Ceratec and Mos2 Discussion

[4WD]

The data would be irrelevant since it is impossible to attribute such a change solely to one isolated variable in everyday driving. There are myriads of uncontrolled variables in such driving even if one is convinced they are controlling them, which they are not. Many environmental and societal changes affect fuel economy and none of them are strictly controlled. Even the normal variation in fuel energy density I mentioned above wipes out most people's perceived improvements.

Everyone focuses on the change they see (which can be measured) but the problem comes in when attempting to ascribe it to one variable. This is often grossly misunderstood but is the real issue.

Agree … a professional bench test would be more accurate … but of course some would say “ain’t real world” if the outcome did not fit the narrative …

 

[kschachn]

Agree … a professional bench test would be more accurate … but of course some would say “ain’t real world” if the outcome did not fit the narrative …

But if you are trying to isolate the effects of one variable then no one, ever, is going to do that in the real world. Ever.

"Real world" testing is mostly a myth that sounds good to the uninformed but for the most part in the real world it doesn't exist.

 

[nicholas]

The data would be irrelevant since it is impossible to attribute such a change solely to one isolated variable in everyday driving. There are myriads of uncontrolled variables in such driving even if one is convinced they are controlling them, which they are not. Many environmental and societal changes affect fuel economy and none of them are strictly controlled. Even the normal variation in fuel energy density I mentioned above wipes out most people's perceived improvements.

Everyone focuses on the change they see (which can be measured) but the problem comes in when attempting to ascribe it to one variable. This is often grossly misunderstood but is the real issue.

Yes, but you can not state the gain was not from the additive - - just as the latter.
Just stating an observation.
You can get a %1 gain from over inflating your tires.

 

[TiGeo]

Yes, but you can not state the gain was not from the additive - - just as the latter.
Just stating an observation.
You can get a %1 gain from over inflating your tires.

Agreed. In this situation, you have an observation that you saw an improvement in mpgs. We just don't know if it's the Ceratec (can be a coincidence) or related to something else or a combination of other variables. When I added a full-length belly pan to my car which will be aero on the undercarriage, my next tank had noticeably higher mpgs but it was short-lived but I could have easily stated it was from the belly pan. So in your dataset you see a jump up at the point of adding Ceratec that stayed consistent so basically a trend line with a kink in it?

 

[TiGeo]

Agree … a professional bench test would be more accurate … but of course some would say “ain’t real world” if the outcome did not fit the narrative …

That issue can go both ways reading this site sometimes.

 

[TiGeo]

Need 2x300ml bottles of the Ceratec for this 9L oil capacity beast! I figure this engine needs all the friction modifiers it can get.

 

[nicholas]

Agreed. In this situation, you have an observation that you saw an improvement in mpgs. We just don't know if it's the Ceratec (can be a coincidence) or related to something else or a combination of other variables. When I added a full-length belly pan to my car which will be aero on the undercarriage, my next tank had noticeably higher mpgs but it was short-lived but I could have easily stated it was from the belly pan. So in your dataset you see a jump up at the point of adding Ceratec that stayed consistent so basically a trend line with a kink in it?

Sorry for the late reply....I tore my bicep tendon and required surgery. Extremely painful.
I noticed a bump in mileage in that tank of gas after adding the ceratec, I filled up just before.
The increase stayed quite constant while the product was in. Once I changed the oil within 2 tanks my mileage dropped to previous.
This oci started in Dec and ended on April.
Many variables at play. I'm the nerd that checks tire pressure every week and check my oil every couple of days.
I think its good stuff. The wot pull was something that surprised me.
I wish I had something to log 0-60 times.
Before and after.

 

[Dogman]

Last change UOA included MoS2. One before Ceratec. '18 Golf Sportwagen. Tuned with hardware. Hard driving/drag racing this interval. Cleary less moly/boron than Ceratec.

View attachment 23906

How many quarts of oil and how many bottles of mos2? I thought the mos2 would have added more moly. do you know how many ppm this oil contains without the mos2? I’m wondering how much moly mos2 adds to oil. Valvoline advanced synthetic has 3 times the amount this oil + the mos2 added.

 

[Jetronic]

MOS2 particles are too big for the UOA to detect, mostly. They can be found in insolubles % though.

0.2% being up to 2000ppm.

 

[SHOZ]

I use Ceratec in my manual trans and have used it in my engines. Both show improvement when using it. Never have seen any settling or filter capturing issue. I have with raw moly not designed for engines, it settled out and congealed in low spots. Ceratec is a different animal than molybdenum.

.

 

[TiGeo]

How many quarts of oil and how many bottles of mos2? I thought the mos2 would have added more moly. do you know how many ppm this oil contains without the mos2? I’m wondering how much moly mos2 adds to oil. Valvoline advanced synthetic has 3 times the amount this oil + the mos2 added.

~6 qts (a bit less) of oil. Oil had zero moly.