2000 Jeep 4.0, M1 10W30, 5K OCI

[michaelc80]

2000 Jeep Wrangler with 62K total miles, 5K OCI, 4.0 engine, K&N oil AND air filter. While these numbers look pretty good, any suggestions on how to improve them? This is my first UOA.

Alum..........4
Chromium......1
Iron..........52
Copper........3
Lead..........5
Tin...........0
Molybdenum....53
Nickel........1
Manganese.....0
Silver........0
Titanium......0
Potassium.....2
Boron.........138
Silicon.......6
Sodium........6
Calcium.......2537
Magnesium.....15
Phosphorus....752
Zinc..........865
Barium........0

SUS Viscosity: 61.1
Flashpoint: 395
Fuel: less than 0.5
Antifreeze: 0.00
Water: 0.00
Solubles: 0.3

Comments from Blackstone:

MICHAEL: Your Jeep engine is looking good. Universal averages show typical wear metals for an oil
from this type of engine after about 4100 miles on the oil. Your oil was in use 4922 miles, and we
found all wear from the engine reading close to average levels and in the correct balance to show
normal mechanical parts inside. Air filtration (see silicon) looks fine. Insolubles read at 0.3%, so your
K&N oil filter is working well too. You'll have no trouble going longer on the oil, if you want. We
suggest trying 5500 miles next time.

 

[TR3-2001SE]

Everything looks good but the iron. Less miles or a Magnetic oil plug is about all I can think of to try. My iron is 9 using this same oil for 6000 miles but I have the magnetic oil plug. Maybe Jeeps are known for high iron. Do some looking at other Jeep UOA to see.

 

[Al]

I have a tough time believing that iron. Get them to confirm that number

 

[michaelc80]

Hi iron is pretty normal for this engine. Universal averages for this motor are 29 at 4100 mile OCI. Looking at other Jeep 4.0 UOA's it's pretty normal.

 

[KW]

I have a '98 with a 4.0 and Iron was 14 at 5700 miles with M1 0W40 and 14 at 10,402 miles with Amsoil 5W30. The iron at 52 seems very high to me and everything else seems to be par.

Do you make a lot of very short trips or maybe use to low of an octane fuel?

 

[Patman]

Yet another UOA where a K&N air filter is used, but yet silicon is very good.

 

[MNgopher]

This motor is known for higher iron numbers in general. The Universal average is around 30 ppm for iron. While 52 sounds high, for this motor it isn't unheard of by any means!


Cumb question: What kind of weather did this run get exposed to? My high FE comes with COLD weather.

 

[Bror Jace]

michaelc80, iron might come down a bit with the right oil (I would like a high-moly oil in this application – might reduce the iron) but you are right, these stovebolt 6s tend to show a lot of iron and it doesn’t mean much. What was Blackstone’s “Universal Average” for iron in this motor?

Have you searched this subsection using “4.0” or “Jeep” to see others’ UOAs?

I think you’ll find a few with iron a little lower than this ... but not much.

I would have recommended Pennzoil Long Life 15W-40 in this application but the newest batches of this stuff have the moly removed.

If you do decide to use any of the gas/diesel oils, be sure to test only the second and subsequent samples as the potent detergent/dispersant package will likely stir up a lot of old crud and skew the first UOA badly.

Another option would be to use a little Schaffer #132 additive or Lube Control along with the Mobil 1 oil to hopefully get the iron count down.

KW, have you ever seen any iron numbers for this engine lower than yours??

Patman, I’m not gonna risk blowing my MAF sensor, so the intake on my Sentra SE-R is remaining bone stock ... but the K&N cone on my Honda Civic also worked pretty well, with the Si levels falling in line with virgin Red Line silicon additive levels.

--- Bror Jace

 

[T-Keith]

quote:

---

Originally posted by TR3-2001SE:
Everything looks good but the iron. Less miles or a Magnetic oil plug is about all I can think of to try. My iron is 9 using this same oil for 6000 miles but I have the magnetic oil plug. Maybe Jeeps are known for high iron. Do some looking at other Jeep UOA to see.

---

I was thinking about this the other day. If you have a magnetic plug it should lower the amount of iron in your sample, but it doesn't really help the problem. I'd love to see what kind of difference it would make in a UOA. I'm starting to think these UOA aren't very accurate without complete information like VOA, driving style, engine and bearing types, magnetic plugs, ect.

-T

 

[Gary Allan]

My 99 4.0 had 70+ iron for 9k with a 9 + quart sump on M1 xw-30 ..reduced to 28 for 10k with D1.

I would think M1 0w-40 would be my next fill. This engine has proven to like heavier oils.

I'm currently @ 12k of a 12.5k OCI with D1. Hopefully my # are still good.

 

[michaelc80]

quote:

---

Originally posted by MNgopher:
This motor is known for higher iron numbers in general. The Universal average is around 30 ppm for iron. While 52 sounds high, for this motor it isn't unheard of by any means!


Cumb question: What kind of weather did this run get exposed to? My high FE comes with COLD weather.

---

This was summer driving, mostly highway driving.

The only change I made this time was a Baldwin filter, but I'm looking to see if I can drop the iron numbers by running a higher weight oil.

 

[michaelc80]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bror Jace:
michaelc80, iron might come down a bit with the right oil (I would like a high-moly oil in this application – might reduce the iron) but you are right, these stovebolt 6s tend to show a lot of iron and it doesn’t mean much. What was Blackstone’s “Universal Average” for iron in this motor?

Have you searched this subsection using “4.0” or “Jeep” to see others’ UOAs?

I think you’ll find a few with iron a little lower than this ... but not much.

I would have recommended Pennzoil Long Life 15W-40 in this application but the newest batches of this stuff have the moly removed.

If you do decide to use any of the gas/diesel oils, be sure to test only the second and subsequent samples as the potent detergent/dispersant package will likely stir up a lot of old crud and skew the first UOA badly.

Another option would be to use a little Schaffer #132 additive or Lube Control along with the Mobil 1 oil to hopefully get the iron count down.

KW, have you ever seen any iron numbers for this engine lower than yours??

Patman, I’m not gonna risk blowing my MAF sensor, so the intake on my Sentra SE-R is remaining bone stock ... but the K&N cone on my Honda Civic also worked pretty well, with the Si levels falling in line with virgin Red Line silicon additive levels.

--- Bror Jace

---

The average for this engine was 29 at 4100 miles. I've been looking, and it seems that this engine does better with higher weight oils such as Delvac 1. I'm kicking around switching at the next oil change and seeing what something like Delvac 1 will do.

 

[buster]

quote:

---

I would like a high-moly oil in this application – might reduce the iron

---

Bror what makes you think Moly would lower Iron? We've seen enough UOAs to show that Moly isn't needed at all. Examples, GC,MC and Amsoil.

 

[Motorbike]

How do we know that sulfur chemistry and the known effect that sulfur additives (a sulfur source)that can form iron sulfide on the surface is not what we see in part in these analysis's of Mobil 1 ? Sulfur exchanges with iron oxides to form iron sulfide. This formation affords a wear-protective coating on the surface.

Sulfur is used in a moly and the above in part comes courtesy of

R.T Vanderbilt

Then there is still that little Boron thing and the Iron Oxide layer it forms " newer boron " . I think someone said none are using this new type additive yet though but that was awhile back .