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#3326 - 07/21/02 10:02 AM BMW Z3 & API SH
con carne Offline


Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 60
Loc: British Columbia
I just had a look in the manual for my sister's year 2000 BMW Z3 to see what the recommended oil is - API SH! It does not state ANY other API service classification whatsoever, only SH.

My question is:

How many current API gasoline oils actually have anti-wear additives at the SH levels? I know I have seen where it says on bottle of an SL oil that it meets SH & SG specs., and am wondering if this is true and not just marketing. (motorcycle users etc.) Does anyone know what the anti-wear levels were for the SH spec. way back when?

[ July 22, 2002, 01:09 AM: Message edited by: con carne ]

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#3327 - 07/22/02 03:22 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
widman Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 3071
Loc: Bolivia
I think a lot of the difference is in when manuals are published for given models and certain considerations for what will be available where the cars will be sold. SL far surpasses the SH in protection. There is probably a lot of uncoordination for the printing also.

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#3328 - 07/22/02 10:10 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
con carne Offline


Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 60
Loc: British Columbia
I ma not sure that I follow you - this is a car that was new in the year 2000.

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#3329 - 07/24/02 10:53 PM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3324
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
quote:
Originally posted by con carne:
I ma not sure that I follow you - this is a car that was new in the year 2000.

I would say go find a BMW motorcycle dealer. They should have SH rated oil's there becuase that is what the BMW bikes call for also.

It that doesn't work look for Castrol motorcycle oil's, or a diesel oil, Delvac 1 (mobil 1's version for Diesels) would be probably the best choice for you.

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#3330 - 07/24/02 10:55 PM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3324
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
quote:
Originally posted by widman:
SL far surpasses the SH in protection.

I disagree, I believe the Z and Ph has been cut dramatically in the SL oil's.

SH oil is recommended for most Motorcycles. Including BMW.

Take a Look at a diesel oil, If you can't find Delvac 1 look at Chevron Delo, in a semi-synthetic or full synthetic.

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#3331 - 07/25/02 07:22 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
con carne Offline


Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 60
Loc: British Columbia
msparks,

This is my understanding as well. I believe it to be the true reason that BMW has recommended this and I really cannot believe that the owner's manual is that far out of date. I am really not even sure if they built a Z3 in 1993 or whenever it was that SH was out.

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#3332 - 07/25/02 07:54 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
GROUCHO MARX Offline


Registered: 07/24/02
Posts: 11410
Loc: The Sandhills of NewYorkistan
Am I reading this thread wrong, or are the respondents referring to a motorcycle, while the poster is referring to a car? [Patriot]

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#3333 - 07/25/02 08:15 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
BOBISTHEOILGUY Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 1874
Loc: Ocala, Florida
FYI, SH was current until 96/97 when API adopted the new SJ and had lowered the antiwear limits at that time.

Groucho,
Welcome to the board!

To answer your question.../comment...
Yes, and no. They are responding to the fact that a m/c shop/dealer would more likely carry an older SH api oil than find one anywhere else as the oils are now up to the SL level. ie..SH,SJ now SL.

Each of these revisions made significant changes.
Sh to sj antiwear additives were lower'd as one aspect, sj to sl, better base stock requirements closing the gap between the mineral base stocks and the so called full synth base stocks. ie.. flashpoints and so forth.

[ July 25, 2002, 11:17 PM: Message edited by: BOBISTHEOILGUY ]

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#3334 - 07/25/02 08:35 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
GROUCHO MARX Offline


Registered: 07/24/02
Posts: 11410
Loc: The Sandhills of NewYorkistan
Thanks for the welcome Bob. When the question was posted about the year of the car, I thought the there was some continuing misunderstanding, further confusing me was the reference to the diesel oil for use in a M/C.

I think, I follow this thread now, I think? [Cheers!]

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#3335 - 07/25/02 09:03 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
BOBISTHEOILGUY Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 1874
Loc: Ocala, Florida
Reason for the diesel oil refference is that the standard gas (api SL) oils have the lower levels of zddp antiwear additives where as a diesel oil (api ch-4/ci-4) tend to have higher levels of antiwear additives thus the alternative.

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#3336 - 07/25/02 09:09 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
GROUCHO MARX Offline


Registered: 07/24/02
Posts: 11410
Loc: The Sandhills of NewYorkistan
And motorcycles have a greater need for such additives I take it?

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#3337 - 07/25/02 09:16 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
satterfi Offline


Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 903
Loc: CA
quote:
Originally posted by GROUCHO MARX:
And motorcycles have a greater need for such additives I take it?

Probably

But they aren't subject to CAFE either. So the manufacturer can recommend what's best for the engine without considering fuel mileage.

Which is why I ignore recommendations for motor oil grades for my cars and use the stuff I like in my bikes.

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#3338 - 07/25/02 09:16 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
geo Offline


Registered: 07/22/02
Posts: 62
Loc: USA
The phosphorus limits in the form of ZDDP imposed by SJ/SL only pertain to 0/5W-20 and 5/10W-30 oils. Manufacturers are not required to reduce ZDDP levels in their other viscosity oils.

[ July 26, 2002, 12:21 AM: Message edited by: geo ]

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#3339 - 07/25/02 09:23 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
con carne Offline


Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 60
Loc: British Columbia
Yes I believe you are correct - this manual recommends "0W-X" and "5W-X" oils. It also states that a "10W-X" can be used where cold starting is not an issue. (they did give a temperature for this, I forget what it was) I phoned the dealer and they told me that the "X" stands for 30 and that they recommend 5W30 synthetic.

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#3340 - 07/25/02 05:38 PM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3324
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
quote:
Originally posted by GROUCHO MARX:
Am I reading this thread wrong, or are the respondents referring to a motorcycle, while the poster is referring to a car? [Patriot]

I am referring to the BMW motorcycle oil which is SH rated. Which could also be of use in the BMW Automobile, which he is calling for an SH rated oil!. Just don't tell his car its made for motorcycle's [Duh!]

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#3341 - 07/25/02 05:41 PM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3324
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
quote:
Originally posted by satterfi:

But they aren't subject to CAFE either. So the manufacturer can recommend what's best for the engine without considering fuel mileage.

[/QB]

Does Argentina have CAFE ratings??? I doubt it.

If he was in the usa, I would probably recommend Amsoil or something else. But I don't know exactly what they have in Argentina

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#3342 - 07/25/02 05:44 PM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
msparks Offline


Registered: 06/11/02
Posts: 3324
Loc: Clarksville, Tennessee
quote:
Originally posted by con carne:
Yes I believe you are correct - this manual recommends "0W-X" and "5W-X" oils. It also states that a "10W-X" can be used where cold starting is not an issue.

That is so odd that they have 0w-X. In my owners manual for my BMW (motorcycle) they list it the other way.

X-W40 and X-W50 (where as X being any number between 0 and 20.

The way I read what you wrote would be you can use a 0,5,10 W X which could be -30, -40, -50.

I would say my best guess for a lube for you car would be 0w40 which I believe is the most popular lube in Europe right now. not many make it here in the states though.

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#3343 - 07/26/02 06:33 AM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
con carne Offline


Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 60
Loc: British Columbia
msparks,

I did had the same question about the viscosities and that was what prompted me to contact the BMW dealership - they told me what they recommend and what they use for these vehicles. (5W30 Castrol synthetic)

By the way, my sister lives in Canada and she did end up using Amsoil 10W30 oil.

[ July 26, 2002, 09:38 PM: Message edited by: con carne ]

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#3344 - 07/26/02 11:51 PM Re: BMW Z3 & API SH
widman Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 3071
Loc: Bolivia
msparks: good point on Argentine oils. 90% are junk! Many are SC/CC, and there are a los of SD and SF. Esso's big seller (through lack of education) is SC/CC. Last time I checked Texaco still sold SC/CC as well as SH/CF-4. I think Castrol imports from Brazil, and the last Car magazine report on oil in Brazil rated Castrol worst of all.
Only oil of confidence in Argentina is Chevron, which is imported from the US.

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