Audi 2.0 TFSI - 502.00 Choices

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I am trying to wade through the morass of information on valve deposits and oil choices for this engine (the newer TFSI, not the FSI) to pick an oil for use when my new vehicle gets to its first change at 5K miles.

What I've concluded thus far is:

1. The TFSI may be an improvement over the FSI in terms of its design in controlling intake valve deposits, but the jury is still out on that.

2. Regardless, there does not seem to be any good, reliable way to control or prevent these deposits short of pulling the manifold and manually cleaning the valves periodically. Fuel and intake treatments, catch cans, etc. have all proven to be minimally effective at best.

3. Some oils appear to promote faster deposit formation than others. Various theories abound, mostly centered on the volatility of the lighter/vapor fractions of the oil that can get past even a catch can (which seem to be ineffective in preventing deposits). This may be caused or exacerbated by fuel dilution, so an oil that can control its own volatility in the face of fuel is good.

4. I have a 4 year/50K mile warranty and I am going to document proper oil changes with a 502.00 oil - that is worth more than any minor or speculative advantage in running a non-spec oil that supposedly forms fewer deposits.

Right now I am looking at M1 0W-40, GC 0W-30, and Motul 8100 X-cess. If anyone can suggest other 502.00 oil that is ester based or may have better volatility and/or fuel dilution characteristics, I'm all ears.
 
"GC" isn't ester based. You need to look up the oils you want to use and look at the PDS and find one with the lowest NOACK volitility score. I wish I could be more helpful, but you need to do the research. You are at least narrowing the field if you want an ester based oil. Start with the MOTUL offerings.
 
Possibly LubroMoly 5w-40/0w-40 and Pentosin PentoSpeed 0w-30 could be added to your list, but I'm not convinced they would do any better than M1 0w-40...
 
Originally Posted By: chubbs1
"GC" isn't ester based.


I know that. That's why I'm asking for ester-based suggestions, as I think an ester-based oil would be less volatile in the face of fuel dilution.

Quote:
You need to look up the oils you want to use and look at the PDS and find one with the lowest NOACK volitility score. I wish I could be more helpful, but you need to do the research. You are at least narrowing the field if you want an ester based oil. Start with the MOTUL offerings.


I'm not convinced that the NOACK numbers necessarily correlate to lesser volatility of the type and cause we're dealing with here. The NOACK testing as far as I know does not test oil that has 2 and 3 percent fuel dilution, nor does it specify which portions of the oil across the molecular mass spectrum become volatile.

That said, I am considering that factor in my decisionmaking as it may be the only widely published data point that could have some correlation.
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: chubbs1
"GC" isn't ester based.

And neither is M1 0w-40, AFAIK.


No, it's not. In fact I'm not sure the Motul 8100 X-cess is ester-based, either, though many Motul products are.
 
x-cess is mainly GIII based oil with a drop of ester and quite old formulation, conventional saps like M1 0W-40 as well.
I would try AMSOIL AFL 5W-40 and look at Noack + Flash Point + SAPS together.
 
Motul X-Cess 5w-40 is now SM rated and contains no esters. Lots of suppliers still post info on the old SL formulation.
 
Originally Posted By: wlyszkow
x-cess is mainly GIII based oil with a drop of ester and quite old formulation, conventional saps like M1 0W-40 as well.
I would try AMSOIL AFL 5W-40 and look at Noack + Flash Point + SAPS together.


1. X-cess appears to be PAO based from what I can tell. It is certainly not Group III.

2. One of my criteria is 502.00 approval for warranty purposes, so Amsoil and Redline are out. It needs to be on the official list, not just "formulated to meet."
 
Originally Posted By: dbrowne1
Originally Posted By: wlyszkow
x-cess is mainly GIII based oil with a drop of ester and quite old formulation, conventional saps like M1 0W-40 as well.
I would try AMSOIL AFL 5W-40 and look at Noack + Flash Point + SAPS together.


1. X-cess appears to be PAO based from what I can tell. It is certainly not Group III.

2. One of my criteria is 502.00 approval for warranty purposes, so Amsoil and Redline are out. It needs to be on the official list, not just "formulated to meet."

I'm sure that you don't know Polish but take a look at x-cess MSDS:
www.buwar.pl/inc/motul/pdf/xcess5w40.pdf Nov 2009
 
Motul 8100 E Tech is ester based and 502 approved, but pricey.

Closest easier to get in US is GC and Mobil 0w-40. GC is PAO group IV based and M1 0w-40 is group III/group IV mix based.
 
NOT 100% GIII 8100 series Motul oils curently are only:
0W-20 eco-lite - only 1% GIII
0W-30 x-lite (25-50% GIII) but there is JP version with no GIII like 0W-20 eco-lite
0W-40 x-max, 5W-30 x-clean+ , eco-clean 0W-30 and eco-nergy 0W-30 (25-50% GIII)
5W-30 spec VW 504/507 (25-50% GIII)
All the rest of 8100 and "specific" are 50-100% GIII
Source: http://www.motul.fr/pl/en/products
 
BTW: 300V series oils contain
DISTILLATES (PETROLEUM), SOLVENT-REFINED HEAVY PARAFFINIC (probably additives but GII based?)
5W-30 Power, Chrono 10W-40 & Comp 15W-50 < 2,5%
5W-40 Power & 20W-60 LeMans < 10%
0W-20 < 1%
 
Originally Posted By: wlyszkow
NOT 100% GIII 8100 series Motul oils curently are only:
0W-20 eco-lite - only 1% GIII
0W-30 x-lite (25-50% GIII) but there is JP version with no GIII like 0W-20 eco-lite
0W-40 x-max, 5W-30 x-clean+ , eco-clean 0W-30 and eco-nergy 0W-30 (25-50% GIII)
5W-30 spec VW 504/507 (25-50% GIII)
All the rest of 8100 and "specific" are 50-100% GIII
Source: http://www.motul.fr/pl/en/products


I don't see that information listed on any of the product data sheets at the Motul site you linked. What about the E-tech oils? I thought the E stood for ester?
 
Originally Posted By: wlyszkow
BTW: 300V series oils contain
DISTILLATES (PETROLEUM), SOLVENT-REFINED HEAVY PARAFFINIC (probably additives but GII based?)
5W-30 Power, Chrono 10W-40 & Comp 15W-50 < 2,5%
5W-40 Power & 20W-60 LeMans < 10%
0W-20 < 1%


Every synthetic motor oil has at least a small dose of conventional oil in it - it's necessary to dissolve/suspend certain additives.
 
There is no E-Tech 0W-40, only x-max 0W-40. Go e.g. there:
http://www.motul.fr/pl/en/products/57?f[range]=25&f[viscosity]=44
and than use: Safety data sheet
Put your name and e-mail and you'll be able to search what you want - all MSDS in pdf.
I suppose e-tech 0W-40 will be simillar to x-max 0W-40 (25-50% GIII).

25-50% ~mineral is IMO too much for additives suspension purposes only... it is all about costs.
 
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