BG ATF flush

Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
I'll be getting a new trans pan gasket and that kinda domino-effects into a flush. The trans fluid is 2 years old and doesn't look bad, but doesn't look new either. The flush will be done on the 30th and they will be using the Redline ATF I bought (which I suppose will have a slight BG residue in it). My question is about the can of BG additive added after the flush. What exactly is it? Is it going to help or hurt the additive package in Redline? Or perhaps neither harm nor aid; but if anyone knows, one way or the other, I need to know in the next 8 days, to tell them whether to add it or not. I suppose it is safest to just use straight Redline but I don't know what is in that can: Is it miscible / mixable / compatible with Redline D4 ATF??? I look forward to some sage advice. Thanks in advance! Rob
 
Messages
8,756
Location
RI
When using a synthetic ATF, you shouldn't need any extra additives. Gasket replacement doesn't need to domino into a flush. Replace the gasket(and filter), refill the tranny and keep driving. And, IMO, for any machine flush, don't let them add any chemicals into the tranny. A flush should be just a fluid exchange using the machine. No solvents should be used prior/during the flush, and no ATF additives need to be added to the fluid or after the flush. http://www.bgprod.com/products/transmission.html
 
Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
Thanks to you both. (and subsequent replies whether echoing or with different replies) "When using a synthetic ATF, you shouldn't need any extra additives....And, IMO, for any machine flush, don't let them add any chemicals into the tranny." I see the point, absolutely. So why does BG add TWO (one before and one after) to their ATF flushes? If I want to 'clean the guck out' well I have added a bit of Auto-RX to the ATF, plus I had the whole thing flushed exactly 2 years ago. (with a frustrating EIGHTEEN quarts of Redline ATF...I almost blew a gasket! [Mad] That was a different place, where I have not gone back) I like the idea of a total change every 2 years and I suppose in saying domino effect, or mission-creep, I thought if the pan is off anyway, might as well ensure the torque converter had new ATF, since what is in there is 2 years old and is somewhat dirty (but still bright-ish cherry) Another factor is, I just got another case of Redline ATF delivered, so I'm going for it anyhow. I like a bit of overkill in these matters, so while I agree a gasket replacement doesn't need to domino into a flush, my desire for overkill out-weighs pure logic / need as opposed to want. OK I admit it, the idea of a total flush is a done deal and my mind was made up the minute I decided to order the Redline ATF. My question is more about the additives, and while I'm at it, the following... Somewhat [Off Topic!] but I am thinking of adding a PS fuild change. I have Redline PS fluid but am thinking of getting plain PS fluid in there for a few months as a semi-flush, and THEN switching to Redline. Good idea? Needless but you can see my point in light of my penchants?? (Classic BITOG-er, all the way [Wink] While I'm at it, the car is a '96 and chances are it has the brake fluid that it left the (GM) factory with. It has traction control and ABS, so is it best to get it done at a GM dealership? I really think brake fluid is a bit more important than freshness of ATF or PSF, but despite a brake inspection and new rear drums on the 30th, I'm not inclined to part with the $ for a brake flush at this time. Speaking of domino-effect, sorry to get off-topic or triple my questions. Thanks! Rob the oil nut in [Canada]
 
Messages
8,756
Location
RI
Why? Additives=profit margin increase! I also don't think that a quality ATF like Redline would create any crud anyway. Find a shop that will add your fluid to their machine and NOTHING else. Pull the pan/gasket/filter for replacement/cleaning/inspection! I'd also use the D4 in the PS system and sell/return the RL PS fluid! Any PS fluid/ATF....can be used as a flushing medium if you want prior to switching to RL.
 
Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
Considering what Redline has saved me, and my testimonials (not on their site as far as I know. I have no regrets about what I said though, and appreciate the MANY nice things they have done for me before and after that) I choose not to even attempt to return their goods. Besides, I am in Canada and returning anything would be cost-and-time-prohibitive. In other news some not-quite-a-mechanic told me I should not even consider replacing the brake fluid, it was designed to be in there for life. He also told me NOT to install the muffler a (real, full mechanic) friend gave to me (after hideous amounts of tickets for modifying his car: No tickets pertaining to the exhaust system or muffler though). The muffler was $400+ new and the non-mechanic said I'd harm the engine by changing the back-pressure. I can see his point but the engine is a 3800 Series II, and while "all of them are the same" some are turbocharged or supercharged at the factory; some have dual exhausts, etc. Plus the fact that a mechanic put one on the (import) car he is very well-trained on. To say nothing of the kids that have similar (but no doubt cheaper) mufflers on their cars. Will switching mufflers be of any likely harm? FWIW I could have 2, 1, or zero resonators. Who knows what sick twisted things I could do with that combination [LOL!] Thanks Rob
 
Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
Consulted with the mechanic friend that will be doing the work or be very close to it. No additives, BG or otherwise, will be used on the trans. Drain, flush the torque converter, new gasket and filter, in whatever order, I'll leave the specifics to him. The car will be back there in Feb or March for perhaps the muffler, brake fluid flush, power steering and maybe new plugs. Oh, and on the 30th I'll also be getting the serpentine belt replaced. Something tells me it's older than it should be. The car is a '96 but the engine is from a "2001 or 2002 Buick LeSabre, 15,000 KM on it, MAYBE 20,000 at the very most", said the salesman. Well the '96 came with an oil level monitor, the LeSabre didn't, so the oil pans are swapped. How much of the old engine came over is anyone's guess. I'm getting a multi-point inspection and asked that they pull a plug or two to have a look. I wish I had UOA's but I have 2 used oil samples that have been immobile since the oil change in June, I still haven't sent them in for analysis. If it's any consolation, yes I DO feel ashamed [Embarrassed] (notice my total lack of postings from about June, if not before, until about a week ago [Embarrassed] Rob
 
Messages
51
Location
kansas
You could add some lubegard. A muffler change that lowers backpressure will only help your car. If you were talking about a complete exhaust change with headers you would probably need to reflash your computer, but a better muffler will probably give you 5 to 10 more horsepower without any other changes.
 
Messages
304
Location
Spotsyltucky, VA
No additives are necessary, but their trans additive probably wouldn't hurt. Same goes for MOA, if you get the engine flushed with their equipment. Tell em not to use it, it won't hurt anything but a good quality syn will be just fine without it. As for the muffler, it won't hurt a thing. I highly doubt that it will give you significant gains, however. Most of the backpressure is in the cat. Will be louder though, unless its one of the few performance aftermarket mufflers designed to slightly increase flow while keeping close to OE sound.
 
Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
Thanks again, all of you...babydoggy, you said "You could add some lubegard" ...to the ATF? I have LC and FP and Auto-RX and Neutra and Techron... and Militec and a gasoline additive I can't recall the name of, from earlier, less informed days. I've been away so long I can't recall what lubegard is, and I read what MOA stood for a few days ago but since forgot [Smile] I think straight Redline ATF replacing straight Redline ATF will be the safest. I've volunteered to be the Guinea Pig on this board a few times but I do not want to take chances in this matter. Alex P., you said "Most of the backpressure is in the cat" and I think the cat is 9-10 years old and perhaps should be removed anyhow. This could get kinda nifty! [Wink] THANKS AGAIN Rob
 
Messages
304
Location
Spotsyltucky, VA
No cat might be a bit too little backpressure for its liking, completely stock. At least the muffler would be free performance, since you didn't pay for it. [Wink]
 
Messages
19
Location
Charlotte, NC
Same motor I had in my Bonnie. It will LOVE a low-restriction muffler. Change the brake fluid. It is your life you're talking about. Took me 15-30 minutes per corner to jack the corner, take off the tire, hook up the mity-vac ($40 at Sears, worth every penny), crack the bleeder, and suck out the yucky stuff until clean fluid comes out. No big deal.
 
I service brake fliud every two years at min.Use to every year until as few years ago.I flush my auto trans and ONLY service filter about 90k unless severe usage then its at 60k.I DO use the BG cleaner but NOT the additive as I use Amsoil syn.fliud.I have done this type maintance on several autos with a high of 252k before selling with NO trans repairs.
 
Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
OK: Brake fluid: Do I refill with BG as they suggest? Can someone explain is DOT 5 is better than 4 which is better than 3? What brand, what specs? The car has ABS and traction control, doesn't that mean it's a real bear to do the brake flush? Should it be done only at a GM dealership by a certified technician, or is that sort of thing just for later-model, higher-end cars? New sub-topic: The plugs (and perhaps wires, perhaps even a new coil) is posted at http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=24&t=002917 THANKS! Rob
 
Messages
1,571
Location
Thousand Oaks, CA
DOT 5 brake fluid is silicon based and is not compatable with DOT 3 and DOT 4. DOT 5 is not compatable with ABS. DOT 4 has a higher boiling point than DOT 3. To achieve the higher boiling point, slightly different chemistry is needed. IIRC the addition of boron esters in the blend. Many feel that DOT 4 can be used in DOT 3 systems. Some disagree. General Motors in particular doesn't like to see that substitution. I use DOT 4 fluid in my car that is speced for DOT 3. There is a lot more to brake fluid than mentioned here, including DOT 5.1 which is compatable with DOT 3 and DOT 4 but not with DOT 5. There is also a DOT 6 that is compatable with DOT 3, DOT 4, and DOT 5.1. I just saw an add in Motor Trend for a brake fluid that seems to have a higher boiling point than any of those. At $24.00 a liter I'm probably not going to be buying it soon.
 
Messages
529
Location
Manitoba, Canada
Thread starter
I'd like more info on that fluid, Big Jim, but while I would be tempted to get it, it would take a month for me to get it, and at this moment the car is freezing in the lot of the place that will do the work. The brake fluid will likely be fine. If not, I've OK'd them to do their BG thing. All of it will be over by the time most of y'all read this / most will be done within 12 hours. Or else I'll obsess about the plugs and wires and whatever else for a few months [Wink] Thanks for all the input! Rob
 
Messages
1,027
Location
Wisconsin
Rob, Read up on what is called for in the way of fluids. Take note of the specification names (DOT) and numbers (3) using DOT 3 brake fluid as an example. Then shop for the fluid that lists the specification name and number that you need. Reline lists it all on their website. Your car's factory manual will also tell you how often to change the tranny fluid. Consider that the MAXIMUM mileage that you should leave the fluid in there. I have redline Power steering fluid in my '96 windstar....and it is great. Has been through 2 summers and 1 winter. You can also install a filter in the Power Steering return line....which is the low pressure line. Magnifine makes a great filter that has a magnet....paper element....and a pressure bypass to let the fluid flow, should the filter become clogged. The magnifine filter is sold under a lot of different brand names....including ATP. Brake fluid...Newer factory manuals seem to tell you to remove some of the brake fluid from the master cylinder....then compress the caliper cylinder when doing a brake job. This is in place of the old method...of "Bleeding" the brakes. The factory instructions use this "new" method for my car. What this means is.....the fluid at the caliper or cylinder could be nasty stuff indeed. So YES....I would do the major bleed as you have been advised. I use Motorcraft "Premium" brake fluid...which is DOT 3....but has a "dry" boil point of 550 degrees (F). There are a number of good brands out there. Use brake fluid ONLY from a new, sealed container...as a container that has been opened and sitting around on the back of that shelf in the garage has been taking on moisture....and should NOT be used. Removing Catalytic converters on a OBDII car (all cars from 1996 on) may create some issues with the computer. The computer on OBDII cars monitors the catalytic converter to make sure that it is actually working. There is a oxygen sensor before the converter for the engine control.....and one after the converter that is specifically to monitor "catalyst efficiency". I have 2 catalytic converters....and as such....I have 4 oxygen sensors.... Here in wisconsin.....OBDII cars fly right through the emission testing that many of us have to go through every other year......and even then...they still slide a mirror under the car for a visual verification.
 
Messages
304
Location
Spotsyltucky, VA
If you can legally run without a cat, and you absolutely wanted to run without one, you could use an O2 simulator so your computer doesn't get disgruntled.
 
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