Thinking about doing ahome made pre-oiler.

[Y2KOTA]

Looking for info on how they work, what others have done, photos and so on.

Going to install it on my 2000 Dodge Dakota.

P.S is there a section in the forums for pre-oilers?

 

[Gary Allan]

Here's one type

The example shows it as a surge/sag oil pressure protector. It is also used as a preoiler by manipulation of the valve.

You would have a hard time home growing this. Other preoilers are pumps. These too would be hard to fab up out of "homey" parts.

 

[slalom44]

I used a ShurFlo #2088-343-135 pump that I picked up from Northern Tool. This is a 3GPM 12 volt diaphragm pump. It is rated at 170 F max temperature but I've used it on a hot engine dozens of times without hurting it. I called the manufacturer to make sure it would work. It has a built-in check valve, and a pressure switch that can kick it off at whatever you set it at (factory setting is at 45 psi) and it kicks on 20 psi lower.

I have it rigged up temporarily to a toggle switch to turn it on before I turn the ignition on. When the pressure builds up, I start the car and turn the switch off. I have the switch routed through a relay switch so I don't have all that current running from the battery, to the switch, to the pump, then back to the battery. I just tapped into a fuse box under the hood.

When I have more time, I've got an interval timer that I'm going to install so I don't have to flip the toggle switch. The timer will turn the pump on when you turn the key part-way, but not crank the starter. The timer sends current to the pump for a preset amount of time (say, 15 seconds). You can crank the engine when the pressure builds up, and the pump will usually automatically turn off due to the pressure switch. But the timer is there to prevent the pump from kicking back on when the pressure is lower (hot engine idle).

I'm going to set it up this way so that I don't have to worry about it if someone else drives my car. Besides; although the toggle switch works well, sometimes I forget to turn it off and the pump kicks in later when I'm stopped at a stoplight (I have a LED light on my A-pillar that tells me the pump is on).

The pump pulls oil from the drain plug hole. I picked up a fitting from BATINC.net that fits the drain plug hole. I have the pump discharging into the inlet of an Amsoil Dual Remote Bypass Filer. So not only do I have immediate oil pressure, I also have super-clean oil as well.

 

[phordguy]

Wow thanks! This pump would be great for rebuilt engines for pressurizing with oil and classics that always set up in the garage. You could run the pump every so often to keep the engine from corroding inside and with a bypass filter setup to remove the condensate from the oil. It would be a great pump for air to water intercoolers too.

Hmmm

 

[snoboy]

Slalom, that looks just like my RV water pump which is also made by ShurFlo.

 

[oldman]

http://www2.northerntool.com/product-1/527.htm

Yes that is it. Great idea slalom44

 

[Y2KOTA]

Thanks for the info guys! Thats a great start.

 

[JIM361]

I'm also looking to make a pre-oiler and found a pump made by Mocal. It's a diaphragm style pump and has a max temp of 300 Deg F ( not continuous ), 1 to 2 GPM , 54 psi max , 3/8 NPT fittings , 12 volts , 8 amps.
Dont know what viscosity oil this pump can handle for cold pre oiling.
Jim

 

[slalom44]

Originally posted by JIM361:

quote:

---

I'm also looking to make a pre-oiler and found a pump made by Mocal. It's a diaphragm style pump and has a max temp of 300 Deg F ( not continuous ), 1 to 2 GPM , 54 psi max , 3/8 NPT fittings , 12 volts , 8 amps.

---

I had looked at this pump, and it appears to be a better pump than the one I mentioned above. But at over twice the price and a lower flow rate, I settled for the cheapter route.

The Mocal pump goes for $185.00

http://www.batinc.net/files/pump.pdf

I bought mine for $69.99. The price has increased a little since I bought mine, but the ShurFlo pump is still a lot cheaper. FloJet also makes a pump that can be used for this application, but the max temps were lower than this ShurFlo.

I've had this setup for about 6 months and 8500 miles now with no problems.

 

[Y2KOTA]

OK, let me see if I get this right, I can plum in a pump into the remote oil & by-pass filter set up and use a pre-oiler.

How will the oil pump in the motor deal with this? Will it allow the oil to pass thru it? Or will it hender the flow by the pre-oiler pump?

 

[slalom44]

Good question, Y2KOTA. Your engine's mechanical oil pump is a positive displacement pump that can't let oil flow through it when it is not turning. Here is a picture of a typical oil pump:

The pinion gear in the center is turned (usually) by the camshaft, and squeezes the oil to the filter. Since there is no direct path for oil to get past this gear, oil can't flow backwards when the engine is idle.

I installed an oil pressure gauge on my car, and confirmed that oil pressure definitely builds up rather than seeping past the engine's oil pump.

As for the prelube pump: The Shur-Flo pump that I posted previously has a built-in check valve that is rated at 200 psi. I confirmed this when I called Shur-Flo. This is a one-way valve that only allows the oil to flow in one direction. So once the car is running, all of the oil passes through the filter and into the engine. None of it goes through the prelube pump into the oil pan.

 

[Y2KOTA]

How the oil feed to the pre-oiler pump plumed? I understand all the plumming when using it with a by-filter but not where to feed the pre-oiler pump??? Is the oil pulled directly from the oil pan to the by-pass pump then to the remote and bypass-filter? Of corse using check valves to pervent oil feeding back to the stock pump when pre lubing? And pervent oil feeding back into prelube pump when the motor is running.

I think I spit that out clearly

Yea I posted this at noon, but I work the graveyard shift. I need to get some

Here is what I have set-up now..... My install on my Dakota.


Thanks for the help!

P.S. Neat idea for a back up oil pump if the stock dies

Edited Link

Y2Kota, suggest you read this before you make any more links: http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=27;t=000029

[ January 03, 2005, 11:49 AM: Message edited by: 59 Vetteman ]

 

[terryr]

There was a website where a fellow used a propane cylinder and an industrial valve to make an accusump type unit, and explained it all. When the car shut off the valve closed and when you turned the key on it was still pressurized.

I had a computer crash and lost the link.

 

[trynew]

Many years ago, I bought a pre-oiler (I think called OIL WELL, from a new company that used a plastic piston inside a cylinder to create pressure. However, the cylinder kept cracking and spraying my engine with oil. Fortunately, they refunded my money before they went out of the pre-oiler business.

Then I tried building my own as you described. I think I used a grease gun hose with an electric solonoid valve attached to the cylinder. However, if I remember correctly, my cylinder kept filling up with oil which left too little room for enough air to compress and provide the push for enough oil for the next start up. I finally gave up and took it off. I still have the cylinder and the electic shut-off valve sitting in my garage.

I still think it is a good idea to start an engine with oil pressure present, but enough is enough.

 

[slalom44]

Originally posted by Y2KOTA:

quote:

---

How the oil feed to the pre-oiler pump plumed?

---

This is how I did mine: Using a hollow drain plug, I ran a low pressure hose from the oil pan into the prelube pump. A hydraulic hose was run from the prelube pump to an 8AN tee fitting which is screwed into the BMK-13 housing at the oil inlet. The other line going to the tee fitting came from the oil filter adapter which is screwed into the stock oil filter location. The "Out" line from the BMK-13 unit goes back to the post-filter port on the filter adapter.

Here's how it works: The prelube pump gets its oil from the oilpan, but when the engine is running the engine's oil pump is feeding oil from the oil filter inlet port to the BMK-13 unit. A check valve in the prelube pump prevents the oil from going the wrong way through the prelube pump.

 

[Fuelrod]

S44 That's really slick! I have used that pump to provide domestic water for 10 years with No Failures! 60,000 gallons or more!

The only weakness I see is your supply line. Any failure there and it's a disaster...Vibration, snags, road debris, You gotta be careful with that...

Another idea. A hydralic accumulator. It's a closed vessel with an air space. When running, the engine would "charge" the accumulator with pressurized oil. Then, when you wanted to pre-lube a cold engine, you would activate a solenoid valve and let the pressurized oil into the galleries...Limited oil volume, but no pump required....Accumulators come in many sizes..

Your pump system would allow a 5 minute oil change without having to get under the vehicle! A simple "T" fitting and a valve.

 

[Y2KOTA]

Somthing about feed offthe drain plug and all the crud sitting at the lowest point in the pan

Then again it is being pumped thur the by-pass fillter set up.

Guess I could "T" off of the drain valve.

 

[slalom44]

Originally posted by Y2KOTA:

quote:

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Guess I could "T" off of the drain valve.

---

I considered that as well because I have one of those Fumoto valves. But the Fumoto is soft brass and I was leary about it cracking off.

I'm a little embarrassed to say that I am currently using something similar. I'm using a Fram SureDRAIN valve. It works fine, but it restricts oil flow too much. Besides, I'm worried about it failing as well. It is going to be replaced with a nice Mocal Male-to-AN fitting at my next oil change.

Fuelrod makes a good point - if you snag that plug or line at the bottom of your oilpan, you're screwed. Mine happens to come out sideways like Y2KOTA shows. If not, I'd probably put some type of protector plate to prevent it from being snagged.

 

[Y2KOTA]

The Fumoto valve on there is about 4 years old and just as good as day one. Have one on my wifes 2000 neon also.