Found some at pep boys on clearance for $5.50 a qt but didn't buy it. thinking maybe would be good for the cold winter up here in colorado but from what i've been reading these engines like the thinker oils....opinions?
Edge 0w-20 in bmw 330 m54 I6?
- Thread starter cool_breeze
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That's not much of a deal, and 0w20 in a m54... No.
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The M54 requires an A3/B4 rated oil. Choose whatever viscosity you want that meets that spec. However, no 0w-20 oil meets A3/B4. FWIW, I run Pentospeed 0w-30 VS in my M54.
Scott
Scott
You need something ACEA A3/B4, which means a few 5w30s and 0w30s, but mostly 5w40 and 0w40.
I'd stick with the BMW spec oil, why gamble?
Yah i know it requires a bmw ll-01 oil which seems the only readily bottles are GC and M1 0-40. I've also read on here that any synthetic 5w-30 with 7500mi 0ci, which is what ill be servicing the car every time, should be fine too. It gets mostly highway miles and not a lot of cold starts.
Plus i have 3 qts of M1 5w-30 left over and really didn't want to buy another jug.
How about 3 qts m1 5w-30 + 3qts M1 0w-40?
Plus i have 3 qts of M1 5w-30 left over and really didn't want to buy another jug.
How about 3 qts m1 5w-30 + 3qts M1 0w-40?
Originally Posted By: cool_breeze
How about 3 qts m1 5w-30 + 3qts M1 0w-40?
I don't see a problem with that mix. Having said that if it were mine I'd just buy more M1 0W40 and call it a day. JMO
How about 3 qts m1 5w-30 + 3qts M1 0w-40?
I don't see a problem with that mix. Having said that if it were mine I'd just buy more M1 0W40 and call it a day. JMO
Hi cool_breeze,
I've been running a 0W-20 oil in the winter for the past 8 years in my M52 engined Bimmer, the predecessor to your M54 I6 engine without issue.
It is a myth that Bimmers automatically require a heavier oil.
In fact BMW began spec'ing the 0W-30 LL-01 FE(HTHSV 3.0cP) oil as an option for the successor to your engine, the N51 series in 2005 although I don't thing any NA dealers bothered with it.
The spec' BMW 5W-30 (LL-01)(HTHSV 3.5cP) oil is actually already quite light in service. Have you seen a UOA that hasn't sheared at least 10% in service? I haven't.
The fact is, you can run any light 30wt oil in most conservatively street driven NA Bimmers without issue and undoubtedly untold numbers of BMW owners do once outside of warranty.
The key to running a light 0W-20 like Edge (btw, just curious, did you get the SM or SN version?) is lowish maximum oil temp's.
If your oil temp's stay under 90C then you'll never likely test your minimum oil pressure spec's. In my case my winter oil temp's never exceeds 85C.
If you don't have an OP or OT gauge in your car to monitor the situation you can still safely use a light 0W-20 if you're doing mostly short commutes with trips under 30 minutes in duration.
Occational longer drives are not a problem is you don't use WOT when the engine hot.
BTW, a member is using the Toyota 0W-20 in his M3 in the winter and loves it. On the virgin oil his oil pressure is just on spec'. I suggested adding a qt or two of M1 0W-40 to bring the OP up a bit above spec' but then I'm a bit conservative.
I've been running a 0W-20 oil in the winter for the past 8 years in my M52 engined Bimmer, the predecessor to your M54 I6 engine without issue.
It is a myth that Bimmers automatically require a heavier oil.
In fact BMW began spec'ing the 0W-30 LL-01 FE(HTHSV 3.0cP) oil as an option for the successor to your engine, the N51 series in 2005 although I don't thing any NA dealers bothered with it.
The spec' BMW 5W-30 (LL-01)(HTHSV 3.5cP) oil is actually already quite light in service. Have you seen a UOA that hasn't sheared at least 10% in service? I haven't.
The fact is, you can run any light 30wt oil in most conservatively street driven NA Bimmers without issue and undoubtedly untold numbers of BMW owners do once outside of warranty.
The key to running a light 0W-20 like Edge (btw, just curious, did you get the SM or SN version?) is lowish maximum oil temp's.
If your oil temp's stay under 90C then you'll never likely test your minimum oil pressure spec's. In my case my winter oil temp's never exceeds 85C.
If you don't have an OP or OT gauge in your car to monitor the situation you can still safely use a light 0W-20 if you're doing mostly short commutes with trips under 30 minutes in duration.
Occational longer drives are not a problem is you don't use WOT when the engine hot.
BTW, a member is using the Toyota 0W-20 in his M3 in the winter and loves it. On the virgin oil his oil pressure is just on spec'. I suggested adding a qt or two of M1 0W-40 to bring the OP up a bit above spec' but then I'm a bit conservative.
Thanks everyone for your input. Caterham, i've seen you around for years and like your responses.
While i didn't buy the edge it was an SM oil fyi. Doubt ill go get it because the deal want that great to drive across the city and with AZ's deal on M1 right now ill just go that route.
I don't have an OP or OT gauge and its mostly a DD for my wife but when i get to drive it trips to redline are common so it wold be hard for me to do without worrying if i have "enough" oil.
After this next run of m1 5-30/0-40 ill run a UOA and see how she's doing at 7500k.
While i didn't buy the edge it was an SM oil fyi. Doubt ill go get it because the deal want that great to drive across the city and with AZ's deal on M1 right now ill just go that route.
I don't have an OP or OT gauge and its mostly a DD for my wife but when i get to drive it trips to redline are common so it wold be hard for me to do without worrying if i have "enough" oil.
After this next run of m1 5-30/0-40 ill run a UOA and see how she's doing at 7500k.
The Edge SM 0W-20 was the good stuff with a VI of 220, marginally higher than the Toyota 0W-20 it was targeting.
You could run M1 5W-30 straight with no chance of the oil being too light with the way you drive your car on the hottest day of the year at speeds as fast as you can get away with.
You could run M1 5W-30 straight with no chance of the oil being too light with the way you drive your car on the hottest day of the year at speeds as fast as you can get away with.
Originally Posted By: cool_breeze
Yah i know it requires a bmw ll-01 oil which seems the only readily bottles are GC and M1 0-40. I've also read on here that any synthetic 5w-30 with 7500mi 0ci, which is what ill be servicing the car every time, should be fine too. It gets mostly highway miles and not a lot of cold starts.
Plus i have 3 qts of M1 5w-30 left over and really didn't want to buy another jug.
How about 3 qts m1 5w-30 + 3qts M1 0w-40?
I was told by BMW Canada that I can use any brand name 5w30
oil as long as I change it often enough ie. 5K to 7K miles.
Dont use the 20 weight. I would mix your M1 oils.
Yah i know it requires a bmw ll-01 oil which seems the only readily bottles are GC and M1 0-40. I've also read on here that any synthetic 5w-30 with 7500mi 0ci, which is what ill be servicing the car every time, should be fine too. It gets mostly highway miles and not a lot of cold starts.
Plus i have 3 qts of M1 5w-30 left over and really didn't want to buy another jug.
How about 3 qts m1 5w-30 + 3qts M1 0w-40?
I was told by BMW Canada that I can use any brand name 5w30
oil as long as I change it often enough ie. 5K to 7K miles.
Dont use the 20 weight. I would mix your M1 oils.
Run 0w40 in it and be done with it or if BMW spec's 5w30 run that.
No way would i second guess BMW on this one, use what they recommend and nothing else. It doesn't mater a hill of beans what previous or later versions of this engine take or if someone runs a 16yr old BMW on it.
No way would i second guess BMW on this one, use what they recommend and nothing else. It doesn't mater a hill of beans what previous or later versions of this engine take or if someone runs a 16yr old BMW on it.
It does matter where and how the car is run.
If an actual owner has had good results with a given grade, I'd pay some heed to that.
I personally wouldn't run a 0W-20 in a BMW six, but we do have a member who has done so for some years in his BMW six with no problems, so it may be that he's on to something.
The fact that he has a '96 e36 is not relevant to the discussion.
If an actual owner has had good results with a given grade, I'd pay some heed to that.
I personally wouldn't run a 0W-20 in a BMW six, but we do have a member who has done so for some years in his BMW six with no problems, so it may be that he's on to something.
The fact that he has a '96 e36 is not relevant to the discussion.
Personally i would also like to get away from M1 because of their business ethics but don't have much else out there if i need to stay to what bmw specs. Yah theres GC but its hard to find around here and is pretty much always $9/qt. May try my luck at finding some RP or Redline at a descent price but also unlikely.
I tried searching for some uoa's on this engine but seems everyone only uses the above oils..not too much varied. Maybe bc no one wants to blow a $5k engine but doubt that happening.
So i guess what id like to know is what are my choices, other than M1 and GC, for all around temps like we get in colorado.
Summers 0*-100* and winters -20* - 80*
prolonged OCI desired and
easily found and
tastes great!
I tried searching for some uoa's on this engine but seems everyone only uses the above oils..not too much varied. Maybe bc no one wants to blow a $5k engine but doubt that happening.
So i guess what id like to know is what are my choices, other than M1 and GC, for all around temps like we get in colorado.
Summers 0*-100* and winters -20* - 80*
prolonged OCI desired and
easily found and
tastes great!
Quote:
The fact that he has a '96 e36 is not relevant to the discussion
I ran straight 50 in a old 74 2002 Alpina A4 and it ran wonderful but i suppose thats irrelevant also?
Heck its a BMW engine so i doesn't matter every other BMW should run with straight 50w just as well right?
Quote:
If an actual owner has had good results with a given grade, I'd pay some heed to that.
If its not in spec anywhere in the world only an voll idiot would take that leap of faith.
My god 20w is not even spec for Finland which has regions up to the arctic circle.
Just because someone tries it and reports having luck with it doesn't mean everyone else should jump with the same enthusiasm.
Who is going to pay for that very expensive BMW engine when it all goes up the Suwannee, the guy who recommends 5w20?
I think not!
OP
Pennzoil has a new 0w40 that is in all probability just re bottled Shell helix ultra 0w40 which does meet BMW LL-01 specs when labeled as Shell and is available from Chrysler dealers.
If you don't like Mobil then this maybe a good alternative.
Mobil 1 0w40 is an incredibly good oil though.
The fact that he has a '96 e36 is not relevant to the discussion
I ran straight 50 in a old 74 2002 Alpina A4 and it ran wonderful but i suppose thats irrelevant also?
Heck its a BMW engine so i doesn't matter every other BMW should run with straight 50w just as well right?
Quote:
If an actual owner has had good results with a given grade, I'd pay some heed to that.
If its not in spec anywhere in the world only an voll idiot would take that leap of faith.
My god 20w is not even spec for Finland which has regions up to the arctic circle.
Just because someone tries it and reports having luck with it doesn't mean everyone else should jump with the same enthusiasm.
Who is going to pay for that very expensive BMW engine when it all goes up the Suwannee, the guy who recommends 5w20?
I think not!
OP
Pennzoil has a new 0w40 that is in all probability just re bottled Shell helix ultra 0w40 which does meet BMW LL-01 specs when labeled as Shell and is available from Chrysler dealers.
If you don't like Mobil then this maybe a good alternative.
Mobil 1 0w40 is an incredibly good oil though.
Originally Posted By: Trav
Quote:
Quote:
If an actual owner has had good results with a given grade, I'd pay some heed to that.
If its not in spec anywhere in the world only an voll idiot would take that leap of faith.
My god 20w is not even spec for Finland which has regions up to the arctic circle.
Just because someone tries it and reports having luck with it doesn't mean everyone else should jump with the same enthusiasm.
Who is going to pay for that very expensive BMW engine when it all goes up the Suwannee, the guy who recommends 5w20?
I think not!
I do appreciate that your understanding of motor oil is limited particularly with the concept of operational viscosity.
I very much pay heed to the oil recommendations of BMW, particularly the minimum oil pressure test spec's for a given engine. In that regard I have no interest in seeing how light an oil I can run by BMW by testing those OP spec's, consiquently there is "no leap of faith" or "luck" involved in the oil that I run.
Oil viscosity is temperature related. If, as I mentioned previously, you keep your sump oil temp's below 90C you will not test the minimum OP spec's for your engine running a 20wt oil. Consiquently if one has oil gauges to become familiar with the oil viscosity characteristics of your engine, then you too can benefit from running a 0W-20 oil in the winter in your BMW or for any make for that matter.
And yes, before the advent of high VI 0W-30 and 0W-40 oils BMW did recommend 5W-20 oils for cold weather running as did other German OEMs such as Porsche and Audi.
Quote:
Quote:
If an actual owner has had good results with a given grade, I'd pay some heed to that.
If its not in spec anywhere in the world only an voll idiot would take that leap of faith.
My god 20w is not even spec for Finland which has regions up to the arctic circle.
Just because someone tries it and reports having luck with it doesn't mean everyone else should jump with the same enthusiasm.
Who is going to pay for that very expensive BMW engine when it all goes up the Suwannee, the guy who recommends 5w20?
I think not!
I do appreciate that your understanding of motor oil is limited particularly with the concept of operational viscosity.
I very much pay heed to the oil recommendations of BMW, particularly the minimum oil pressure test spec's for a given engine. In that regard I have no interest in seeing how light an oil I can run by BMW by testing those OP spec's, consiquently there is "no leap of faith" or "luck" involved in the oil that I run.
Oil viscosity is temperature related. If, as I mentioned previously, you keep your sump oil temp's below 90C you will not test the minimum OP spec's for your engine running a 20wt oil. Consiquently if one has oil gauges to become familiar with the oil viscosity characteristics of your engine, then you too can benefit from running a 0W-20 oil in the winter in your BMW or for any make for that matter.
And yes, before the advent of high VI 0W-30 and 0W-40 oils BMW did recommend 5W-20 oils for cold weather running as did other German OEMs such as Porsche and Audi.
Originally Posted By: 2KBMW
Originally Posted By: cool_breeze
I was told by BMW Canada that I can use any brand name 5w30
oil as long as I change it often enough ie. 5K to 7K miles.
2KBMW, thanks for mentioning that.
It's certainly consistent with what I've observed that the viscosity reserves provided by a typically light 5W-30 synthetic are very high indeed running in any Bimmer for which the BMW 5W-30 is spec'd. And if you're not in the habit of pushing the OCI any premium 5W-30 will more than satisfy the engine's lubrication requirements.
BTW, did BMW Canada advise you in writing by email or such?
Originally Posted By: cool_breeze
I was told by BMW Canada that I can use any brand name 5w30
oil as long as I change it often enough ie. 5K to 7K miles.
2KBMW, thanks for mentioning that.
It's certainly consistent with what I've observed that the viscosity reserves provided by a typically light 5W-30 synthetic are very high indeed running in any Bimmer for which the BMW 5W-30 is spec'd. And if you're not in the habit of pushing the OCI any premium 5W-30 will more than satisfy the engine's lubrication requirements.
BTW, did BMW Canada advise you in writing by email or such?
Quote:
And yes, before the advent of high VI 0W-30 and 0W-40 oils BMW did recommend 5W-20 oils for cold weather running as did other German OEMs such as Porsche and Audi.
Okay tell the truth what year was that? 1973?
If you want to mess around with 20w in your old BMW thats your business but advocating that others do it in expensive newer machines borders on lunacy.
And yes, before the advent of high VI 0W-30 and 0W-40 oils BMW did recommend 5W-20 oils for cold weather running as did other German OEMs such as Porsche and Audi.
Okay tell the truth what year was that? 1973?
If you want to mess around with 20w in your old BMW thats your business but advocating that others do it in expensive newer machines borders on lunacy.
Originally Posted By: Trav
Quote:
And yes, before the advent of high VI 0W-30 and 0W-40 oils BMW did recommend 5W-20 oils for cold weather running as did other German OEMs such as Porsche and Audi.
Okay tell the truth what year was that? 1973?
If you want to mess around with 20w in your old BMW thats your business but advocating that others do it in expensive newer machines borders on lunacy.
Yes in 1973 (good guess) but also much later. For my '86 Porsche
5W-20 it was still being recommended for ambient temp's below 0C and with no high speed driving.
But that's not the point.
What you fail to understand is that even the lightest 0W-20 is way heavier than optimum until the oil temp's rise at least to 70C especially if you are using high rev's. If one's oil temp's fail to get above the 80-89C range which is not uncommon in many aapplications in the winter months, yes you'd be better off running a 0W-20 oil.
Am I advocating running a 0W-20 in the OP's BMW? No I'm not.
This thread asked if he can and I answered under what conditions he could. What I have advocated is that he can run any light 0W/5W-30 oil that he wants year round with a reasonable OCI.
Quote:
And yes, before the advent of high VI 0W-30 and 0W-40 oils BMW did recommend 5W-20 oils for cold weather running as did other German OEMs such as Porsche and Audi.
Okay tell the truth what year was that? 1973?
If you want to mess around with 20w in your old BMW thats your business but advocating that others do it in expensive newer machines borders on lunacy.
Yes in 1973 (good guess) but also much later. For my '86 Porsche
5W-20 it was still being recommended for ambient temp's below 0C and with no high speed driving.
But that's not the point.
What you fail to understand is that even the lightest 0W-20 is way heavier than optimum until the oil temp's rise at least to 70C especially if you are using high rev's. If one's oil temp's fail to get above the 80-89C range which is not uncommon in many aapplications in the winter months, yes you'd be better off running a 0W-20 oil.
Am I advocating running a 0W-20 in the OP's BMW? No I'm not.
This thread asked if he can and I answered under what conditions he could. What I have advocated is that he can run any light 0W/5W-30 oil that he wants year round with a reasonable OCI.
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