Frantz Oil Refiner installed on 4Runner

[FlyNavyP3]

Originally Posted by A310
Very nice install Luke, your oil pressure drop is very similar to my 6.4 Powerstroke and should not pose any problems. I'm very interested as well to see how long your filter lasts before it stops flowing. In an attempt to extend my filter duration, I've switched from Kirkland brand to Scott 1000's as well and see if I can get another 1000 miles out of the roll.


Thanks A310! The stainless braid is likely way overkill but it should be durable and went well with the existing remote oil pressure sending setup I already had to run my stock gauge and Autometer gauge.

I have about 80-100 miles on the system so far, idle oil pressure is more or less unaffected (down 2-3) but cruise pressure is down more like 8-10 psi the bigger surprise to me was high speed cruise oil pressure. Before the bypass it was 75-80 usually closer to 75 which is the bypass setting in the pump. When the oil is cold or not fully up to temp medium and high speed cruise still are 75 psi. However once the oil is fully up to temp high speed cruise oil pressure is down 15+ psi. It now cruises on the highway at 55-60 which is still more than enough but it bothers me a little after watching it cruise at 75 for 85,000 miles. This may be a function of how and where the gauge is plumbed in relation to the filter. Or it may be a reflection of the actual pressure drop due to the new controlled leak in the oil system and worn lower end bearings in the engine. I have a 0.035 inline orifice coming to install on the inlet of the filter as well as a plug and cap set to do some experimenting.

I will let you know if slowing down the bypass flow with a 0.035 orifice has any effect on the oil pressure.

 

[goodtimes]

This is from the older style Frantz company test results. This is how it's done, not vague charts with no references. When using TP in the bathroom is it falling apart on the roll? When it is soaked with oil, fibers stay put. It's a very old question asked since the 60's, the answer is the roll doesn't release fibers, as the cleanliness tests show.
Now as for regular full flow filters, especially glass fiber filters, it may happen they release fibers. Released glass fibers has to be bad as it is essentially sand. USCAR-36 tests for media migration in filters. Cummins Stratopore filters remark on how they evolved into non glass synthetic.

https://www.frantzfilters.com/science/

 

[beanoil]

I think you are fine on pressure. You could move up one grade with that many miles and bump pressure a bit. A perfect application for a new CK-4 HDEO, Mobil, Delo.....
The 22R has been around a while and I remember back in 1980 it had the typical chart for grade and temperature all the way up to 20w50.
There is a calculation formula for pressure drop and orifice size here.

 

[FlyNavyP3]

Originally Posted by beanoil
I think you are fine on pressure. You could move up one grade with that many miles and bump pressure a bit. A perfect application for a new CK-4 HDEO, Mobil, Delo.....
The 22R has been around a while and I remember back in 1980 it had the typical chart for grade and temperature all the way up to 20w50.
There is a calculation formula for pressure drop and orifice size here.


I know that the current pressure is fine and it may just be an artifact of how the sending unit is plumbed in relation to the filter setup. I'm curious to see how the pressure responds with a 0.035 orifice on the filter inlet. If no change I will rearrange the plumbing and test again with and without the orifice.

Truck is currently running a 15w30 HDEO and I have a huge stash of 15w40 and 10w40 oil in the stash which will all probably eventually find its way into the sump of this engine. I've run it on everything from 5w20 to 20w50 and everything in between including monogrades.

 

[UncleDave]

Originally Posted by Linctex
Originally Posted by UncleDave

Always curious as to hearing why people install external bypasses.


Because I want to try to catch the stuff that the full-flow filters cant.

I do notice my oil stays cleaner, longer - though.


I get it. Same with the OPs answer.

There is all kinds of chat here around actual ROI which is really valid in lots of cases of certain guys actually not understanding a real ROI - but that's a different discussion I wasnt trying to get into.

I'm sure it does stay clean longer. I pay particular attention to color vs time in all my vehicles and bypasses, or centrifuges always make a diff - as do magnets to a lesser extent.

Because of the dreaded DI soot I'm pontificating a dual head ultra/trasko which is kind of like a mini Frantz in some ways but the built-in MM is giving me almost 10K miles towing like 50% on a heat-based algorithm so I'm up in the air whether to bother when a 10K change is like 20 bucks and 17 min work.


As always I appreciate the post pics and discussion.

UD

 

[FlyNavyP3]

Submitted an oil sample to a SOS CAT lab today for the oil in the truck when the bypass was installed and makeup oil added but prior to drivin the truck with the bypass installed. SOS does a PC on all samples from hydraulics, transmissions, final drives, differentials etc. I submitted the sample as a "transmission sample" from a Terex 82-80 Dozer to get the PC. Hope to have results in a few weeks. Will post the "before" results here once I get them. After results will be pulled when the filter stops flowing but before I add any make up oil with a new filter.

 

[Linctex]

Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
After results will be pulled when the filter stops flowing but before I add any make up oil with a new filter.


Don't you mean to say "IF the filter stops flowing" ?!?

 

[CT8]

I ran an Amsoil by pass filter in my 1988 Camry for 100,000 miles before removing it. The uoa cost and Bypass filter elements cold not be cost justified for the miles I put on my vehicles. It was a ton of fun looking at the UOA s and a plus the oil stays cleaner and the oil change intervals can be increased.

 

[xtell]

A310,

Sorry to see you "jump ship" in regard to the use of Kirkland TP in favor of Scott 1000 TP as a filter media. I guess that leaves me as the last holdout to carry on with the tradition...

Nuff said,

xtell

 

[FlyNavyP3]

Originally Posted by Linctex
Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
After results will be pulled when the filter stops flowing but before I add any make up oil with a new filter.


Don't you mean to say "IF the filter stops flowing" ?!?


True, I'm basing that assumption on what A310 has observed with his Frantz filters in service. If the filter is still hot at 5,000-7,500 miles on the oil I'll pull a sample then and keep going if the results support it. At any rate my point was that I'll sample prior to diluting the sump with makeup Oil.

 

[Linctex]

Originally Posted by FlyNavyP3
However once the oil is fully up to temp high speed cruise oil pressure is down 15+ psi. It now cruises on the highway at 55-60 which is still more than enough but it bothers me a little after watching it cruise at 75 for 85,000 miles.



Think of how much fuel you are saving because the engine isn't working so hard to spin the oil pump as it was before

 

[dogememe]

Toilet paper oil filter? Wow I thought I've heard it all.

 

[A310]

Originally Posted by xtell
A310,

Sorry to see you "jump ship" in regard to the use of Kirkland TP in favor of Scott 1000 TP as a filter media. I guess that leaves me as the last holdout to carry on with the tradition...

Nuff said,

xtell


Just on the V10, seeing if I can get some more miles out of the rolls before they stop flowing oil. I'm still running Kirkland rolls in the Cummins and will soon be in my Detroit. The Cummins has no trouble running 5000 miles on a roll, so I don't think Luke's Toyota will have any trouble getting to the 5000 mark. As soon as I'm finished my F350 the V10's going to be on standby duty only. The V10's a great engine, but it sure loves Gas.

 

[xtell]

A310

Thank you for clarifying that you are still using Kirkland Filters...err TP on your other trucks, everything is ok now!!! The Oil Refiner I have installed on my 2004 3.4 Toyota Tacoma has never clogged up to the point of oil flow diminishing so you are correct, Luke's Refiner Filter will be able to go the distance. Luke, please pardon me for interrupting your Oil Refiner install thread but I have a quick question for A310 about his V10 engine, A310: Have you changed out the spark plugs. I've read that it can be a real pain to extract them unless you put some carburetor cleaner down the holes once you "crack" then loose. Any tips on correct spark plug replacement would be appreciated.

Again, I beg your pardon for the interruption Luke,

xtell

 

[A310]

No I haven't changed them out and hope I never have to. I have no idea if the previous owner did, but just passed 191,000 miles on it and runs smooth with no miss fire codes. Just my luck though that before I'm finished with it I'll have to change them and run into trouble. And to think I said no to a good running V10 not 6 months ago as I've run out of room in my shop for more engines. I think Like might be able to shed some light on the V10 as I believe he's worked on them.

 

[A310]

Correction, I think Luke might be able to shed some light on the V10.

 

[FlyNavyP3]

Originally Posted by A310
Correction, I think Luke might be able to shed some light on the V10.


The only V-10 stuff I have any experience with is repairing spark plug threads on Ambulance heads from a fleet back when I worked at my first machine shop from 1999-2002. The plugs don't engage many threads in the head and were prone to either blow out or pull the aluminum with them when removed. The repair entailed installing a steel insert with locktite that then used a special tool to stake in the tapered seat. Even when done properly the repair didn't always hold and sometimes the repair would come out with the plug on the next plug change taking more aluminum with it. At that point the only option was welding or another casting.

If I owned one I'd sure be tempted to not touch them unless it was misfiring, and once it started misfiring I'd want to be mentally and financially ready to have to pull one or both heads before attempting a spark plug change.

 

[xtell]

A310 and Luke,

Thank you both very much for your replys. The 2008 Ford F350 I have with the V-10 engine is a very low mileage truck (currently 16,597 total miles). It was not abused by the previous owner who kept it in immaculate condition. My thought was to change out the factory installed plugs with Iridium plugs and use anti-seize lubricant on the threads so that in the future "if" I had any misfires or other spark plug related issues I would not tear up the heads getting them out, an issue that was prevalent with the early production years of the V-10 engine. However, if proceeding with a plug change, even with the low mileage being taken into consideration, may result in damage to the heads, I might be better off leaving everything as it is. I'd hate to unscrew nine of them and then have the tenth one strip out. It's too bad that the engineers that developed the engine did not come up with a better spark plug / cylinder configuration that would have diminished the potential for stuck plugs.

xtell

 

[CT8]

Originally Posted by dogememe
Toilet paper oil filter? Wow I thought I've heard it all.

My dad put one on his new 1964 Ford Galaxy.He traded in the car when he bought a new 1974 Olds Omega.He made a big deal about all the benefits . He mever bought another TP filter tough

 

[FlyNavyP3]

PC is in for the 4Runner, this sample was taken after the bypass was installed, full of oil and makeup oil added (0.75 quarts), but before being driven, only about 5 min or less run time just to check for leaks and make sure the truck was topped off. Enjoy.