2004.5 Dodge Cummins Esso XD# 0w-40 12,500km with frantz bypass

[cak446]

I found a place in town that will do oil analysis with TBN for $11.75 (First truck Center in Edmonton). They have an onsite testing machine, and can get your results in less than an hour. I was little skeptical so I bought a kit from Stavely Services for 16.95(no tbn) to compare.

The truck had 33872km and 532 hours and the oil had 12500km and 182 hours. This oil was changed on March 4 and had been used since November. I changed the TP @ 5500km and 9000km. This truck has a AFE proguard 7 intake system.

Here are the results, the first numbers are from First truck Center and the second are from Staveleyservices

Iron_______36 - 42
Chromium _ 0 - 14
Lead _____ 2 - 11
Copper ___ 6 - 13
Tin ______ 0 - 12
Aluminum _ 5 - 16
Nickel ___ 0 - NA
Silver ___ 1 - NA
Silicon __ 9 - 23
Boron ____ 3 - NA
Sodium ___ 4 - 17
Magnesium 13 - NA
Calcium 2991 - NA
Barium ___ 2 - NA
Phosphorus 1480 NA
Zinc ____ 1731 NA
Moly ______ 0 - 0
Titanium _ 0 - NA
Vanadium __ 0 - 0
Potassium 0 - 20
Fuel ______ 0 - NA
Vis 100oC 12.82 14.5
Water ____ 0 -- 0
Soot __ .95 - 1.3
Glycol ___ 0 - 0
TBN _____ NA - 9.6
Oxidation NA - 2.9
Nitration NA - 1

Well it goes without saying that I won't be using the First Truck Center for oil analysis again.

Overall nothing to exciting. I will continue to change oil at the recommended intervals of 12,000km. I will be running PetroCanada Duron 15w40 for the summer. Once I use up my supply I plan on trying Esso XD3 15w40

Staveley Services sells a kit with TBN for $20, but you have to buy in quanties of 10, and they are only good for 2 years. I won't use 10 kits in two years. Anyone in Edmonton or Saskatoon, want to go in together on pack of 10 kits?

Carl

[ April 06, 2005, 03:28 PM: Message edited by: cak446 ]

 

[srivett]

Detroit Diesel repackages Stabely UOAs for about that price in Sudbury. Their Edmonton analysis address is 10716-176 Street, sound familiar? I don't know if you get TBN or not. I haven't used mine yet. Anyway, it must suck using an entire flat of oil every 12,000 km. Have you considered going further on an OCI?

Steve

 

[Stinky Peterson]

I don't have much faith in the truck shop oil analysis but in this case their results look more like what I would expect for a normal diesel engine. The second results indicate some possible serious problems. Are you sure you don't have them switched around?

I've never seen chrome be 14 in anything that didn't have severe dirt entry or a ball or roller bearing failing. Even with moderate dirt entry it only goes up a couple of ppm. Normal levels should be around 1 or 2. The soft bearing metals are high enough to indicate possible abnormal bearing wear and sodium and potassium are high enough to make me suspect coolant entry. Silicon levels too are higher than expected and may be indicating dirt or coolant entry. The viscosity looks better on the second sample.

Please post the comments from both analysis.

Just my opinion but I wouldn't spend the money for TBN unless you are running way out on the miles/km. Use it for more frequent sampling and increase your chances of finding common problems like dirt, fuel, glycol.

 

[cak446]

My mistake, I had them backwards, the Stavely Services results are in the first numbers. It is the results from First truck center that are out to lunch.

The comments for both samples were the standard everything is allright and no corrective action required.

Car

 

[cak446]

quote:

---

Originally posted by srivett:
Detroit Diesel repackages Stabely UOAs for about that price in Sudbury. Their Edmonton analysis address is 10716-176 Street, sound familiar? I don't know if you get TBN or not. I haven't used mine yet. Anyway, it must suck using an entire flat of oil every 12,000 km. Have you considered going further on an OCI?

Steve

---

That's the correct address. I picked my Stavely kit up from Diamond truck Center in Edmonton. The guys there were clueless about oil analysis. When I picked up my kit I asked what all gets tested and if it includes TBN. They didn't know anything about the actual tests, but they were sure that TBN was tested. TBN wasn't tested.

From now on I want to buy my kits directly from Stavley, since they actually know what they are talking about.

I don't want to go any further on my OCI until my truck is off warranty.

Carl

[ April 07, 2005, 12:03 PM: Message edited by: cak446 ]

 

[cak446]

I had two oil analysis done that day at First Truck center. The other analysis was for my 87 6.2L diesel. The results from the UOA were a little more respectable, but I still have no faith in the results

They are as follows:

1987 Suburban 6.2L diesel 262000km, 4900km on the oil. The oil had been in the truck for a about 16 months but the truck was parked for over a year. PetroCanada 15w40 with SuperTech filter and Baldwin B50 bypass filter.

Aluminum 3
Chromium 4
Copper 5
Iron 53
Lead 11
Tin Silicon 13
Potassium Sodium 14
Moly Water 0.3
Oxidation 2.8
Visc 100C 14.5
Glycol ND
TBN 8.4
Nitration Soot 1.3


Carl

 

[Stinky Peterson]

quote:

---

Originally posted by cak446:
My mistake, I had them backwards, the Stavely Services results are in the first numbers. It is the results from First truck center that are out to lunch.

The comments for both samples were the standard everything is allright and no corrective action required.

Car

---

That's what I suspected, the results from Staveley (formerly CTC) are what I would expect.

I didn't realize the truck shop analysis were that bad but then the prudent person shouldn't expect a do-all machine to replace a half million dollars worth of lab equipment and the training and knowledge required to make it run. I wonder how many dollars are wasted chasing down problems that don't exist?

 

[BlazerLT]

ld you be moving from 0w40 to 15w40 for no reason?

They are all 40 weights at operating temperature.

 

[Cyprs]

I do 5K kms OCI on my 92 Cummins diesel with paper fleetgaurd filter. With dino oils XD3 15-40, Duron 15-40 oils on three separate OCIs my wear metals on iron is 5 parts per million. I now have 0-40 XD3 in this engine with 3K kms, will change it out in another 2K, I am a little worried, I do expect a few more part per million on 0-40 XD3 because of some cold starts. I am kinda bracing myself now (possibly needlessly) after seeing this XD3 0-40 result, just bought 3 more kits Kramer Cat oil analysis kits other day in Swift Current, 18.00 per kit postage paid and taxes paid.

I will post my dino XD3, duron dino and 0-40 XD3 when I do the analysis on 0-40 on spring OCI.

I look at my 5K OCI, on two 5 OCI I have total of 10 parts per million iron, I virtually have no other parts per million metal wear at 5.5K oci.

It is a 92 Dodge Cummins diesel 12 valve with 170K kms, my toltal part per million on lead in about 20K OCI is 20 part total, is it fair to add up all parts per million on 4 separate OCI that = 20K to compare in fairness

?

I am nervous now about my XD3 0-40 results now, I am very curious on my future 0-40 results, I just bought 1 flat 0-40 XD3 syn and two flats XD3 15-40 dino for summer time blend of 33/66.

Of interest, on my OCI, Duron dino did superior job to XD3 dino on soot control. Duron also matched XD3 equally, my viscosity on both oils was in latter 14, around 14.7 visc at 100C, both very equal in dino except soot.

Was this XD3 0-40 cold harsh winter driving and starts?

Cyprs

 

[Cyprs]

I meant to say my total "iron" (not lead, sorry) is 20 parts per million on 20K kms parts per million.

Cyprs

 

[cak446]

Yeah, there was a few cold starts. I always try to plug in my truck in the winter, but there is always a couple of times when that is not possible. I hope to install a diesel heater by next winter. Overall it was a mild winter, and my truck was in the bodyshop for 4 weeks in during the coldest weather in January.

I don't thing the 36ppm of iron is that bad. The engine could still be breaking in. I also have a heavy right foot, and tend to drive my vehicles quite hard (once it has reached operating tempature, of course). The iron count on Diesel UOA's always seem to be higher than the majority of the Gas UOA's

I will be taking UOA's at every OCI, so I will have a better idea on how everying performing as I put on the miles.

BlazerLT, I run 15W40 in the summer because it is cheaper, and just as good IMHO, since they basically use the same additive pack for the different grades of oil.

Carl

 

[Cyprs]

Do you mean a pan heater next winter? I am putting one on the oil pan and tranny pan (auto), forever to get into OD in winter. I am putting one on X-Trail pan and tranny too, I will need 4, customers and friends need atleat 7 too. I am talking Wolverine heat pads, buy over 10 and get 40 % off. It can be -40 C, you can plug in this heat pad on -40 engine for 5 hours, oil is operating temp, interior engine parts +65F, no burning of oil, do not have to plug pan heater in after shut down, 250 watts for 12 litre oil pan for 5 hours compared to overnight at 850 watts on block heater and oil froze.

If I only started truck near plug in I would not bother with 0-40 syn, 15-40 dino would be perfect, but not a perfect world, may have to start up in -40 parked at a mall or where ever.

I can send the link to wolverine if you want it Carl. I will post my 0-40 XD3 results in a month or two, I am real curious on 0-40 syn compared to 15-40 dino, this current 0-40 XD3 is my first OCI with it in this Cummins.

Cyprs

 

[cak446]

The diesel fired heaters I am talking about are the ones from Espar http://www.espar.com/htm/Specs/water/wterheat.htm They allow you to warm up your truck anywhere, without plugging in.

I have had a woverine oil pan heater on my Suburban since 97. I orginally put it on so I could use 15w40 year round. But since 5w40, and 0w40 oil has come out I have been using them during the winter. The oil pan heater is not a replacement for the block heater however. It just doesn't transfer enough heat to the block. It is an excellent supplement to the block heater though. With both heaters, I never really don't need to plug more than 2 or 3 hours in the winter. Instead of plugging the truck in all night, I use a timer and set it to turn on for 2 or 3 hours before I leave.

Carl

 

[Cyprs]

Thanks for the link and tip on Wolverine Carl, I thought the wovering would be enough, they claim the inside of block will be +65F with a 6 hour plugin in -40C. Guess cutting the block heater time by a full night is still a good deal.

Just changed the 0-40 XD3 out of my 92 Dodge Cummins, my full oil pressure reading at full speed was the idle point on guage. My idle pressure was below the safe range. My pressure was great when cold but now that weather warms it is low, I know more syn oil flows with less pressure but I chickened out at these 4K kms. I went to my 33/66 0-40 XD3 syn to 15-40 XD3 dino, will post that OCI analysis mid summer. I just Did sample on my winter use on this 0-40 XD3 too, will post results in a week or two when I get results.

Thanks Carl,

Cyprs