp Ariens since new and have used in all of them back to 1975ish. None have failed. So any company that says not to use synthetic got its head in the sand in my opinion.

Thats like saying don't use radial tires if you want better ride and handling.



I'll try to check the manual for the exact wording in the next day or two and post it here. IIRC, the manual does say that synthetic oil can be used in the engine (perhaps even recommends 0w30 syn in temps below zero), but elsewhere it says NOT to use it in the gearbox.

Because they do approve of synthetic for the engine but not the gearbox, I always figured they had a reason - something more than the 30 year-old, outdated, knee-jerk reaction that synthetics are bad. Otherwise, they wouldn't have recommended it for the engine either.

 

[Mike_dup1]

Your assuming the person writing the manual even knows what oil is. I doubt some engineer is writing those manuals, they got more better things to do.

 

[Thorn]

Yeah, you're right. I should take the word of some anonymous fellow that I just met on the Internet instead.

Just kidding. I am aware that many manuals, including vehicle manuals, are often outdated and/or otherwise misinformed. It's just that the approval of syn in one area and the disapproval in another area actually made me think that maybe they put some thought into their recommendation. On the other hand, maybe the syn recommendation for the engine was written by Tecumseh, and the gearbox recommendation could've come from whomever made the gearbox for Toro.

 

[GrtArtiste]

Originally Posted By: Thorn
I don't know why, but the owner's manual for my several year old Toro specifically warns against using synthetic gear oil in my gearbox. I think it calls for 80w-90.


My 4 year old Toro 726 says the same-no synthetic gear oil.

 

[flatlandtacoma]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
I would recommend a 50 weight Powershift (TO-4) type oil for the wormgear, about SAE 50 weight or 18 cSt minimum.


Thanks Mola! I googled around for this and found Pennzoil POWER-TRANZ®, Mystik TENAX ®, Amsoil Synthetic Powershift, Schaeffer #239A or #239S Super CAT Lube, Citgo TRANSGARD® Heavy Duty, and Cat® TDTO™. Unfortunately it seems to be available special order in a minimum quantity of 5 gallons.

My gearbox only holds a few ounces.

Not trying to sound too ingracious here, would you have a second choice if the above spec'd fluid wasn't available?

 

[BarkerMan]

Be careful about taking a mechanic's advice about lubricants. For the most part their recommendations are not based on knowledge or facts. Some are very good but most are not only give bad advice but actually can cause harm with their recommendations.

I don't know MolaKule but but his advice in this situation in right on the button. We use such a product called Final Drive. We have a worm gear drive and followed the advice of a service center and had two failures. I did some research, found Final drive and products like it and that was the end of the problem. The service center warned me that using a non approved product would void the warranty. Now they too use Final Drive. Ours is a 60 weight but 50 weight is probably the right viscosity for your application.

 

[benjamming]

Originally Posted By: BarkerMan
I don't know MolaKule but but his advice in this situation in right on the button.


Molakule is a formulating chemist and started Specialty Formulations. He won't lead you astray. Brains AND experience it seems in one package.

 

[BarkerMan]

Mr. MolaKule, have you retired?

 

[Bror Jace]

"Because they do approve of synthetic for the engine but not the gearbox, I always figured they had a reason - something more than the 30 year-old, outdated, knee-jerk reaction that synthetics are bad."

I still think that's the reason for half of the nonsense in the OPE manuals when it comes to oils/lubricants. "No-synthetic" recomendations simple do not make any sense anymore ... and this has been true for at least a decade.

"I should take the word of some anonymous fellow that I just met on the Internet instead?"

As long as that anonymous fellow doesn't offer you naked pictures of himself, why not?

Seriously, these worm gear boxes on snow blowers are pretty simple things and the recommendations out there can be pretty "out there."

Dad has a 20+ year old John Deere 1032 (10hp, 32" path) and they recommend a straight 20 weight oil (sold by JD, of course) for the unit. I've been running "whatever" gear oil in the thing for well over a decade and it seems fine. The machine is thoroughly abused and the one part that doesn't seem to complain is the auger. The engine block has stripped threads holding various components on it and the case is cracking a second time aftre being welded the first time. This machine is old and has a rough life ... I even replaced the main drive axle once and the auger's bushings a few times. One or two more seasons and it's heading for the scrap heap ... but that auger box still seems great.

I went nuts a few years ago looking for gear oil for the new Ariens snowblower auger diff ... and settled on Red Line 80W-140 for the unit which is probably fine. Not sure if that machine will even get used in the next year or two but I might get the chance to drain it out after 100 hours or so to see how much metal is in it. (BTW, Dave Granquist of Red Line recommended 75W-90 Shockproof for this application).

If you want to be sure you are getting a non-corrosive gear oil, I'd use something labelled GL4. Cheapest ones I've seen are Coastal gear oils available from Advance Auto Parts.

 

[flatlandtacoma]

Originally Posted By: Bror Jace
If you want to be sure you are getting a non-corrosive gear oil, I'd use something labelled GL4.


So would that include:
For API Gear Lubricant Service: GL-2* , GL-3*, GL-4, GL-5, GL-6*, MT-1
* Non-active specifications

Those are the specs on the JT-7 I have in there now.

 

[Bror Jace]

Yes, those would be the certifications I would look for.

What is JT-7??

 

[flatlandtacoma]

Sorry, Mystik JT-7

 

[H2GURU]

That exploded view looks similar to one used by Ariens. For that set-up they use:
ARIENS part #000072
Semi-Fluid
N.L.G.I. No. 00
Lithium E. P.
Complex grease

It looks like "NEVER SEIZE" mixed with a few drops of motor oil.You can't over-fill, so use with abandon !