more PSD woes with cold weather

Messages
1,332
Location
oh
You need to find another fuel supply, the additive is useless unless fuel is above the cloud-point when added (between 32f-20 f). If you are adding a fuel additive below the cloud-point you're wasting your money as it can't blend correctly with the fuel.
 
Messages
16,429
Location
NH
I agree, the only time I had my TDi gel was when I used a fuel station that likely had a poor turnover rate (it was in Concord proper but I doubt trucks filled there that often). Might just have to drive the extra mile for the cold months I'm afraid (and it makes you wonder what else that fuel is lacking in for quality).
 
Messages
4,679
Location
Lakeville, MN
Starting to sound not so far fetched there is some bad diesel being distributed in that area... To the OP, I'd make sure to mention, if you had not already, that you are having trouble to the fuel supplier. They hear it enough, some real investigation might actually happen. Still surprising that a region that isn't that unusual to get cold sounds like they are getting bum fuel...
 
Messages
655
Location
Minnesota
That's weird. I've been using Opti-Lube XPD in my VW Golf TDI with the CR 2.0 motor. It's been negative digits the past few days and she fires right up. I actually didn't use any in my current tank (forgot to bring it when I fueled up) and it's been fine. Wonder if you just have some bad diesel. I know one tank I got from a not so busy station I had some weird missing issues. On the highway it felt like the engine was missing randomly and I'd lose 1-200 RPM for a split second.
 
Messages
24,626
Location
Upstate NY
Thread starter
I got the fuel from a new Cumberland Farms station :(Cumbies). They sell a lot of gas, unsure how much diesel. Not setup for tractor trailers.
 
Messages
24,626
Location
Upstate NY
Thread starter
911 is alcohol based. You must use it carefully. Owner's manual for my PSD says no alcohol based winterizer.
 
Messages
28,129
Location
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
Interesting. I've been putting nothing in our diesel's fuel at all. Petro-Canada sells "winter diesel" and that's what we've been buying. No issues, even when it was -26C shrug
Yes, it is kind of odd. My dad had everything from more than one iteration of the Powerstroke to GM 6.2 to Caterpillar agricultural equipment, used down to -40 and worse, with just ordinary winter diesel.
 
Messages
28,129
Location
Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted by fdcg27
Our old fully mechanical Mercedes 240Ds were never a problem in cold weather, if you could get them started.
Back in the day here, people were fond of plumbing in some inline coolant circulating heaters to various Benz diesel models to the point they began to enclose some Mercedes specific instructions in the packaging. wink Donald: The tip that always works best for diesels is fill up where the truckers fill up. That way, you know you're getting fresh fuel and fuel that probably isn't going to debilitate the vehicle, aside from the rare cases when a storage tank is incorrectly filled.
 
Messages
24,626
Location
Upstate NY
Thread starter
I have been emailing the fuel companies and asking how low a temperature will their fuel still be usable. Shell has said -18C at least in the Albany NY / Western MA area. A local fuel oil company owner said the diesel he buys for his own trucks has gelled invrecent cold weather and he has dumped in extra kerosene. But for an individual, the kerosene available available (for kerosene heaters) is dyed heating fuel and not taxed.
 

dnewton3

Staff member
Messages
8,460
Location
Indianapolis, IN
I have used Power Service White Bottle successfully for decades; started using it back in 1986 with my first diesel car (Tempo). I have used it my my tractors for years. I have had no issues with it down to -17F in my Dmax and my Kubota. I suspect it's NOT a problem with the additive IF the fuel is a proper winter blend. However, if the fuel is not properly blended, it may ultimately affect the ability of the additive to do it's job. When it was -17F a few years ago here (real temp, not windchill), not only did my Dmax (common rail) and Kubota (mech injection) both start, but they did so with no hesitations or stumbles, and after a gentle warm up for a few minutes, drove away just fine with no fuel issues. So if your fuel is a proper winter blend, and you've added the right amount of PS WB, then I cannot expect it's the additive. But if the fuel is NOT the right blend, it's cause for concern. Regarding the red bottle 911 from Power Service, I don't think it would hurt, but I'd call them and ask. And specifically, I believe 911 is essentially a product to give relief of fuel that is frozen due to moisture being in the fuel; the alcohol relieves the frozen water crystals. But, if the fuel is not blended correctly for a winter application, I'm not sure that the 911 will address this. I am not 100% sure of this; that's why I suggest calling them and asking prior to adding it. But it seems to me I had this conversation with them several years ago; I had called them with a question about their biocide and got into a side topic conversation about the 911 product. They have a very helpful tech-line group; or at least they did a while back. When reviewing their website info for the 911 product, it clearly states that it's safe to use and will not void OEM warranties if used as directed. Ford has a statement to not use alcohol based products. So there's a bit of a disconnect between them. I would defer to the PowerSerivce folks for detailed info. The PS 911 product states it will re-liquefy gelled fuel, but it also states it will not prevent fuel from gelling. Not sure why there's a distinction there. From Ford's perspective, you might even call your Ford dealer and ask them what to use; maybe they have a recommended product? "Alcohol", as we know, is a very large and broad term. There are many different kinds of alcohol. Perhaps the Ford statement is just a catch-all warning because going into the weeds in an owner's manual would be too much to digest, and given their nearly schizophrenic approach to additives and lubes .....( ala don't use CK-4, but you can use anything on our approved list, which includes a bunch of CK-4 lubes )... I am not sure they'd be able to give you a detailed answer anyway. MAYBE there are products that use alcohol that are much less harmful, or OK to use only in extreme circumstances. And this is why I'd defer to the PS folks and shy away from Ford's advice, as they have a habit of throwing out blanket statements and then not only violating their own advice, but being mum as to why/how they make these decisions in the first place. i would call PS and speak to them again, giving them all the details and concerns, and ask about what product(s) to use. The other things to mention are checking the install of the filters from the recent changes. Also try to get some fuel from a high-volume source that has winter blends; as suggested from others maybe a truck stop that's not too far away?
 
Last edited:
Messages
3,566
Location
Somewhere
Originally Posted by Donald
I have been emailing the fuel companies and asking how low a temperature will their fuel still be usable. Shell has said -18C at least in the Albany NY / Western MA area. A local fuel oil company owner said the diesel he buys for his own trucks has gelled invrecent cold weather and he has dumped in extra kerosene. But for an individual, the kerosene available available (for kerosene heaters) is dyed heating fuel and not taxed.
Can you check other places for Kerosene? Last time (a year or so ago) I bought Kerosene from the convenience store pump it was crystal clear. That was in PA though so it may be different up in NY. Would one of those gallon jug of Kerosene from Home Depot or Lowes work? They are pricey but you may not need much to get that bad tank of Diesel out.
 
Messages
4,679
Location
Lakeville, MN
Where do the medium and heavy duty trucks fill up in your area? Any decent, high volume diesel retailers in the area (truck stops for example?) In the winter, try to buy diesel there - better odds of getting properly winterized diesel and not a bunch of older stuff in th tank.
 
Messages
16,429
Location
NH
K2 for heaters would be pricey but should be crystal clear. But, for me, I'd be leery of putting in K2 into a modern diesel, fears of (lost) lubricity would be dancing in my head.
 
Messages
24,626
Location
Upstate NY
Thread starter
Originally Posted by supton
K2 for heaters would be pricey but should be crystal clear. But, for me, I'd be leery of putting in K2 into a modern diesel, fears of (lost) lubricity would be dancing in my head.
All winter diesel is blended with kerosene. Stewart's Shop said they are using 20% kerosene.
 
Messages
24,626
Location
Upstate NY
Thread starter
So I was told I should be asking what the CFPP is (cold filter plug point) is rather that just " how could a temp can I use your diesel fuel at"? Pride Stations in Western MA says -16F
 
Messages
1,332
Location
oh
We were at -18F here a couple days ago and I had to unexpectantly run my 6.7, so no block heater was plugged in. No fuel or starting issues here in NW OH. My youngest son had ignored advise to leave his water drip and had frozen water line in crawl space. If you're running Motor Craft filters then your fuel supply is suspect.
 
Messages
24,626
Location
Upstate NY
Thread starter
Originally Posted by roadrunner1
We were at -18F here a couple days ago and I had to unexpectantly run my 6.7, so no block heater was plugged in. No fuel or starting issues here in NW OH. My youngest son had ignored advise to leave his water drip and had frozen water line in crawl space. If you're running Motor Craft filters then your fuel supply is suspect.
Letting water drip can help or make things worse. If part of the sewer pipe is exposed to freezing weather as it might be in a drawl space letting water drip can cause ice to form and eventually block the sewer line. I left a large chunk of ice in my kitchen sink where the sewer line is exposed to freezing in the crawl space before going underground. The drip drip drip of the ice melting caused the sewer line to freeze with ice. A real PIA.
 
Top