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#3057648 - 07/07/13 09:16 PM Super Tech syn 5w-30; 7.7k miles; 2011 Murano
Rodeoguy Offline


Registered: 05/02/11
Posts: 15
Loc: MO
From Blackstone Labs

The oil's viscosity was just light of the 5W/30 range and the TBN read low enough that we think the 7,667-miles you've put on the oil are enough for this type. Silicon and aluminum came up on the high side of the normal range. If the wear is due to silicon, you may want to take a look around your air filtration system. Any leak could let abrasive dirt in to abrade the piston tops (aluminum). Wear otherwise was normal and we don't think the 7,000+ miles on the oil was too long. If you could get rid of the high silicon you could probably run longer oil change intervals.

MANGANESE 2
ALUMINUM 7
CHROMIUM 0
IRON 17
COPPER 10
LEAD 2
TIN 2
MOLYBDENUM 80
NICKEL 0
SILVER 0
TITANIUM 0
POTASSIUM 0
BORON 52
SILICON 30
SODIUM 18
CALCIUM 2280
MAGNESIUM 11
PHOSPHORUS 679
ZINC 771
BARIUM 0

MI/HR on Oil 7,667
MI/HR on Unit 21,250
Make Up Oil Added 0
Date sampled 6/23/13

cSt Viscosity @ 100C 54.4
SUS Viscosity @ 210F 8.59
Flashpoint in F 469
Fuel % <.5
Antifreeze % 0
Water % 0
Insolubles % .2
TBN 1.1

The original air intake filter with 21,250 miles was damaged, I found and replaced it during this oil change before I received this report. This 7,667 OCI was just shy of 12 months and mostly highway driving. I am happy with all the readings and will continue to run 7500 to 8000 OCI. (Walmart's Super Tech 5W-30 Synthetic)


Edited by dnewton3 (07/08/13 05:45 AM)
_________________________
2011 Nissan Murano S AWD Super Tech Synthetic 5W-30
2010 Suzuki DF90A 4-Stroke Outboard Factory Fill 10W-40
2004 Toyota Corolla SE Super Tech 5W-30

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#3057700 - 07/07/13 09:59 PM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: Rodeoguy]
RLGDiesel Offline


Registered: 08/29/12
Posts: 8
Loc: Lexington, VA
What engine family is in the Murano...is it a variation of the VQ35HR's that are notoriously hard on oil?

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#3057706 - 07/07/13 10:03 PM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: Rodeoguy]
FZ1 Offline


Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4192
Loc: Texas
Some of that is break in wear. The tbn is too low,get a higher tbn oil or shorten the oci to 6,000.

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#3057715 - 07/07/13 10:13 PM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: Rodeoguy]
chubbs1 Offline


Registered: 06/09/10
Posts: 4574
Loc: Merritt Island FL, USA
Decent report. I would use QSUD for the yearly OCI's but ST is a good oil.
_________________________
'12 Charger SXT
QSUD 5w30 OEM filter

'12 Charger SXT
Edge FST EP 5w30 OEM (Mine;)

'11 Hyundai Sonata GLS
QSUD 5w20 OEM Filter


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#3057718 - 07/07/13 10:15 PM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: RLGDiesel]
Rodeoguy Offline


Registered: 05/02/11
Posts: 15
Loc: MO
The engine is the
V6 3.5 liter FI VQ35DE
_________________________
2011 Nissan Murano S AWD Super Tech Synthetic 5W-30
2010 Suzuki DF90A 4-Stroke Outboard Factory Fill 10W-40
2004 Toyota Corolla SE Super Tech 5W-30

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#3057846 - 07/08/13 05:43 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: Rodeoguy]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 5721
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Not sure how many OCIs you've already run. Some of this could be break-in wear but after a few OCIs, I'd suspect that's mostly gone.

It is likely that the Si from the air filter issue is what caused the elevated Fe; I suspect a similar issue in my most recent UOA as well.

I would suggest a couple of things:
1) stick to 7.5k miles for a few UOA cycles to build a history; if that is the OEM OCI, it may make sense to just stay at that level until warranty is expired
2) consider the ST dino rather than syn; you're not getting any "better" data by using the syn here, and you can save money for the same protection

When you get TBN this low, you also need to be looking at TAN. Typically TAN will cross over TBN, but that is not a reason to condemn fluid automatically. It is a motivator to do continued monitoring and closely watch for other tell-tale signs of wear increases. Too many folks don't understand the TBN/TAN relationship. TBN can be low, but that does NOT assure that TAN is high, regardless of what other folks infer. You can view my recent two UOAs on my Nissan VG30E as proof.


I will update your thread title to inclue the "syn" so that it is more clear upon a search.

Thanks for posting!


Edited by dnewton3 (07/08/13 05:55 AM)
_________________________
Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

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#3057987 - 07/08/13 09:04 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: dnewton3]
gfh77665 Online   happy


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 2419
Loc: Southeast Texas
Originally Posted By: dnewton3

2) consider the ST dino rather than syn; you're not getting any "better" data by using the syn here, and you can save money for the same protection


I don't know how you can say that "for sure". Anecdotal information from another vehicle/engine/driving style/climate does not necessarily directly translate to this particular situation. Syn may very well have done better, but we just do not know. I suspect it would, though, because of a stouter add pack. Only way to know for sure is for him to try it with the same interval, etc.

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#3058064 - 07/08/13 10:27 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: dnewton3]
Rodeoguy Offline


Registered: 05/02/11
Posts: 15
Loc: MO
I have changed the oil as follows:

At 3049 ST Dino 5W-30 3049 on oil.
At 6050 ST Syn 5W-30 3001 on oil.
At 13583 ST Syn 5W-30 7533 on oil.
At 21250 ST Syn 5W-30 7667 on oil.

New filter at each change, Fram TG6607.

I won't be doing another UOA till 50K maybe 75K, because it defeats the purpose of using "cheaper" oil.

_________________________
2011 Nissan Murano S AWD Super Tech Synthetic 5W-30
2010 Suzuki DF90A 4-Stroke Outboard Factory Fill 10W-40
2004 Toyota Corolla SE Super Tech 5W-30

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#3058078 - 07/08/13 10:38 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: gfh77665]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 5721
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Originally Posted By: dnewton3

2) consider the ST dino rather than syn; you're not getting any "better" data by using the syn here, and you can save money for the same protection


I don't know how you can say that "for sure". Anecdotal information from another vehicle/engine/driving style/climate does not necessarily directly translate to this particular situation. Syn may very well have done better, but we just do not know. I suspect it would, though, because of a stouter add pack. Only way to know for sure is for him to try it with the same interval, etc.



Yes - there is a differnce between macro and micro data; I'm acutely aware of those nuances.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/used-oil-analysis-how-to-decide-what-is-normal/
In that article alone, IIRC, I looked at over 2500 UOAs. I have more than 10,000 UOAs in my data base. I have tracked dinos and syns for a LONG time in many, many different applications. I'm very confident, no - make that super confident, that what I state is true. Normal OCIs do not favor syns in regard to wear. Todays' lubes are all so good that there is no ability to distinguish the difference in "noraml" applications.

However - why not prove me wrong? Why not have the OP run some UOAs of each, and see where the data places him statistically?

I've done it on multple vehicles; I put my money where my mouth is.


Edited by dnewton3 (07/08/13 10:41 AM)
_________________________
Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

Top
#3058342 - 07/08/13 02:50 PM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: dnewton3]
gfh77665 Online   happy


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 2419
Loc: Southeast Texas
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Normal OCIs do not favor syns in regard to wear.


Note he went over 7,500 miles, exceeding the "normal" OCI. With the TBN depleted (1.1) and viscosity sheared thin, I believe a syn would have held up better, especially going over 7500 miles.

Not looking for an argument, just adding a perspective.

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#3058964 - 07/09/13 01:21 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: gfh77665]
cp3 Offline


Registered: 07/26/06
Posts: 2642
Loc: Kitchener, Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Normal OCIs do not favor syns in regard to wear.


Note he went over 7,500 miles, exceeding the "normal" OCI. With the TBN depleted (1.1) and viscosity sheared thin, I believe a syn would have held up better, especially going over 7500 miles.

Not looking for an argument, just adding a perspective.


This was synthetic....
_________________________
Dodge Charger|Pennzoil Platinum 5w20|Mopar MO-744
Pontiac G6 GT|Mobil 1 0w40|Mobil 1 M1-101

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#3058995 - 07/09/13 04:55 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: Rodeoguy]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 5721
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Again, why not prove me wrong? Why not run some 7.5k UOA with dino, and see how they fare against the syn?

I can tell you that macro and micro data from over 10,000 UOAs in my database don't favor syns in "normal" OCIs. In fact, even when extending well past "normal", dino fluids do quite well overall. Most certainly, we must give a nod to unique situations such as known engines are true sludgers (SL2, some Toyota's, etc).

But that is just part of the whole experience; you must KNOW your equipment, and then use ALL the tools available (UOAs, PCs, visual inspections, compression checks, etc) to track the health of you equipment. Folks that do a UOA or two, while hopping from brand/grade to brand/grade, have ZERO idea of what they are doing or why they use UOAs, IMO.

What I can assure everyone is that dino fluids are WAY more capable than folks give them credit for, and there is really no tangible benefit to syns in normal applications in healthy equipment. It's not just my person UOAs that prove this; look at the SAE articles on tribochemical barriers, and look over other sets of UOAs such as those of 2010_FX4. Look over the data in my "normalcy" article.

Think I'm wrong? Then please prove me wrong! It's a friendly BITOG challenge; it's a happy gauntlet thrown down to see who's really got the data to back up the claims.


Edited by dnewton3 (07/09/13 04:56 AM)
_________________________
Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

Top
#3059168 - 07/09/13 09:16 AM Re: Super Tech 5w-30 2011 Nissan Murano 7667 OCI [Re: Rodeoguy]
addyguy Offline


Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 13458
Loc: Canada
Silicon is high, and Al is correspondingly high.

Extra dirt in the engine from the air filter issue is causing accelerated piston wear.

We've seen Nissan engines that have issues with accelerated wear from mechanical issue (cat converter problem) that burn prodigious amounts of oil...I'd get this under control, and flush out the dirt, or this engine will turn into a crazy oil-burner....
_________________________
2003 Mazda Tribute LX V-6, 176k miles.
Castrol Edge SPT 0W-20; Fram EG2.

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