737 max... what now?

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Not every airline is deferring deliveries. Depends on what the airline thinks they need and what the deal looks like.

United just took delivery of four 787 last month, and just ordered several more to be delivered this year.
 
Originally Posted by fdcg27
Boeing's most desperate need ATM is a MAX version that's considered airworthy by FAA and EASA.
Even then, Boeing has a huge backlog of completed but undelivered aircraft that most airlines will do everything they can to defer accepting in the current environment.
All that inventory sitting on the ground with little likelihood of monetizing most of it for at least a couple of years more.

With new market, XLR will be very well suited. AA was running 767-300 from PHL to DBV, and was about to shift to 787 next year. Will see demand, but XLR could do that route, not to mention Ireland, UK etc.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by fdcg27
Boeing's most desperate need ATM is a MAX version that's considered airworthy by FAA and EASA.
Even then, Boeing has a huge backlog of completed but undelivered aircraft that most airlines will do everything they can to defer accepting in the current environment.
All that inventory sitting on the ground with little likelihood of monetizing most of it for at least a couple of years more.

With new market, XLR will be very well suited. AA was running 767-300 from PHL to DBV, and was about to shift to 787 next year. Will see demand, but XLR could do that route, not to mention Ireland, UK etc.


Over the past few decades Airbus has done extraordinary work in developing the ugly duckling stretched A320 into the current A321 swan. This is now an aircraft that can do 90% of the 757 mission with much less structural weight and much lower fuel burn. Less weight plus more current engines equals less fuel required and less fuel required equals lower structural weight, a virtuous circle.
Yeah, there are edge cases where the 757 wins, but for most routes including the closer TATL destinations, the A321 can do the job with similar passenger capacity at much lower trip cost.
Whether DBV will exist as a direct route from anywhere in the US as things return to some semblance of normal is a different question.
 
Originally Posted by fdcg27
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by fdcg27
Boeing's most desperate need ATM is a MAX version that's considered airworthy by FAA and EASA.
Even then, Boeing has a huge backlog of completed but undelivered aircraft that most airlines will do everything they can to defer accepting in the current environment.
All that inventory sitting on the ground with little likelihood of monetizing most of it for at least a couple of years more.

With new market, XLR will be very well suited. AA was running 767-300 from PHL to DBV, and was about to shift to 787 next year. Will see demand, but XLR could do that route, not to mention Ireland, UK etc.


Over the past few decades Airbus has done extraordinary work in developing the ugly duckling stretched A320 into the current A321 swan. This is now an aircraft that can do 90% of the 757 mission with much less structural weight and much lower fuel burn. Less weight plus more current engines equals less fuel required and less fuel required equals lower structural weight, a virtuous circle.
Yeah, there are edge cases where the 757 wins, but for most routes including the closer TATL destinations, the A321 can do the job with similar passenger capacity at much lower trip cost.
Whether DBV will exist as a direct route from anywhere in the US as things return to some semblance of normal is a different question.

Yeah DBV will go back as soon as tourism rebounds. Actually that rout for AA was much more profitable than expected as they were adding slots on the fly last year, and extending season due to demand. XLR would be well suited for that route and other cities on both sides of Adriatic coast, as well as Mediterranean. Then there is Lisbon, Edinburgh, smaller cities in Central Europe, Prague, Budapest etc. Air Transat as far as I know is aiming XLR on YYZ-ZAG for example.
 
Originally Posted by 4WD
Airbus did some of that … and P&W did some of that … (NEO) …


Very good point.
Engine tech matters maybe more than airframe tech.
 
FAA Administrator Stephen Dickson has previously said he personally will be checked out in the MAX prior to approving its return to service. Have to wonder if he will even be around to make that call. As mentioned in the article, US Senator Maria Cantwell (D-WA) of Seattle is the ranking member of the Senate Commerce Committee. Local pundits used to be so accustomed to Senator Cantwell pleading Boeing's case in the Senate, they would identify the party affiliation after her name as (D-Boeing). Not anymore; Senator Cantwell, and the entire committee, appears to have excoriated Mr. Dickson and Boeing today.
https://seattletimes.com/business/b...t-doubt-on-agencys-role-ensuring-safety/
 
The Maxx is an improvement on the ancient 737. As a 737 pilot I love the old girl but I'd like to fly something more modern. I hope they come up with a clean sheet design. I must say the A320 flight deck is much more spacious. The jump seat is even more comfortable. ...‚
 
wpod said:
Any updates on the 37?
Click to expand...
I think one of the biggest issues is purposeful undermining of FAA last several decades, which led to outsourcing of certifications to companies. With this debacle EUropeans and Chinese will do their own certification process which might take more time to get plane in the air.
 
SEMI_287 said:
The Maxx is an improvement on the ancient 737. As a 737 pilot I love the old girl but I'd like to fly something more modern. I hope they come up with a clean sheet design. I must say the A320 flight deck is much more spacious. The jump seat is even more comfortable. ...‚
Click to expand...
I'll guess it would look like other latest model number Boeing aircraft
 
Today (9/8) Boeing released August delivery numbers, and they included another 91 subtractions to the 737 backlog. There were 17 cancellations, and 74 that probably will never be delivered, so removed due to accounting rules. According to the Seattle Times, that makes 955 for the first eight months of 2020.
www.seattletimes.com

Boeing admits a new manufacturing flaw on the 787 and tallies more 737 MAX cancellations

Boeing disclosed a new manufacturing quality issue, this time with assembly of the 787's horizontal tail in Salt Lake City. And the tally of lost MAX orders this year is approaching 1,000 jets.
www.seattletimes.com www.seattletimes.com
 
Hopefully the MAX gets cleared to fly soon.

Will all 787 production be moved to South Carolina ?
 
edyvw said:
787 is already made there. WHich I think might be part of the problem.
Hopefully they nailed fixes and gets cleared, and start figuring out replacement.
Click to expand...
I meant moving the entire 787 production in Washington to South Carolina.
 
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Flew the MAX before the grounding and it was a big upgrade from the rest of the 737 series. Quieter, bigger windows and overall a more enjoyable flight cross country.

I will gladly hop back on this plane once it's flying again. No question it will likely be the safest thing in the sky after this grounding with every design detail under a microscope by multiple agencies, plus more in-depth training and all that.
 
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