2006 Dodge Durango 4.7L ASL 5.30 Amsoil About 15K

[LargeCarManX2]

Latest UOA first and Earlier UOA last.

Report 2
SPECTROCHEMICAL ANALYSIS (ppm)
Lab No
Condition Date
Taken
Tested Time on Oil
Time on Unit

Abnormal 07-NOV-06
21-NOV-06 miles on oil 14,817
Total miles on engine 77,866
Iron 23
Chrom 1
Lead 0
Copper 43
Tin 0
Alum 9
Nick 0
Sil 0
Silcon 18
98
6
24
3469
0
658
929
59
0
0
0
fuel N/A
visc 18.50
A 0
N/A
NO
YES
nit 41.0
oxid 29.0
TBN2.43
A
Report # 1
Analysis Recommendations
AMSOIL 5W30 VISCOSITY IS OUT OF INDICATED GRADE TOTAL BASE NUMBER (TBN) IS LOW. RECOMMEND CHANGE LUBE OIL AND LUBE OIL FILTER, IF NOT ALREADY DONE. ***RESULTS REPORTED BY FAX***



Normal 17-MAY-06
30-MAY-06 Miles on oil 10,628
Miles on engine 60,699
Iron 24
Chro 1
Lead 0
Copper 20
Tin 0
Alum 8
Nic 0
Sil 0
Silicon 17
176
0
27
3546
0
912
1192
87
0
0
0




fuel N/A
visc 12.45
0
N/A
NO
NO
oxid 23.0
nit 19.0
tbn 3.23


AMSOIL 5W30 NO CORRECTIVE ACTION REQUIRED, OIL IS SUITABLE FOR CONTINUED USE. RESAMPLE AT NEXT REGULAR INTERVAL

 

[Donald]

The latest sample has the ASL oil out of grade. ASL (SL rated) would thicken a little but the newer ASL (SM rated) should not or much less.

While this oil is rated to go 25K miles, I guess for your engine you should not go beyond 10-12K.

 

[Pablo]

I would say you should send your buddy to Terry Dyson for true analysis.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Might be a good idea Pablo...Thanks, meanwhile Amsoil said that sodium is high and contaminating the oil which will drive up Nit and Oxid. Dirt ingestion?

 

[Pablo]

Which number is sodium?

 

[Reg# 43897]

You meant silicon, per chance?

John.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

From Amsoil:
Besides elevated NIT and OXID readings the sample shows evidence of sodium contamination which will cause TBN to decrease and viscosity to increase.

Thanks again,

Ed


Pablo, its two down from silicon and the number is 6?

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Can a "6" in the sodium level really cause the TBN to decrease and the viscosity to raise to a 50weight?

 

[Tempest]

Quote:

---

Can a "6" in the sodium level really cause the TBN to decrease and the viscosity to raise to a 50weight?

---

I don't think so: My UOA with a coolant leak.

 

[Pablo]

The Na itself didn't cause the vis to increase and the TBN to fall off, but Na is NOT native in the oil, and it's an indicator that something is messed up.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

The sodium or NA has shown in a few virgin samples of 1 and 2. But, what I am trying to find out is what would cause this level of 6 to happen. If it was antifreeze additive it would show some coolant in the oil sample. It was not coolant or fuel additive...he does not use them. The only other thing Oil Analysers says it could be is dirt injestion. Would it not show some silicon or higher wear metals than reported....Anyone have a different theory?

 

[Pablo]

Tiny coolant leaks show elemental traces long before antifreeze is picked up in a $20 UOA. Could be some high sodium (salts) dirt or ocean spray. Where has this truck been?

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Up and down the West Coast from California to Canada.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Do all the Oil Analysers keep a sample for a limited time if a request for resample is required?

It seems like the TBN, OXID, is a.......squied, OR the ASL is not doing it's thing.... OR maybe just oil analyzers OAI have revamped or re-equipted there lab recently? I really don't think a 6 is sodium NA contamination. Quoted from an original guy..... "Scheech"

 

[Pablo]

I'm not sure if they retain the sample or not. Did you mean to type "skewed"? I wouldn't say that for the oxidation. Seems about right for the miles. I stated my case on the Na. You stated the car was up and down the coast (NaCl spray) and probably in Cali. during the dry season. You don't have to listen to me, but 15K is the max in this application.

I haven't heard back on the TBN lowering....

Has the fellow contacted Terry Dyson yet?

 

[LargeCarManX2]

I think if he could get the 15K without the oil thicking to a 50 weight....he would be happy. TBN and OXID were within limits. Ocean Spray contamination....interesting concept.

He is keeping an eye on his antifreeze consumption "if any" and I have not heard if he is going to contact Terry yet. He is trying the ASL again and will do another UOA "I imagine" around 12K. He really likes Amsoil and I am sure a valued customer for life.

 

[TeeDub]

Levels of sodium of 15-25 ppm can simply be due to ingestion of salt spray, or from road salt in Northern climates. In this case the trace amounts of sodium are a non-issue....

In this particular analysis, the levels of oxidation/nitration are sky high. Those levels are the reason for the oxidative thickening (high solids) and the low TBN (acid buildup).

There are couple of inexpensive things you can do here...basically the idea is to make sure the engine is tuned up and running as soundly as possible. I'd also check the function of the PCV/EGR valves and make sure they aren't partially clogged with varnish or carbon deposits.
I'd check to make sure the cooling system has been flushed/serviced and the engine isn't running too hot. One of the direct causes of abnormal nitration are excessively high cylinder head temps, for example.

As a general rule, running long drain intervals in a gas guzzling V-8 with a small sump is very hard. This is simply due to the # of fuel you burn over a given number of miles. All things being equal (sump size and engine power density), the more fuel you burn, the more quickly the oil becomes contaminated.

I'd suggest trying the Amsoil Series 3000, 5w30 this application and testing it after 12,000 miles. If it's severely degraded after 12k miles of driving, then you're not going to do any better in terms of OCI's....

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Thanks TeeDub, good sound advice...good to have you on the board

 

[TeeDub]

LCM,

I work in a related area, so this data is of keen interest to me....