BMW (Toyota Supra) B58 Engine Teardown Video

Messages
14,550
Location
Santa Barbara, CA
Originally Posted by PimTac
Interesting to say the least. So what happens to the Supra now? These guys will slap the engine back together, reinstall and get it on the market at a discount? Sounds like a upcoming thread here on BITOG.
I think it will be going into one of their racecars.
 
Messages
10,018
Location
Colorado Springs
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
What's the HP rating on that stock motor?
335, but as it is always the case with BMW, numbers on wheels are much higher than they should be considering hp on crank. BMW has really efficient hp transfer to the wheels (that is argued). So either they undervalue hp on crank or drivetrain is really efficient.
 
Messages
24,220
Location
PNW
335 HP stock and they want to get 1000 HP out of it. eek The main bearing design (with the windage tray adding support) looks kind of wimpy to support that level of power and remain reliable. Should be interesting to see how they do it.
 
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4,932
Location
the canyons
It all depends on what the parameters of 'reliable' are. There have been turbocharged Hayabusa engines developing 1200 hp.
 
Messages
10,018
Location
Colorado Springs
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
335 HP stock and they want to get 1000 HP out of it. eek The main bearing design (with the windage tray adding support) looks kind of wimpy to support that level of power and remain reliable. Should be interesting to see how they do it.
People get 900hp out of BMW N54 regularly and for the power, they work pretty well.
 
Messages
5,124
Location
Atlanta,GA
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
335 HP stock and they want to get 1000 HP out of it. eek The main bearing design (with the windage tray adding support) looks kind of wimpy to support that level of power and remain reliable. Should be interesting to see how they do it.
The version used in the M340i makes over 380 HP. This SUPRA version was purposely de-tuned (My N55 makes 335 hp). What I wonder is whether or not the coating on the cylinder walls can take the added load. This engine is NOT sleeved.
 
Messages
1,015
Location
Minneapolis
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
 
Messages
2,692
Location
Chicagoland
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
 
Messages
5,124
Location
Atlanta,GA
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
Any BMW can go 200k miles. It's just a matter of having the will and the $$. It's a question of durability. For example early electronic water pumps on the N54 would routinely fail just north of 50k miles. That's unacceptable to a Lexus owner who has 150k miles on his/her original water pump.
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Well if you had the N20-N26 or N47 diesel you might have a different opinion about BMW and timing chains.
 
Messages
5,968
Location
Connecticut
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
Yup. I drove mine on a 2600 mile road trip and hammered the crap out of it. I drove through the smoky mountains, the blue ridge parkway, down mountain dirt roads, did tail of the dragon, and it didn't miss a beat. All while carrying plenty of gear for two people.
 
Messages
5,968
Location
Connecticut
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
Any BMW can go 200k miles. It's just a matter of having the will and the $$. It's a question of durability. For example early electronic water pumps on the N54 would routinely fail just north of 50k miles. That's unacceptable to a Lexus owner who has 150k miles on his/her original water pump.
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Well if you had the N20-N26 or N47 diesel you might have a different opinion about BMW and timing chains.
So would owners of the 3.5 V6 in many newer Fords.
 
Messages
5,968
Location
Connecticut
Originally Posted by andyd
School me please. What, pray tell, is the rationale behind a rear timing chain/belt? In the factory, the cabins are dropped onto the drive train The right way to take out an engine is on the sub-frame from underneath and then split off the engine or trans to service. KA- Ching!! and difficult to bodge behind the shop. The main reason I don't have a late model Ranger 4x4 is a rear cam drive 4.0L Take a good reliable little gas hog capable of 300K with little service and turn it into a grenade at 150K miles . A century of development going into push rod V engines. Then these OHC horror shows. What is the impetus to do this for Ford or BMW or any car maker? coffee
Wait, so you didn't own a Ranger with the 4.0 SOHC V6 because basically two years of production might have had an issue with the timing chain which was solved after 2001? ??? My friend owned a 2001 which was one of the "problem" years and it went to 200k with zero issues before he sold it.
 
Messages
10,018
Location
Colorado Springs
Originally Posted by jeepman3071
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
Any BMW can go 200k miles. It's just a matter of having the will and the $$. It's a question of durability. For example early electronic water pumps on the N54 would routinely fail just north of 50k miles. That's unacceptable to a Lexus owner who has 150k miles on his/her original water pump.
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Well if you had the N20-N26 or N47 diesel you might have a different opinion about BMW and timing chains.
So would owners of the 3.5 V6 in many newer Fords.
Toyota 2GR-FE had tensioner issues in first years too.
 
Messages
2,692
Location
Chicagoland
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Any BMW can go 200k miles. It's just a matter of having the will and the $$. It's a question of durability. For example early electronic water pumps on the N54 would routinely fail just north of 50k miles. That's unacceptable to a Lexus owner who has 150k miles on his/her original water pump.
Sounds like the 5.7 HEMI water pumps. I'd still take replacing water pumps every 50k over a Lexus though.
 
Messages
6,006
Location
KY
As I've said many times before, if your idea of the pinnacle of automotive excellence is an anodyne travel pod that can go 300k miles with minimal maintenance, than a BMW is not for you. As for me, the enjoyment I've derived from the BMWs I've owned since 1983 vastly outweigh the additional expense of maintaining them.
Originally Posted by jeepman3071
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
Yup. I drove mine on a 2600 mile road trip and hammered the crap out of it. I drove through the smoky mountains, the blue ridge parkway, down mountain dirt roads, did tail of the dragon, and it didn't miss a beat. All while carrying plenty of gear for two people.
As I've said many times before, if your idea of the pinnacle of automotive excellence is an anodyne travel pod that can go 300k miles with minimal maintenance, than a BMW is not for you. As for me, the enjoyment I've derived from the BMWs I've owned since 1983 vastly outweigh the additional expense of maintaining them.
 
Messages
6,134
Location
New England
Originally Posted by MCompact
As I've said many times before, if your idea of the pinnacle of automotive excellence is an anodyne travel pod that can go 300k miles with minimal maintenance, than a BMW is not for you. As for me, the enjoyment I've derived from the BMWs I've owned since 1983 vastly outweigh the additional expense of maintaining them.
Originally Posted by jeepman3071
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by antonmnster
So much ignorance and fear of anything new. My n54 has 210,000 miles on it, original chains and turbos, and I'd be totally fine if the chains were on the back. I've had BMWs for 20 years, and had only one chain tensioner go weak on my 318is from 1991. The rest have been perfect for 250k+. I just drove to Detroit and back and loved the performance and relative efficiency, even running 5-40 Delo. This engine looks like a simplified version of my n54 in some respects. The lack of driver engagement of modern BMWs is worthy of a lot of criticism, but not the engines.
Anything other than penalty boxes... I mean econoboxes... I mean boring appliances... er, frugal, reliable vehicles are automatically disregarded for being too expensive or referred to as "unreliable" with absolutely no real world experience. It is IMPOSSIBLE to drive a BMW 200k with no issues! wink
Yup. I drove mine on a 2600 mile road trip and hammered the crap out of it. I drove through the smoky mountains, the blue ridge parkway, down mountain dirt roads, did tail of the dragon, and it didn't miss a beat. All while carrying plenty of gear for two people.
As I've said many times before, if your idea of the pinnacle of automotive excellence is an anodyne travel pod that can go 300k miles with minimal maintenance, than a BMW is not for you. As for me, the enjoyment I've derived from the BMWs I've owned since 1983 vastly outweigh the additional expense of maintaining them.
These clowns just reduced the car to about 30k with problems once they put that back in.
 
Messages
2,692
Location
Chicagoland
Originally Posted by madRiver
These clowns just reduced the car to about 30k with problems once they put that back in.
Ah yes... long term reliability is at the top of my list in a custom built 1,000hp vehicle. smirk2 Or, maybe it takes 1,000hp with no major problems. You have no idea.
 
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