Recent Topics
Electra Glide
by bigdreama
44 minutes 51 seconds ago
Different finish on remans from same company?
by spavel6
Today at 02:38 PM
Quick survey: which cars are toe-adjustable only?
by lizpat
Today at 02:24 PM
Help me diagnose a bad CV joint
by Klutch9
Today at 02:10 PM
Tire Protectant - Shine?
by Nick1994
Today at 01:40 PM
Scroll wheel adjusts sound in Mint
by MONKEYMAN
Today at 01:36 PM
Octane Question
by SilverSurfer
Today at 12:05 PM
Scan tool doesn't agree with gauge
by Dave Sherman
Today at 11:56 AM
Sams Club MC - $40 off of first $100 spend 4/3-4/4
by Q451990
Today at 11:49 AM
What's your frankenbrew???
by 29662
Today at 11:43 AM
OBD scanner special on Groupon
by Bob_E
Today at 11:40 AM
Accel SAE 40 Oil on Amazon
by anl0109
Today at 11:37 AM
Newest Members
John_Diggle, MRKSTRK, 2015, gonzoe123, Bobi
53383 Registered Users
Who's Online
111 registered (4_Fun, 02s4audi, 29662, 38Chevy454, Al, 1 FMF, 10 invisible), 1964 Guests and 201 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
53383 Members
66 Forums
228995 Topics
3659854 Posts

Max Online: 2862 @ 07/07/14 03:10 PM
Donate to BITOG
Topic Options
#586673 - 02/16/04 07:28 AM Detroit Diesel Series 60 - DDEC3 450hp@1900rpm
Doug Hillary Offline


Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 4923
Loc: Airlie Beach Australia
This vehicle is an International-IVECO S3600 prime mover. It is used on city pick up and delivery work at 42500kg GCM

Delvac 1 5w-40
Kms on oil - 27,344
Kms on filters - 27,344
Time on oil - 13 months
Total kms on engine - 902,486

Sample date - 2/4/04

Aluminum - 2
Chromium - 6
Iron - 87
Copper - 4
Lead - 30
Silver - 0
Silicon - 9
Sodium - 10

Vis@40C - 114
PQ Index - 3
Nitration - 63 ( Abs/cm)
Water % - 0%
Soot index - 3.5
TBN - 3.4 ( D4739 )

Please advise how you view this oil which was changed at this point

Regards

Top
#586674 - 03/05/04 04:24 AM Re: Detroit Diesel Series 60 - DDEC3 450hp@1900rpm
TooSlick Offline


Registered: 08/02/02
Posts: 5785
Loc: Dixie
This sample is showing slight thickening from oxidation/nitration and soot, so I would have changed it based on this data and the low TBN. Again, the wear performance looks very good although the wear rates are much higher than for over the road service. Have you looked at correlating rates of lead wear and TBN depletion? It may start to increase when the TBN gets down to 4-5 ....

If you could significantly reduce the soot levels with bypass filtration, I believe you'd see a 25%-33% drop in the iron wear and the lead would go down as well....

Finally, I think if you keep track of total fuel consumption between oil changes, you'd find it a better way to gauge oil changes with this type of short trip service than mileage. You really want to account for all that time spent idling ....

TS

Top
#586675 - 03/06/04 07:11 AM Re: Detroit Diesel Series 60 - DDEC3 450hp@1900rpm
Doug Hillary Offline


Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 4923
Loc: Airlie Beach Australia
Hi,
Ted - thanks for your reply please note the following;

Use - This vehicle/engine has been in a "downgraded" task for the last three years and in the hands of my Senior Driver. During this time the vehicle has averaged 31kms per OCI of an averaged 13 months - see below under "Past History of this engine"

Detroit Diesel's recommended OCI is 10kkms for an engine in this application and we have tripled this using Delvac 1 and UOAs
Very little idling time is a factor in its use

Oil use - oil consumption has averaged 3000kms/litre, extremely good in this application

Oil viscosity - yes the oil did thicken but this is normal and well within Detroit/Mobil limits

Filters - This engine does NOT HAVE a MANN-HUMMEL centrifuge by-pass filter fitted The FF filters are Donaldson Extended Life Filters ( ELF3998) which are not changed during the OCI ( 13months, 31kkms )

Soot level - the soot level of 3.5 is nearing our upper limit of 3.9 but "normal"

Past History of this engine ( since 2000 ):

Col 1 = average at OCI ( three UOA's )
Col 2 = average of all ten UOA's
Col 3 = highest of all ten UOA's
Col 4 = lowest of all ten UOA's
Col 5 = last sample ( posted above in this thread )

Aluminium 3 - 2 - 3 - 2 - (2)
Chromium 6 - 5 - 6 - 4 - (6)
Iron 94 - 70 - 108 - 32 - (87)
Copper 4 - 3 - 5 - 2 - (4)
Lead 26 - 13 - 18 - 4 - (30)
Silicon 22 - 26 - 60 - 5 - (9)
Sodium 13 - 13 - 18 - 4 - (10)

Vis@40C 108 - 101 - 122 - 94 - (114)
Soot % 3.57 - 3.34 - 3.9 - 2.3 - (3.5)
TBN 3.4 - 4.63 - 6.60 - 3.1 - (3.4)

This early ( 1996 ) Detroit Series 60 DDEC3 engine and Delvac 1 has been an incredible COST EFFECTIVE combination. If a mineral oil had been used in this application it would have required oil and filter changes at about 10kkms or less

Sadly, this vehicle which is an "International S3600/Navistar/IVECO" is about to be disposed of as it is nearing 7 years old and my oldest, but it is my favourite!

Regards
Doug [Cheers!]

Top