GM 2.8 Duramax - Delvac ESP 5w40 CJ-4 - 5300 miles

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This is my 3rd oil change and 2nd run using some of the old PAO based CJ-4 Delvac ESP I got in ‘15 for $8 a gallon after MIR. Vehicle is a 2017 GMC Canyon 4x4 CCLB w/ 2.8 duramax. 70% freeway / 30% city. 11,700 miles on truck and 5,300 on oil. Normal driving, sometimes with a payload of less than 1,000 #. Sometimes I take trips to the mountains, switchbacks and steep grades. I use the exhaust brake and manual shift the transmission to engine brake on these drives, about once per month. This is the hardest it’s been driven, no towing yet. Fueled exclusively with HVO dosed with Stanadyne PF @ 500:1 ratio. Changed oil early this time cause I had fuel dilution in my previous UOA FD looks like it’s under control now. Refilled with RLI BioSyn Homebrew 10w40. There is a thread on this oil I made in the VOA sub-forum. Overall the D1 ESP looks like it did really well, however there was some valvetrain noise at startup which I didn’t like which is why the BioSyn went in this time.
 
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dnewton3

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very nice for such a young engine; break in going well. you can go much further on the lube than 5k miles ... are you following the IOLM?
 
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Originally Posted By: dnewton3
very nice for such a young engine; break in going well. you can go much further on the lube than 5k miles ... are you following the IOLM?
No IOLM isn’t very intelligent in the truck. I think it said ~ 30 ish % when I changed it. Changed early due to the FD issue and I didnt want any stanadyne in the crankcase. I think you could go more than 10k on this oil, maybe 15k which is two of the recommended OCIs, there is still lots of TBN left.
 
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Originally Posted By: Shannow
If it's the same OLM as in my 2016 Colorado, it changes recommendation massively depending on driving style.
That may be the case, however it is calibrated for a Dexos 2 oil, which isn’t what I’m using. With a real HDEO like this D1, I believe you could go much longer than what it says @ 0%.
 
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Originally Posted By: edyvw
Did you take down DPF? If not, this oil will damage DPF much faster then lower SAPS oils like Mobil1 5W30 ESP.
Nope emissions system is fully intact and under warranty. It will not damage the DPF. The sulfated ash value is only 25% higher with CJ-4 oil vs. Dexos 2. Oil related Ash loading to the DPF is very minor unless your burn oil or have leaking turbo seals. It is insignificant. The extra P may have an effect on the SCR system but it would take many miles and years for that to happen. I don't believe it's a real issue if you use oils with low NOACK and/or install a catch can. I'd rather protect my engine with a quality oil then use a Mid-saps offering or Dexos 2. Thanks for your concern.
 
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Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Did you take down DPF? If not, this oil will damage DPF much faster then lower SAPS oils like Mobil1 5W30 ESP.
Nope emissions system is fully intact and under warranty. It will not damage the DPF. The sulfated ash value is only 25% higher with CJ-4 oil vs. Dexos 2. Oil related Ash loading to the DPF is very minor unless your burn oil or have leaking turbo seals. It is insignificant. The extra P may have an effect on the SCR system but it would take many miles and years for that to happen. I don't believe it's a real issue if you use oils with low NOACK and/or install a catch can. I'd rather protect my engine with a quality oil then use a Mid-saps offering or Dexos 2. Thanks for your concern.
So Delvac ESP is quality oil, but Mid-SAPS and Low-SAPS are not? Geez. Well it is GM, it might need all possible protection. Others just make engines that can last longer, even on Mid-SAPS or Low-SAPS I guess.
 
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Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Did you take down DPF? If not, this oil will damage DPF much faster then lower SAPS oils like Mobil1 5W30 ESP.
Nope emissions system is fully intact and under warranty. It will not damage the DPF. The sulfated ash value is only 25% higher with CJ-4 oil vs. Dexos 2. Oil related Ash loading to the DPF is very minor unless your burn oil or have leaking turbo seals. It is insignificant. The extra P may have an effect on the SCR system but it would take many miles and years for that to happen. I don't believe it's a real issue if you use oils with low NOACK and/or install a catch can. I'd rather protect my engine with a quality oil then use a Mid-saps offering or Dexos 2. Thanks for your concern.
So Delvac ESP is quality oil, but Mid-SAPS and Low-SAPS are not? Geez. Well it is GM, it might need all possible protection. Others just make engines that can last longer, even on Mid-SAPS or Low-SAPS I guess.
Actually, if you've seen some of the UOAs from this new engine from folks posted on the forums using C3 or Dexos 2 oils, you'd see how much of a difference my last 2 analysis are from the norm. I've seen reports from Amsoil AEL, Castrol, AcDelco, Total Quartz Ineo and PP Euro L among others and none of them have wear numbers like I'm seeing with CJ-4 ESP. Not even close. There is clearly a difference using a "real" low-ash HDEO. And FYI, GM Duramax Diesels are excellent products, including this new 2.8. The 6.6 and Allison is the best powertrain available in light duty trucks. GM was also the first to pioneer the "9th Injector" for DPF regeneration. They have their $hit together as far as engineering goes in these applications. GM cars do suck, I'm not going to lie about that. However their trucks/vans and commercial vehicles are the best in class.
 
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Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Did you take down DPF? If not, this oil will damage DPF much faster then lower SAPS oils like Mobil1 5W30 ESP.
Nope emissions system is fully intact and under warranty. It will not damage the DPF. The sulfated ash value is only 25% higher with CJ-4 oil vs. Dexos 2. Oil related Ash loading to the DPF is very minor unless your burn oil or have leaking turbo seals. It is insignificant. The extra P may have an effect on the SCR system but it would take many miles and years for that to happen. I don't believe it's a real issue if you use oils with low NOACK and/or install a catch can. I'd rather protect my engine with a quality oil then use a Mid-saps offering or Dexos 2. Thanks for your concern.
So Delvac ESP is quality oil, but Mid-SAPS and Low-SAPS are not? Geez. Well it is GM, it might need all possible protection. Others just make engines that can last longer, even on Mid-SAPS or Low-SAPS I guess.
Actually, if you've seen some of the UOAs from this new engine from folks posted on the forums using C3 or Dexos 2 oils, you'd see how much of a difference my last 2 analysis are from the norm. I've seen reports from Amsoil AEL, Castrol, AcDelco, Total Quartz Ineo and PP Euro L among others and none of them have wear numbers like I'm seeing with CJ-4 ESP. Not even close. There is clearly a difference using a "real" low-ash HDEO. And FYI, GM Duramax Diesels are excellent products, including this new 2.8. The 6.6 and Allison is the best powertrain available in light duty trucks. GM was also the first to pioneer the "9th Injector" for DPF regeneration. They have their $hit together as far as engineering goes in these applications. GM cars do suck, I'm not going to lie about that. However their trucks/vans and commercial vehicles are the best in class.
I'm thinking of doing the same thing. Did your regens shorten? Mine come in around 250 miles every time. Just wondering if this affects regens in any way. I also installed a provent and have been pulling a fair amount of oil out of it. Thanks for any insight! Michael
 
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Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Did you take down DPF? If not, this oil will damage DPF much faster then lower SAPS oils like Mobil1 5W30 ESP.
Nope emissions system is fully intact and under warranty. It will not damage the DPF. The sulfated ash value is only 25% higher with CJ-4 oil vs. Dexos 2. Oil related Ash loading to the DPF is very minor unless your burn oil or have leaking turbo seals. It is insignificant. The extra P may have an effect on the SCR system but it would take many miles and years for that to happen. I don't believe it's a real issue if you use oils with low NOACK and/or install a catch can. I'd rather protect my engine with a quality oil then use a Mid-saps offering or Dexos 2. Thanks for your concern.
So Delvac ESP is quality oil, but Mid-SAPS and Low-SAPS are not? Geez. Well it is GM, it might need all possible protection. Others just make engines that can last longer, even on Mid-SAPS or Low-SAPS I guess.
Actually, if you've seen some of the UOAs from this new engine from folks posted on the forums using C3 or Dexos 2 oils, you'd see how much of a difference my last 2 analysis are from the norm. I've seen reports from Amsoil AEL, Castrol, AcDelco, Total Quartz Ineo and PP Euro L among others and none of them have wear numbers like I'm seeing with CJ-4 ESP. Not even close. There is clearly a difference using a "real" low-ash HDEO. And FYI, GM Duramax Diesels are excellent products, including this new 2.8. The 6.6 and Allison is the best powertrain available in light duty trucks. GM was also the first to pioneer the "9th Injector" for DPF regeneration. They have their $hit together as far as engineering goes in these applications. GM cars do suck, I'm not going to lie about that. However their trucks/vans and commercial vehicles are the best in class.
So are you saying all those small diesels that are doing hundreds of thousands of miles in Europe running on C3 are bad? IDK, my brother has fleet of VW's, PSA cars, all diesels in business he owns in Europe, and they all racking 400-500,000 miles on C3 oils. But apparently, Duramax cannot. And as far as I know, 2.8ltr is VM engine. Nothing wrong with them, I had them before. Though considering issues with V6 in FCA products, it could be that heavier oils and higher SPAS can hide some engineering issues.
 
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Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
FD looks like it’s under control now.
I would mention, that test was performed on a Spectro machine, probably on either the Micro or Minilab. They never get fuel dilution correct, on these machines as they are using IR signatures for the reading. If the FD in real life is over 5%, then it will begin to pick it up to a degree. You might consider a more accurate testing source in the future to see the true FD %. I think a lot of people don't understand the Spectro machines are made to be accurate but to a degree and they're primarily meant to be portable usable in the roughest situations, they are the Toughbook of oil analysis. For example, a Navy SDV(seal delivery vehicle) where the primary concern is will it blow up on this mission or not. Where as for something like this truck, you're looking at making changes to the regime based on accuracy, I doubt you're worried about it exploding. Also, it takes the Navy 4-5 weeks to get oil samples to the lab! So they use 2 sets of samples, the first to tell them on site if the machine is in imminent danger and the second to the real lab to fine tune the machine. Shell does the same thing for Ferrari. Just something to think about for next time.
 
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Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
And FYI, GM Duramax Diesels are excellent products, including this new 2.8. The 6.6 and Allison is the best powertrain available in light duty trucks. GM was also the first to pioneer the "9th Injector" for DPF regeneration. They have their $hit together as far as engineering goes in these applications.
Yeah, Italian firm VM Motori did a pretty good job eh ?
Originally Posted By: MichaelArch
Did your regens shorten? Mine come in around 250 miles every time. Just wondering if this affects regens in any way. I also installed a provent and have been pulling a fair amount of oil out of it. Thanks for any insight!
18,000+km on my Colorado 2.8 and the regen light hasn't come on once.
 
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Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
And FYI, GM Duramax Diesels are excellent products, including this new 2.8. The 6.6 and Allison is the best powertrain available in light duty trucks. GM was also the first to pioneer the "9th Injector" for DPF regeneration. They have their $hit together as far as engineering goes in these applications.
Yeah, Italian firm VM Motori did a pretty good job eh ?
Originally Posted By: MichaelArch
Did your regens shorten? Mine come in around 250 miles every time. Just wondering if this affects regens in any way. I also installed a provent and have been pulling a fair amount of oil out of it. Thanks for any insight!
18,000+km on my Colorado 2.8 and the regen light hasn't come on once.
Thank you! And this is with an HDEO? Which are you using? Thanks again!
 
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Originally Posted By: MichaelArch
I'm thinking of doing the same thing. Did your regens shorten? Mine come in around 250 miles every time. Just wondering if this affects regens in any way. I also installed a provent and have been pulling a fair amount of oil out of it. Thanks for any insight! Michael
Hi Michael, Switching to an HDEO will not have any measurable effect on your regen frequency or interval. Fuel quality, engine load and driving style are the biggest factors in determining your soot loading to the DPF. You should try using a quality fuel additive that boosts cetane to 50-55 CN and/or contains catalysts to enhance combustion and reduce smoke. It may also give you a couple extra MPGs as well. There is also a aftermarket tune for the 2.8 Duramax which reduces EGR flow, and fueling. This tune will also reduce your regen interval as less soot is generated.
 
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Originally Posted By: edyvw
So are you saying all those small diesels that are doing hundreds of thousands of miles in Europe running on C3 are bad? IDK, my brother has fleet of VW's, PSA cars, all diesels in business he owns in Europe, and they all racking 400-500,000 miles on C3 oils. But apparently, Duramax cannot. And as far as I know, 2.8ltr is VM engine. Nothing wrong with them, I had them before. Though considering issues with V6 in FCA products, it could be that heavier oils and higher SPAS can hide some engineering issues.
You're making a logical fallacy with this statement. No modern light duty truck is spec'd with a C3 oil. FCA tried it with the Ecodiesel and it was an utter failure. All light duty trucks are spec'd with CJ-4 or CK-4 as they are appropriate oils for the application. It's not hiding an engineering shortcoming because you're using something suited for it's purpose. In my opinion, GM decided to spec C3 due to CAFE while still conforming to other Dexos 2 applications across the product line. The fact that there hasn't been numerous engine failures, like the Ecodiesel with C3 shows how well the engine is designed. I have mentioned this before on here, but I will say it again. The 2.8 Duramax is not a VM engine. GM made a number of changes the the A428 to solve it's shortcomings and make it more robust for a truck application. -New Cylinder Head -Bottom End Modifications -Smaller VGT Turbo -Denso CR Solenoid Injection -EGR, DOC, DPF, SCR -Etc.... One of the well known tuners for the VM A428 called the new 2.8 Duramax a "ground-up redesign". It is also made in a GM plant in Malaysia. So no, it is not a VM engine. Not at all.
 
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Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
And FYI, GM Duramax Diesels are excellent products, including this new 2.8. The 6.6 and Allison is the best powertrain available in light duty trucks. GM was also the first to pioneer the "9th Injector" for DPF regeneration. They have their $hit together as far as engineering goes in these applications.
Yeah, Italian firm VM Motori did a pretty good job eh ?
Originally Posted By: MichaelArch
Did your regens shorten? Mine come in around 250 miles every time. Just wondering if this affects regens in any way. I also installed a provent and have been pulling a fair amount of oil out of it. Thanks for any insight!
18,000+km on my Colorado 2.8 and the regen light hasn't come on once.
We don't have a Regen light on our NA trucks. Regens are seamless and mostly unnoticeable, except for the RPMs will be ~ 950 RPMs and the fuel economy will drop off. However, there is a warning light that comes on if you're a short tripper and the DPF gets loaded with soot, kinda like "Keep driving to clean DPF" or something but that is a last resort warning before it goes into limp mode. I've never seen it either. I have mentioned this before on here, but I will say it again. The 2.8 Duramax is not a VM engine. GM made a number of changes the the A428 to solve it's shortcomings and make it more robust for a truck application. -New Cylinder Head -Bottom End Modifications -Smaller VGT Turbo -Denso CR Solenoid Injection -EGR, DOC, DPF, SCR -Etc.... One of the well known tuners for the VM A428 called the new 2.8 Duramax a "ground-up redesign". It is also made in a GM plant in Malaysia.
 
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Of course they called it a "ground up redesign"...it's got a "Duramax" badge. The LDV T10, the Jeeps, and all the other vehicles don't get the Duramax badge. RE "Not a VM"... http://www.vmmotori.com/a-428-dohc/automotive-en/4-cilindri/a-428-dohcen.html http://www.vmmotori.com/images/data_sheet/A428_DOHC-NEW.pdf Same 148KW and 500Nm as my Duramax...made in Asia...do GM pay licence fees ? Our Korean made Captiva has a 2.0 GM engine in it...still a VM...although Holden do the recalls. Here's what someone who isn't an aftermarket tuner said. https://jalopnik.com/how-the-chevy-colorado-diesel-was-americanized-its-mor-1734799892 Re the keep driving, workmates see it on theirs, and the manual that I test drove did it a mile out of etting it back to the dealer.
 
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Originally Posted By: Shannow
Of course they called it a "ground up redesign"...it's got a "Duramax" badge. The LDV T10, the Jeeps, and all the other vehicles don't get the Duramax badge. RE "Not a VM"... http://www.vmmotori.com/a-428-dohc/automotive-en/4-cilindri/a-428-dohcen.html http://www.vmmotori.com/images/data_sheet/A428_DOHC-NEW.pdf Same 148KW and 500Nm as my Duramax...made in Asia...do GM pay licence fees ? Our Korean made Captiva has a 2.0 GM engine in it...still a VM...although Holden do the recalls. Here's what someone who isn't an aftermarket tuner said. https://jalopnik.com/how-the-chevy-colorado-diesel-was-americanized-its-mor-1734799892 Re the keep driving, workmates see it on theirs, and the manual that I test drove did it a mile out of etting it back to the dealer.
GM owns the rights to the A428. It was acquired when they were part owner of VM. GM can alter it as they see fit, which they have done. The 2.8 Duramax and the 2.5 Duramax are both GM engines. They are both based on the A428 which has been redesigned and are built by GM. My guess is that the new 3.0L I-6 Duramax in the 2019 GM 1500 trucks is also based off of the A428 as well. Does this also make it an A428 ? Our NA trucks are not rated at 148 KW. This is a good article, it is more accurate and has the detail you're looking for: https://www.dieselworldmag.com/gm/%EF%BB%BFfirst-look-%EF%BB%BFgms-2-8l-duramax/ I could see the keep drving message coming on while doing a test drive. The dealer cars are test driven short distances, so a full regen cycle could probably never get completed.
 
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Originally Posted By: CleverUserName
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Of course they called it a "ground up redesign"...it's got a "Duramax" badge. The LDV T10, the Jeeps, and all the other vehicles don't get the Duramax badge. RE "Not a VM"... http://www.vmmotori.com/a-428-dohc/automotive-en/4-cilindri/a-428-dohcen.html http://www.vmmotori.com/images/data_sheet/A428_DOHC-NEW.pdf Same 148KW and 500Nm as my Duramax...made in Asia...do GM pay licence fees ? Our Korean made Captiva has a 2.0 GM engine in it...still a VM...although Holden do the recalls. Here's what someone who isn't an aftermarket tuner said. https://jalopnik.com/how-the-chevy-colorado-diesel-was-americanized-its-mor-1734799892 Re the keep driving, workmates see it on theirs, and the manual that I test drove did it a mile out of etting it back to the dealer.
GM owns the rights to the A428. It was acquired when they were part owner of VM. GM can alter it as they see fit, which they have done. The 2.8 Duramax and the 2.5 Duramax are both GM engines. They are both based on the A428 which has been redesigned and are built by GM. My guess is that the new 3.0L I-6 Duramax in the 2019 GM 1500 trucks is also based off of the A428 as well. Does this also make it an A428 ? Our NA trucks are not rated at 148 KW. This is a good article, it is more accurate and has the detail you're looking for: https://www.dieselworldmag.com/gm/%EF%BB%BFfirst-look-%EF%BB%BFgms-2-8l-duramax/ I could see the keep drving message coming on while doing a test drive. The dealer cars are test driven short distances, so a full regen cycle could probably never get completed.
Excellent article, I noted the spokesman's statement about it being a truck only engine, not designed for cars. Still sad to see so much egr, etc., in place. They run so much better without the junk. But they should be held to the same relative emissions as a gasoline fueled truck.
 
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