After about 5,000 miles the engine was getting little loud in the top end on whatever the dealership put in, just changed to Amsoil 20w-50 V-Twin. Instantly quieted down.
What's in this stuff?
What's in this stuff?
Amsoil -- What's The Difference?
- Thread starter CCI
- Start date
Is this a shared sump or a Harley that has separate oil for the transmission (or a bike with a dry clutch)?
Putting new oil in just about any internal combustion engine will quiet it down initially. From there it depends how the oil shears or doesn't shear with respect to the noise you hear further into the OCI.
Do you know what weight the dealership used?
If it got loud right around 5,000 mi that's not too terribly bad. Depending on the weight it started at, it may have done pretty well, relatively speaking. However if it got noisier progressively at some mileage starting a good bit less than 5,000 it was beginning to shear down at whatever point you noticed it.
20w-50 V-Twin M1 doesn't even blink for 5,000 mi in a shared sump, I would suspect the same with the Amsoil variety.
Putting new oil in just about any internal combustion engine will quiet it down initially. From there it depends how the oil shears or doesn't shear with respect to the noise you hear further into the OCI.
Do you know what weight the dealership used?
If it got loud right around 5,000 mi that's not too terribly bad. Depending on the weight it started at, it may have done pretty well, relatively speaking. However if it got noisier progressively at some mileage starting a good bit less than 5,000 it was beginning to shear down at whatever point you noticed it.
20w-50 V-Twin M1 doesn't even blink for 5,000 mi in a shared sump, I would suspect the same with the Amsoil variety.
Last edited:
What happened to you as far as the engine quieting down would happen with pretty much any new oil after a 5000 mile change, even automobiles..
Mobile 1 and Amsoil motorcycle oils are known though, over time to hold the viscosity longer and actually thicken up so you may hear quiet in 5000 miles, whether that is good or not is a matter of opinion.
Interesting info that Amsoil outsources their base stock to Mobil, didn’t know that!
From a motorcycle oil perspective, I believe that Amsoil 20w50 has shown similar thickening to Mobil 1 20w50 V-Twin over longer OCI’s in air-cooled twins without a shared sump. Could explain a lot.
From a motorcycle oil perspective, I believe that Amsoil 20w50 has shown similar thickening to Mobil 1 20w50 V-Twin over longer OCI’s in air-cooled twins without a shared sump. Could explain a lot.
The only problem is that it's not exactly true. Some selected basetocks come from Exxon Mobil but not all. Amsoil buys to specification not brand.
"According to this Amsoil rep in this video the "stuff" is Mobil 1 which is their base oil of choice to all their synthetics so if that
is true then 90% of Amsoil could be $5.40 a quart Mobil 1..."
The difference in price is due largely to volume and marketing plans. And of course, profits.
is true then 90% of Amsoil could be $5.40 a quart Mobil 1..."
The difference in price is due largely to volume and marketing plans. And of course, profits.
If Amsoil is buying to a specification, no matter who they’re buying from really isn’t what we’re talking about here. It’s that they aren’t developing or refining to a specification. They’re simply taking someone else’s base oil and adding the same additives in their own concentrations that Walmart has blended into Super Tech.
Not sure how you know Amsoil uses the "same additives........... that Walmart has blended into Super Tech." I clearly admit I don't know, but somehow you do. VOA does not tell us this.
And yes they are developing their own oils. It's true Amsoil is a blender as are most all medium small oil companies. Not sure why this bothers people so much. Yes the huge refiners are vertically integrated and save huge money not having to buy ingredients from competitors, but it's not like that alone, or that the same people doing the refining do the blending - which gives a technical advantage. I think the main advantage Mobil has is cost as mentioned in not having to buy outside, time to market with a new oil. On the other hand, Amsoil has the freedom to buy the base oils and superior additives from whomever they wish.
It's the MLM marketing scheme or scam, that has many
concerned about.
Multi Level Marketing is considered to be a less than honest
marketing method that many who enter into one lose their
life savings and never make a profit at the lower levels.
My 2¢
concerned about.
Multi Level Marketing is considered to be a less than honest
marketing method that many who enter into one lose their
life savings and never make a profit at the lower levels.
My 2¢
I understand some companies have abused MLM in the past. MLM is not a single method, nor is it a scam. First of all we are talking about a legal method of selling product, NOT a pyramid scheme. Amsoil is NOT a pyramid of endless height. It is all in writing and clear as a bell. Next, there is no "minimum purchase", no amount that needs to be stocked. So there has not been an Amsoil dealer who has lost his savings due to selling Amsoil. True, at first you are not going to get rich, but after 3-5-10-20 years of reasonable effort a dealer, then jobber should be certified and have a reasonable amount of repeat customers (online and local)., PC's, Commercial and Retail accounts. Lastly the truly successful dealers are not making wild claims, and have access to educational material, and finally Amsoil is getting a grip on the crazy web sites.
Respectfully, show that Amsoil uses a different grade/better/superior version of additives than the same zinc, phosphorus, boron, moly, magnesium etc. that Warren distribution (Super Tech) or any number of other oils employ. I am not able to find the discussion however I recall it was fairly evident most if not all oil manufacturers regardless of the name on the bottle get them from a very short list of suppliers if not the same supplier.
Definitely don’t want to start an issue here, however every statement made with respect to this boutique oil doesn’t have a direct answer in the sense that it clears up any ambiguity with respect to being superior other than the marketing approach. I don’t believe oil analysis shows anything superior (or inferior) with respect to real world results.
Very happy to continue discussion and learn more about the performance edge Amsoil has with respect to a supplier that sells superior additives relative to another supplier.
In general I see very little, if anything at all, about where additives come from. It is my understanding the base oil is where the battle is fought when it comes to a superior used oil analysis and no mention is made of where the zinc, phosphorus etc. comes from. That being the case, that would say the additives most likely come from the same place for most oils.
Definitely don’t want to start an issue here, however every statement made with respect to this boutique oil doesn’t have a direct answer in the sense that it clears up any ambiguity with respect to being superior other than the marketing approach. I don’t believe oil analysis shows anything superior (or inferior) with respect to real world results.
Very happy to continue discussion and learn more about the performance edge Amsoil has with respect to a supplier that sells superior additives relative to another supplier.
In general I see very little, if anything at all, about where additives come from. It is my understanding the base oil is where the battle is fought when it comes to a superior used oil analysis and no mention is made of where the zinc, phosphorus etc. comes from. That being the case, that would say the additives most likely come from the same place for most oils.
Last edited:
You are correct, of course there are a limited number of additive suppliers, but that does not at all mean oil blenders are choosing the same additives, or additive packages. Lubrizol, Afton, Infinuem are three that come to mind for the major additives, but there are a host of others that make antioxidants, vapor phase inhibitors, viscosity index improvers, etc. These chemical manufacturers offer distinct chemistries - purpose built. Many, for solubility reasons will vary by base oil type - others by function. And these suppliers have tiered additives. Interestingly many of these additives, such as functional amines are invisible in VOA's and UOA's. Again, the best additives cost more money. How much difference they make in 3K-5K mile oil change is often the subject du jour on BITOG. But 10K and beyond, yes the better more stable additives do make a difference. The additive section here has some good basic knowledge on additive types.
Can I post up Amsoil specifications and purchase orders and formulas? I think you know the answer to that. You see very little and I see the same amount. I draw a different conclusion than you do, perhaps because confirmation from folks like Molakule and others inside the industry - ie 20 years of being on BITOG and 21 years an Amsoil dealer.
Can I post up Amsoil specifications and purchase orders and formulas? I think you know the answer to that. You see very little and I see the same amount. I draw a different conclusion than you do, perhaps because confirmation from folks like Molakule and others inside the industry - ie 20 years of being on BITOG and 21 years an Amsoil dealer.
I appreciate where you’re coming from and the reasoned logic in your explanations. Here’s to good motor oil no matter who makes the base stock or supplies the additive package! 
Bonz - Part of the problem in your analysis of ASMOIL is that you speak of chemical elements as if they’re the measure. Calcium isn’t an additive to oil. Chemical compounds containing calcium are the additives. They have complex chemistry. That chemistry provides the performance.
So, those elements didn’t tell the story. Talking about calcium, boron, phosphorus, magnesium, or whatever, is like talking about how much rubber or steel is in a car. The measure of the component elements, how much rubber, steel, aluminum, whatever, that are present in the car doesn’t tell you how the car is designed or how it performs.
You’re not able to tell how an oil performs by looking at the elements that it is broken into under chromatography, when the performance of the oil comes from the arrangement of those elements in complex chemistry.
So, those elements didn’t tell the story. Talking about calcium, boron, phosphorus, magnesium, or whatever, is like talking about how much rubber or steel is in a car. The measure of the component elements, how much rubber, steel, aluminum, whatever, that are present in the car doesn’t tell you how the car is designed or how it performs.
You’re not able to tell how an oil performs by looking at the elements that it is broken into under chromatography, when the performance of the oil comes from the arrangement of those elements in complex chemistry.
Seems to me that the GTL used by some Shell products and some
Mobil 1 products would be superior to most other base stocks.
I don't think AMSOIL uses that base stock.
OF course, the end blend is what makes a good or better product in
any case..
My 2¢
Mobil 1 products would be superior to most other base stocks.
I don't think AMSOIL uses that base stock.
OF course, the end blend is what makes a good or better product in
any case..
My 2¢
All good info, I learn good stuff around here.
On the question of longevity either Amsoil or Mobil 1 will meet and exceed your mileage expectations...
