QSAD 5W20 VOA Bottled 2/25/16

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This oil came out of a 5 quart jug with a February 25, 2016 bottling date. It went into my Taurus recently and is my fourth consecutive time using this oil (QSGB/QSAD). When I get the results for my UOA of the oil I recently drained, I suspect it will show the same additive package as this. Not too impressive to look at but... While I still like this oil, it is clearly different from my first two oci's of use. Instead of my engine being silent from inside the car (windows up), it is now audible until the oil gets warmed. It becomes fairly quiet after 12-15 miles of driving. There's never "noise" or clatter, just the hum of a V6 engine going about it's business. I suppose that's a good case of the add-pack getting activated. Please understand that when I say my engine is silent/fairly quiet from inside the car, I'm speaking of low rpm and light/medium load. Typically, it's operated under 1,500 rpm with steep hills requiring as much as 2,200 rpm. Quaker State Advanced Durability 5W20 (analysis by ALS Tribology,Atlanta) Iron 0 Chromium 0 Lead 0 Copper 2 Tin 2 Aluminum 2 Nickel 0 Silver 0 Titanium 0 Vanadium 0 Silicon 4 Sodium 12 Potassium 0 Water <0.05% Magnesium 3 Calcium 1863 Barium 0 Phosphorus 609 Zinc 764 Moly 153 Boron 85 Viscosity cSt @ 100C 8.5 Viscosity cSt @ 40C 50.5 TBN 6.6 (yes, that's what it says) I took the liberty to change the <1 that ALS uses to 0's.
 
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wemay, thanks for linking the PQIA test. That was the reason I tried the QSGB in the first place and was so happy with this oil. I knew something was different but it's still doing fine once the oil gets some heat in it. If PQIA should happen to test this oil again and it still has good viscometrics, I may stick with it. Otherwise, I can see myself maybe trying something different. I sure wish QS had left it alone.
 
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Something had to give since Walmart and Firestone are using it for their standard service now. Not saying it's bad oil, but it has crossed my mind that there is a good probability that some penny pinching is going on now.
 
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I wouldn't be terribly concerned. We always have different tests by different labs, and the VOA can only tell you so much. A VOA is best for preparing for a trended analysis program, not for comparing whether one formulation is better than another, and that's assuming there's actually been a change.
 
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Garak, do you ever tire of being level headed and sensible? thumbsup I posted the voa numbers immediately after opening the email from ALS and was quite disappointed at the time. It just looks like a drop in detergents and the tbn was surprisingly low (to me). I'm sure that the oil that I just drained was of the same formula because the engine became audible from inside the car last September when I put it in. I'm waiting for the uoa results to arrive but I expect it to be fine. I just got a good feeling with the previous formulation as it was so quiet (from inside the car) at any temperature. This new stuff has to warm up first. To be fair, the sound was consistent throughout the entire 5,500 miles. That's more than I can say about other oils I had used previously in the same car.
 
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Well, you never know what method they're using for TBN, either. One can get different numbers, and that's why certain labs also have different condemnation levels. And believe me, I'm as guilty of staring at VOAs and having ideas run through my head as the next guy here. I know that a VOA is most useful when starting a trended UOA plan, using the same oil and the same lab. That doesn't stop me from poking my nose into this section and reading every new post, and wondering about changes, or seeing levels where I "don't think" they should be. I've seen several examples here where people ran the exact same oil at more than one different lab, and came out with significantly different numbers. So, we do need to exhibit some caution with the results, and like I said, stick with one lab for one VOA and trended UOA combination. And, we have to watch what we glean from the information, too.
 
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I'm trying to stay with one oil (QSGB) and I have loaded up on NAPA kits going to ALS Tribology labs. Happy with both so far. My ALS test results match my older Blackstone uoa's so there was consistency in that aspect. I thought that ALS used the ASTM D4739 method but now I can't find that info to say for sure. They may use the D2896 method on new oil and D4739 for used oil. Sorry I can't say for sure. I tested the QSGB because I knew something was different last September and figured that I should get a fresh voa if I were to keep using it.
 
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Originally Posted By: smithph
Question for the guru's... Does the lower boron equate to more noise?
At the risk of getting pummeled by the formulators, I will say my opinion (based on my oil experiences) is the Boron does have an effect. This thread was started because I could hear a difference in sound level inside my car while using the same brand and viscosity oil. The newer QSGB oil has much less boron and it corresponds with a different sound level. Previously, I couldn't hear my engine from inside the car, now I can. Not loud, but it's there. My other observation was when I had a Volvo truck with a D11 engine. That engine had a considerable amount of chatter coming from the massive geartrain, when idling or easing across a parking lot at low load. Delo 400LE with 500-600 ppm of boron, absolutely quieted the chatter from day one until it was drained 20k miles later. No other oils had that effect. I obviously can't prove that the Boron was the reason for either of my examples but if not, what a coincidence. I'm not a guru...just my experiences.
 
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Originally Posted By: dustyroads
I tested the QSGB because I knew something was different last September and figured that I should get a fresh voa if I were to keep using it.
That seems sensible to me. Now, you have a VOA going forward again.
 

MolaKule

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Originally Posted By: dustyroads
Originally Posted By: smithph
Question for the guru's... Does the lower boron equate to more noise?
At the risk of getting pummeled by the formulators, I will say my opinion (based on my oil experiences) is the Boron does have an effect. This thread was started because I could hear a difference in sound level inside my car while using the same brand and viscosity oil. The newer QSGB oil has much less boron and it corresponds with a different sound level. Previously, I couldn't hear my engine from inside the car, now I can. Not loud, but it's there. My other observation was when I had a Volvo truck with a D11 engine. That engine had a considerable amount of chatter coming from the massive geartrain, when idling or easing across a parking lot at low load. Delo 400LE with 500-600 ppm of boron, absolutely quieted the chatter from day one until it was drained 20k miles later. No other oils had that effect. I obviously can't prove that the Boron was the reason for either of my examples but if not, what a coincidence. I'm not a guru...just my experiences.
I would suspect it is a coincidence. There are just too many variables in an oil that could account for slightly higher noise levels. For example, the base oils used are mixes of at least two or more base types and base oil viscosities. For example, if the lower viscosity oil in the mix predominates then there could be a more pronounced engine noise. Boron is a cold temp AW and FM and would have little affect on engine noise.
 
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Originally Posted By: dustyroads
Originally Posted By: smithph
Question for the guru's... Does the lower boron equate to more noise?
At the risk of getting pummeled by the formulators, I will say my opinion (based on my oil experiences) is the Boron does have an effect. This thread was started because I could hear a difference in sound level inside my car while using the same brand and viscosity oil. The newer QSGB oil has much less boron and it corresponds with a different sound level. Previously, I couldn't hear my engine from inside the car, now I can. Not loud, but it's there. My other observation was when I had a Volvo truck with a D11 engine. That engine had a considerable amount of chatter coming from the massive geartrain, when idling or easing across a parking lot at low load. Delo 400LE with 500-600 ppm of boron, absolutely quieted the chatter from day one until it was drained 20k miles later. No other oils had that effect. I obviously can't prove that the Boron was the reason for either of my examples but if not, what a coincidence. I'm not a guru...just my experiences.
I would suspect it is a coincidence. There are just too many variables in an oil that could account for slightly higher noise levels. For example, the base oils used are mixes of at least two or more base types and base oil viscosities. For example, if the lower viscosity oil in the mix predominates then there could be a more pronounced engine noise. Boron is a cold temp AW and FM and would have little affect on engine noise.
Thanks Molakule! I assure you that there are many others who have the same train of thought as I expressed and will appreciate your comments here. Having read your white paper on Boron additives, I was aware of the cold temp AW/FM benefits and actually seek out oils using the additive. I'm due for a reread. However, as an average guy observing a difference in engine sounds, I can't help but think that the more Boron, the better. I'm guessing that you would say that isn't the case. Again, thank you for commenting in a friendly sort of way!. thumbsup
 
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Originally Posted By: BigD1
Very similar to Formula Shell. I have a jug of the Formula Shell 10W-30 going in next oil change for my Volvo. Got it for $9.88 a jug during a recent Home Depot sale. http://www.pqiadata.org/FormulaShell10W30.html
Yeah, QSGB and Formula Shell have always "looked" the same on paper with regard to additive packages. It appears that they have made the same changes in both brands. Thanks for the link!
 
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I value Molakules advice but I feel that boron does help with seals and possibly quieter engines. Just my in educated mechanic brain thinking
 
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well as I have said in the past , I have a 04 hyundai sonata with 277k on it ran on QSGB since it was new now you have me thinking .........................................................................
 
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