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#3163045 - 10/21/13 06:56 PM Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI
JerryBob Offline


Registered: 04/11/13
Posts: 529
Loc: Washington, DC
I've been lurking around for months trying to learn about oil, and making my truck run as long as possible.

I often see statements such as this:

"For a 5k run, I would use either the Purolator classic or Purolator PureOne. No reason to use a more expensive filter.
"
I don't understand the logic to using a cheaper filter for a shorter OCI. Isn't the goal to filter as well as possible, no matter what the OCI? Why wouldn't one want to use a synthetic media filter, rather than cellulose, for n number of miles, since the former supposedly filters better.

Maybe it is the case that the PureOnes filter as well as synthetic, but would be clogged in a long OCI? Is that what this person is saying?

For the price of a Starbucks, it seems more conservative to buy the better filter, in the off-chance that you can't change it on time - e.g. if there is a zombie apocalypse or something smile
_________________________
2002 Honda Odyssey TGMO 0w20 M1-104 Filter
2011 Toyota Tacoma TGMO 0w20 M1-102 Filter

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#3163059 - 10/21/13 07:05 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
Greggy_D Offline


Registered: 03/03/05
Posts: 1536
Loc: Near Ann Arbor, Michigan
For a 5k OCI, you can use a either a cheap or an expensive filter and it won't make one darn bit of difference over the life of your vehicle.
_________________________
Greggy D.


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#3163060 - 10/21/13 07:05 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
solorexpy Offline


Registered: 08/20/13
Posts: 81
Loc: Escondido, CA
My thoughts exactly. Every oil change (6 months max OCI) I replace the filter. Even if it's a good, expensive filter that could go longer. Why take the chance? An extra $5 or $6 for a top of the line filter every six months is not going to kill me.
_________________________
2000 Expedition 5.4l, new to me, Maxlife 5w-20 w/ Wix
2011 F150 5.0 (company car!), soon QSUD w/ Wix
2011 Dodge Journey LUX (hers), soon QSUD w/ Wix

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#3163072 - 10/21/13 07:13 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
Barkleymut Online   content


Registered: 01/27/04
Posts: 2504
Loc: Richmond, VA
if your engine is pretty clean then a cheap filter is fine, if you want to give away $5 then I will PM you my address
_________________________
09 Vue(95K) 2.4 4spd AT -PU 5w30 / 09 Flex(52K)3.5L PU / Moms car 04 Pilot(105K) 5w20 PP + Puro

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#3163089 - 10/21/13 07:35 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
y_p_w Offline


Registered: 05/06/05
Posts: 2589
Loc: SF Bay Area
Maybe getting the absolute highest efficiency filter means less than we think it should. OEM filters tend to be lower efficiency than aftermarket equivalents. Yet there are those who consistently use OEM filters and get hundreds of thousands of miles out of their vehicles. It's probably important that the filter is eventually changed, but maybe it's not that critical.

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#3163115 - 10/21/13 08:14 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
KD0AXS Online   content


Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 1296
Loc: Nowthen, MN
What you're (incorrectly) assuming is that a more expensive filter means better filtration. The main advantage with the higher end filters like Fram Ultra, M1, Napa Platinum, etc isn't really that they provide better filtration. The advantage is that they have more holding capacity, allowing them to be used for a longer OCI. Using one of these filters and only running it for 5K miles would be the same as using an oil like M1EP or Amsoil SS for a 5K mile OCI....a waste of money.
_________________________
2005 Ford F-350 4x4 5.4 - Maxlife 5W-20
2013 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited - PP 5W-20
2000 Saturn SC2 - Maxlife NG 10W-40
2000 John Deere 425 - Rotella T6

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#3163117 - 10/21/13 08:19 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
stchman Offline


Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 517
Loc: St. Louis, MO
If your OCI is short, pretty much any filter will do the job.
_________________________
2013 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ 2WD 5.3L
Mobil 1 5W-30
AC Delco PF48

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#3163130 - 10/21/13 08:30 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
Rolla07 Offline


Registered: 11/05/11
Posts: 1930
Loc: MTL, CANADA
I like to go with midgrade filters with a modest OCI..i like Pure Ones and fram tough guard.
_________________________
2007 Corolla Red Pearl 125k miles
M1 EP 0w20 & TRD filter


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#3163145 - 10/21/13 08:42 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: KD0AXS]
jimbrewer Online   content


Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 924
Loc: New Mexico, USA
Originally Posted By: KD0AXS
What you're (incorrectly) assuming is that a more expensive filter means better filtration. The main advantage with the higher end filters like Fram Ultra, M1, Napa Platinum, etc isn't really that they provide better filtration. The advantage is that they have more holding capacity, allowing them to be used for a longer OCI. Using one of these filters and only running it for 5K miles would be the same as using an oil like M1EP or Amsoil SS for a 5K mile OCI....a waste of money.


Right. Its the capacity that is most important. Filters actually filter better as they are used. (Up to a point) As they clog up a little they actually capture smaller particles. A decent oil filter will outlast the oil filtering through it, unless the engine has been abused and is a real sludger.

Likewise, the older oil tends to lubricate a bit better than the new oil, so long as it is not all used up. The anti-wear additives have had a chance to attach themselves (temporarily) to the cylinder walls. When i tested, the wear numbers of the last 3K of an 8K run of OEM oil was impeccable. Really miniscule. Then you change the oil and the detergents wash that anti-wear coating away for awhile until a new coating is deposited. I wouldn't say an extra short interval is hurtful to your truck, but its by no means optimal, either.

I'd say ange the other fluids and quit obsessing over the motor oil and the filter. 5K with regular oil is very conservative for 99.5% of all uses.



Edited by jimbrewer (10/21/13 08:46 PM)

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#3163153 - 10/21/13 08:51 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: jimbrewer]
y_p_w Offline


Registered: 05/06/05
Posts: 2589
Loc: SF Bay Area
Originally Posted By: jimbrewer
Originally Posted By: KD0AXS
What you're (incorrectly) assuming is that a more expensive filter means better filtration. The main advantage with the higher end filters like Fram Ultra, M1, Napa Platinum, etc isn't really that they provide better filtration. The advantage is that they have more holding capacity, allowing them to be used for a longer OCI. Using one of these filters and only running it for 5K miles would be the same as using an oil like M1EP or Amsoil SS for a 5K mile OCI....a waste of money.


Right. Its the capcity that is most important. Filters actually filter better as they are used. (Up to a point) As they clog up a little they actually capture smaller particles. Likewise, the older oil tends to lubricate better than the new oil, so long as it is not all used up. The anti-wear additives have had a chance to attach themselves (temporarily) to the cylinder walls. When i tested, the wear numbers of the last 3K of an 8K run of OEM oil was impeccable. Really miniscule. Then you change the oil and the detergents wash that anti-wear coating away for awhile until a new coating is deposited. I wouldn't say an extra short interval is hurtful to your truck, but its by no means optimal, either.

Change the other fluids and quit obsessing over the motor oil.


But it eventually gets to the point where some of the stuff trapped by the filter gets pushed out.

And I specifically remember a chemist working in motor oils saying something about wear actually increasing right after an oil change (up to maybe 1000 miles) because the ZDDP takes time to heat activate. I suppose there's no practical means to activate it before going in the engine. It would probably just coat whatever vat/tank/container it's in.

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#3163156 - 10/21/13 08:52 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
DragRace Offline


Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 2327
Loc: 1/4 Mile Track
That is one thing I wont do,is tell someone how to spend their money,period.

If someone wants to spend money,I'm sure they've thought it over as to the money they are about to spend on oil + filter.

With that said,I plan on using either a Royal Purple oil filter or Fram Ultra with the winter oil change coming up here soon.If I choose to run it a short OCI,thats MY choice.

Oil & filter,at the end of the day,is still cheaper then a engine replacement wink2

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#3163165 - 10/21/13 09:00 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: y_p_w]
FetchFar Offline


Registered: 10/17/13
Posts: 831
Loc: Colorado
--Change the oil filter at each OLM oil life monitor flag.

--Change only half the engine oil at each OLM flag.

--Every 3rd oil change, put in an engine flush for 5 minutes prior to changing ALL the oil.

-- Use a Dimple magnetic drain plug to pull out iron particles smaller than 30 microns the oil filter missed.

-- Use an oil filter that mixes in glass fiber (with the basic cellulose-paper) into the media.
_________________________
'07 BMW 530xi N52 engine, E60 chassis, 255 hp
'11 Chevy Camaro LS, 3.6L V6, Zeta chassis, 312 hp
'40 Chevrolet Special Deluxe 2-Door Town Sedan

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#3163173 - 10/21/13 09:14 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
michaelluscher Online   content


Registered: 10/07/12
Posts: 1485
Loc: Staten Italy
I like the midgrade. PureONE, Bosch Premium, Fram TG
Driving conditions also have to be taken into account.
I dropped some 600 mile PYB and a MC822 because it turned black and had horrendous start up rattle.
Swapped it for PU @ a Denso FTF filter, problems gone.
Between Walmart prices, the 10$MIR+$5 off my next SOPUS purchase, I break even on the better filter.
_________________________
'06 Toyota Camry SE V6 3MZ-FE 51k
'01 Mercury Villager Estate VG33E 48k
'06 Ford Taurus SE Vulcan 48k
'13 Chrysler 300 3.6 Pentastar 45k
'12-'14

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#3163180 - 10/21/13 09:20 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: Greggy_D]
tig1 Offline


Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 10025
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: Greggy_D
For a 5k OCI, you can use a either a cheap or an expensive filter and it won't make one darn bit of difference over the life of your vehicle.


+1. The quality of the oil you use is far more important than the filter. I use MC filters with 10K OCIs. Works very well for my engines.
_________________________
2007 Ford Fusion 147,000 miles
M1 0-20
2007 Ford Focus 131,000 miles
M1 0-20
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF
M1 10-30 in all OPE

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#3163181 - 10/21/13 09:21 PM Re: Using A Good Filter on a Short OCI [Re: JerryBob]
901Memphis Online   content


Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 6357
Loc: Northern Kentucky
The logic is simple. It's not necessary to run a high capacity filter on an interval that will not use that capacity.

I'm pretty sure that synthetic filters aren't as efficient in the earlier part of their life as blended filters like tough guard.
_________________________
1999 Ford Taurus 146k (Vulcan v6) - M1 High Mileage 5w30 | Fram Ultra XG 3600
2002 Buick Century 105k - Peak 5w30 / Fram Ultra XG 3980 / Filter mag

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