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#465814 - 08/18/02 07:38 AM Non-Detergent motor oil
satterfi Offline


Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 903
Loc: CA
My pressure washer pump calls for non-detergent 30w oil. Why do pumps, compressors and gear boxes call for non-detergent oil?

The stuff I bought today is SA rated rated and has no additives. It seems like there should be something better than that.

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#465815 - 08/18/02 08:32 AM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
Bror Jace Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 4998
Loc: Saratoga, NY
There is. Amalie makes an SB straight-weight series of oils which are non detergent but have a good deal of ZDDP in them.

--- Bror Jace

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#465816 - 08/18/02 11:17 PM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 15676
Loc: Iowegia - USA
This is a repost:

Non-detergent oils (mostly type SA) are used whenever other additives are not need, i.e., when only basic lubrication is needed, or the lubricant would mix with the other fluids in the system and pose toxicity or contamination problems. The SA oils contain only an anti-foaming agent which is silicone-based chemical. The silicone additive is very inert and nontoxic.

If your mechines call for non-detergent oils, do not use an SB oil. An SB oil contain an extra additive in addition to the silicone component, a friction modifier which is usiually ZDDP. ZDDP can be toxic if ingested and at the least, a skin irritant.

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#465817 - 08/18/02 11:25 PM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 15676
Loc: Iowegia - USA
In addition, the other additives, such as detergent/dispersants, and antioxidants, are not needed because the internals do not see hig temps or combustion by-pass gasses.

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#465818 - 08/19/02 02:58 AM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
GeorgeCLS Offline


Registered: 07/30/02
Posts: 531
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
I would highly suggest you get some Mobil DTE Heavy oil or other R&O (Schaeffer's, etc.) oil for your 30W needs. (I think Grainer has Heavy in quarts) The base oils used in a 30W ND engine oil are poor, at best. Using a high quality base stock oil will keep the pump clean, lubricate better and last much longer. Even better would be to get some Mobil SHC 627 or other synthetic neutral oil which would provide a cooler running pump. However, that is only sold in 5 gallon containers and very expensive...

[ August 19, 2002, 05:59 PM: Message edited by: GeorgeCLS ]

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#465819 - 08/19/02 08:48 AM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
satterfi Offline


Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 903
Loc: CA
George

What's R&O? It sounds like you're saying I should use hydraulic or gear oils. How about vacuum pump oil or air compressor oil (Rarus 827)

I can also use SAE 20 in the pump. I've got Mobil 1 SGL (75w-90)on the shelf. How about that?

Thanks for the advice. I'll use the ND 30 to flush the pump out.

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#465820 - 08/19/02 05:16 PM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3324
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
quote:
Originally posted by satterfi:
George

What's R&O? It sounds like you're saying I should use hydraulic or gear oils. How about vacuum pump oil or air compressor oil (Rarus 827)

I can also use SAE 20 in the pump. I've got Mobil 1 SGL (75w-90)on the shelf. How about that?

Thanks for the advice. I'll use the ND 30 to flush the pump out.

R&O - rust-and-oxidation inhibited. A term applied to highly refined industrial lubricating oils formulated for long service in circulating systems, compressors, hydraulic systems, bearing housings, gear cases, etc. The finest R&O oils are often referred to as turbine oils.

They can also be used in Hydraulic and Gear and Bearing applications. These fluids are usually less expensive than AW(Anti-wear) fluids. The Non-detergent(usually meaning ashless) is called for in certain applications where incidental contact with food or skin(eyes) can come into play. Since ZDDP is the most used AW detergent, eye contact can become a major concern.

Amsoil markets a line of R&O oils that are non-detergent,and contain ashless anti-wear additives to provide an additional layer of protection against wear in sever conditions. Since they are mostly used for industrial applications they are only available in 5 gal pails and greater.

[ August 20, 2002, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: msparks ]

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#465821 - 08/20/02 02:42 AM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
satterfi Offline


Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 903
Loc: CA
I run this thing 1 hr/yr. It takes 200ml. A quart would last 5 years if I change it after every use. A 5 gallon pail would last over 100 yrs, unless I got Alzheimer's. Then it might last 200 years.

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#465822 - 08/20/02 07:01 PM Re: Non-Detergent motor oil
widman Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 3133
Loc: Bolivia
Oils for this equipment is normally sold by ISO viscosity. SAE 30 is ISO 100 (you can see on Bob's chart elsewhere on this site). The oils mentioned are excellent starts, I have several products from Group I, Group II (Chevron GST for outstanding value) and Full Synthetics for higher economy and longer use.
Some compressors, normally screw compressors cannot take high levels of zinc.
Often when "non-detergent oil" is recommended it is to eliminate the absorbtion of moisture, so R&O oils and Hydraulic oils normally have demulsifiers instead of emulsifiers so that moisture will settle out, allowing draining and avoiding contact with internal parts. Engine oils are designed to absorb water and burn it off.
You will more likely find what you need in small quantities at your local compressor or equipment store labeled as compressor oil ISO 100.

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