Amsoil SMF 103

[satterfi]

Amsoil SMF103 oil filter

I bought 2 of these filters for my VTR1000 motorcycle. 1 to use on the bike and the other to cut open and compare it with the OEM Toyo Roki and an M1-110 auto application that will fit my bike.

First impression:

Looking inside both Amsoil filters I see dirt on bypass valve. Not just one speck but about 10 large pieces of stuff in one and 5 in the other.

Cutting open the Amsoil filter reveals a puny little filter element. Here’s the measured numbers for the three filters.

Amsoil: 36 in^2 media, bypass setting around 22 psi

Toyo Roki: 94 in^2 media, bypass setting around 18 psi

M1-110: 60 in^2 media, bypass setting around 22 psi.

All three filter media look about the same under a microscope. Thickness is about the same. Density of the Amsoil and M1 are the same with the Toyo Roki about 25% lighter.

My pressure drop measurements aren’t repeatable but it indicates the Amsoil and M1 media are about the same and the Toyo Roki is about 1/3 of them (on a square inch basis).

My conclusion is that the Amsoil filter is not something I’d ever use on my bikes or cars. Dirt in the filter is unaceptable. The small filter media with the high pressure drop can only cause the filter to bypass oil more often.

I had doubts about using the M1-110 on my bike because it’s filter media area is less than the OEM and it has higher a pressure drop. The Amsoil filter is would be a worse choice.

 

[Jay]

That's interesting, satterfi, because Amsoil claims their filters have more capacity than competing brands. How did you determine what the bypass settings were? I'm confused by your statement that the higher bypass setting would bypass sooner. I thought it would be just the opposite.

 

[satterfi]

I determined bypass settings by putting the filter on a scale and pushing down on the bypass valve and noting when the valve began to open and taking a reading from the scale. I measured the diameter of the bypass oriface and calculated the psi required to open the valve.

Jay:

In your statement:"I'm confused by your statement that the higher bypass setting would bypass sooner. I thought it would be just the opposite. "

I didn't say that, and I agree with you.

 

[mikeyoilnutt]

satterfi, DID YOU CONSIDER TAKING THESE FILTERS BACK TO THE AMSOIL REP YOU BOUGHT THEM FROM? MAYBE YOU COULD GET YOUR MONEY BACK AND AMSOIL COULD POSSIBLE FIND OUT IF THERE WAS A QUALITY PROBLEM WITH A PRODUCTION RUN ON THOSE FILTERS AND EXPLAIN THE PUNNY ELEMENT SIZE. AS EXSPENSIVE AS THOSE AMSOIL MOTO FILTERS ARE THEY SHOULD BE GOOD AS GOLD. MIKEYOILNUTT.

 

[msparks]

I would also like to know if you have contact Amsoil Tech Services about this matter.

If you are unsatisfied an Amsoil Product, I would contact your servicing dealer, or Amsoil Tech to solve any problems before trying to downgrade a company on the internet.

I am not saying you are right or wrong, as this is a new product line and I have had very little exposure to these filters thus far.

I would like to know the complete answer to the statements that you proposed, and will inform those of the outcome when I get the answers myself.

 

[satterfi]

msparks

I do not intend on contacting Amsoil regarding my observations on the 2 oil filters I purchased.

Facts are facts. The two SMF 103's that I bought have dirt in them and the area of the media is small considering the OEM parameters.

I have no grudge with Amsoil concerning this issue. They didn't make the filters, Baldwin did. Baldwin has a responsibility to Amsoil to supply a quality product. Baldwin failed mesirablily in the case of the 2 filters I bought.

Amsoil has a responsibility to audit outsourced material and properly spec out a replacement filter. IMO they failed in this area.

I posted my observations to this board for information to the other members. I was not "trying to downgrade a company on the internet".

I still have the one filter I did not cut open. I can ship it to you and you can look at it and make your own opinion.

 

[msparks]

quote:

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Originally posted by satterfi:
msparks

I do not intend on contacting Amsoil regarding my observations on the 2 oil filters I purchased.

I still have the one filter I did not cut open. I can ship it to you and you can look at it and make your own opinion.

---

If you are not interested in contacting your dealer to get your money back that is not my problem.

I also don't care to look at the filter. Just like in all manufacturing there are some that slip through that are not up to standard.

(Remember Firestone???)

Anyhow.

To anyone who is my customer and has a problem either with a product or a service, please contact me so I can straighten this out.

Thanks

 

[BOBISTHEOILGUY]

satterfi, Those are some interesting observations. I myself have been looking more at filters in a different light. I've been running the M1 filter on my car for quite some time.. I also had been using the schaeffers 15w40 blend for quite awhile as well.

The interesting story here is, I have noticed valve clatter on first start in the mornings. This never has worried me as knowing the schaeffers oil and how its barrier lube keeps wear from happening, and how the oil analysis seems to support this, the momentary valve clatter was nothing more than annoying to me.

So, now in my little experiment that I'm doing where I decided to use a full mineral with the same basic additive components as our blend, so to prove wear between the two as not much difference even though one has a PAO and the other not, I went to extremes and installed a fram oil filter. Since then, valve clatter has gone away. GOD I hate to be the one saying that!, But point here is, balance of filtration seems to be a concern.

The other point that caught my attention, I have a lexus owner told he is needing to bring 6grand in for a new motor because his oil light was coming on and off and upon inspection stated it was sludged up. We immediatly put him on the 131 neutra program and with the first 200 miles on the toyota filter, is was very apparent the trash in his engine. So, here I cut open the toyota filter, see the trash. Filter had been sitting approx 2 weeks, and was dry from the draining. My M1 filter on the other hand that had a lot of miles, after sitting almost 2 months draining, no oil coming out, I proceede to cut it open and found oil pouring out. It appears that this filter kept oil traped inbetween the filtermedia and the can and it could not seep out through the media. Figured since it had so many miles it was clogged, so again, m1, this time 4k miles, same oil(first part of my oil test using 15w40blend) anyway, again, let drain for 1 month this time, no oil coming out, cut and again, oil pouring out, again trapped between the media and the can. My concern is that the media is too tight especially after you have run it a bit, therefore may cause it to become tighter.

So question is where is the balance, start with a avg filter, as time progresses, it becomes more effecient due to higher restrictions created by the entrapted contaminents? Or start out with a high filter media such as pur 1 or m1? Right now with the fram, I am looking forward to the results from analysis and from cutting it open to see how much if any oil becomes trapped between the media and can. My thoughts are it will not hold the oil and will be dry.

MSPARKS,

I think many reps are and are not as concerned about customer satisfaction and it is very apparent you are one that is concerned. The information provided by SAT is good, not so much to bash amsoil or any other but to educate others as well as yourself. For yourself, you can see where others maybe finding a problem, therefore giving you the opertunity to advise your customers based on your observations, what you think maybe good or bad. As you well know, many companies including schaeffers has some products that may be marginal and maynot in my opinion and yours hopefully not meet what you 'd expect for your customers so then you can "steer" them away from that particular item. I have certain things I don't encourage in the schaeffers product line but find other alternatives better suited and this was by identifying them through sources such as what SAT offered. I think most of us understand that and don't consider it bashing as we all know how not every company can be without some fault.

 

[Dick in Falls Church]

Satterfi--
just as a note, Baldwin does not make the AMSOIL motorcycle filters.

I've looked at several since I saw your note, and have not seen any contamination. Certainly doesn't mean I doubt you!

 

[satterfi]

My apologies to Baldwin.

I thought I read on this site that Amsoil used Baldwin to outsource their oil filters.

Who does supply Amsoil with filters?

 

[Chris]

Great work Sat. I am also riding a Honda and have always used the expensive OEM filter. Glad to know I was doing right! This is a site to present facts and personal experiences and this was well done!

 

[TooSlick]

I would agree with Mike Sparks on this ...if you have a problem with a product, I'd take it back to the servicing dealer. Of course since you have cut this filter open they may be somewhat relucant to exchange it. I have been using the Amsoil oil filters since 1978 and I haven't run across any contamination issues outside of a small fleck of metal on the threads once in a while. I have not used the motorcycle filters, however.

I don't think you can judge filtration efficiency/capacity with a visual inspection. You can get a general idea of materials/construction, but that's about it.

TooSlick

 

[MRC01]

WOW Thanks a bunch for the data. I assumed Amsoil was comparable to OEM in quality, guess I was wrong. My recent UOA looked good with the Amsoil filter, but I have to say it'll be no more Amsoil filters for me, back to OEM!

[ September 06, 2003, 07:28 PM: Message edited by: MRC01 ]

 

[satterfi]

My data is limited.

I only offer it as "food for thought".

Take it with a 'grain of salt' and use your best judgment.

 

[MRC01]

quote:

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Originally posted by TooSlick:
I don't think you can judge filtration efficiency/capacity with a visual inspection. You can get a general idea of materials/construction, but that's about it.

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True, but it does look suspicious so why take the risk? The OEM filters are about the same price, just as easy (or easier) to get, and known good quality.