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#1713636 - 12/20/09 02:02 AM API SF rated oils
glen242 Offline


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 63
Loc: Western PA
I have read that SF rated oil is fine for flat tappet cam engines. However, SF rated oil is now obsolete. I have searched the net to try and determine what the SF rated oils had in the way of ZDDP (Zinc/Phosphorus) and found nothing.

Does anyone have info on what the actual SF specs were, for Z & P on SF rated oils?

So much [censored] concerning ZDDP levels on oil that, if I had the original API SF specs, I could make a more inteligent choice on what oil to run.

Please don't give me specs on the boo-tique oils that are popular, or on any other oils.

Given the correct information, I can make my own choice.

Thanks,

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#1713639 - 12/20/09 02:05 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: glen242]
genynnc Offline


Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 388
Loc: OR
Believe me, SF oil should have plenty of z & p buddy.
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#1713641 - 12/20/09 02:08 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: genynnc]
addyguy Offline


Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 13915
Loc: Canada
SF oils would have lots of Zn & P; but not much else......
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#1713651 - 12/20/09 02:25 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: addyguy]
glen242 Offline


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 63
Loc: Western PA
Not to be grumpy, but did you guys READ my post? I just want API SF specs on Z & P.

But I'm a really old, 67, hotrodder, so I have a right to be grumpy!

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#1713663 - 12/20/09 03:06 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: glen242]
FusilliJerry82 Offline


Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 779
Loc: Richboro, PA
I saw a topic here before about SF oil, specifically Accel brand at Walmart which is the only brand I know of, that detailed zinc levels for this very reason. If I recall correctly, zinc levels were actually a bit low even by SM standards. The SF rating really just gives them an excuse to sell an oil without quality controls.

Really the best oil for a classic car is probably an HDEO or Racing oil. More than enough zinc in either.
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#1713680 - 12/20/09 05:03 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: FusilliJerry82]
Colt45ws Offline


Registered: 08/15/06
Posts: 8748
Loc: Central Washington
Originally Posted By: FusilliJerry82
I saw a topic here before about SF oil, specifically Accel brand at Walmart which is the only brand I know of, that detailed zinc levels for this very reason. If I recall correctly, zinc levels were actually a bit low even by SM standards. The SF rating really just gives them an excuse to sell an oil without quality controls.

Really the best oil for a classic car is probably an HDEO or Racing oil. More than enough zinc in either.

Exactly. The SF specification is obsolete, API does not license it, so there is no checking of quality. HDEO or racing oil is what I would use.
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#1713707 - 12/20/09 07:00 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: Colt45ws]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 10007
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
Glen - I like how NO ONE answered your question. Do a web search. Having 15-20% ester in the the oil is just as or more important than a high zddp. Too high a zddp will cause cam galling - so its not a cure all. Off the shelf at walmart is Mobil 1 high mileage 10w-30 is a full real synthetic with a -65 pour point and high (GF3 level) zddp. Dont know if it has adequate POE/AN ester in the base stock on tyop of the 85% PAO.
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#1713722 - 12/20/09 07:22 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: ARCOgraphite]
DieselTech Offline


Registered: 10/27/09
Posts: 1969
Loc: AZ
I believe mystik has a great SF rated product.
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#1713726 - 12/20/09 07:24 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: DieselTech]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 10007
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=2088518

Glen: read the above link for more info - gf1 was .12%, gf2, .10%
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#1713728 - 12/20/09 07:26 AM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: glen242]
Pablo Offline


Registered: 10/28/02
Posts: 46979
Loc: Duvall WA - Pacific NW USA
Originally Posted By: glen242
Does anyone have info on what the actual SF specs were, for Z & P on SF rated oils?


There were no specifications about P and Zn for SF. IOW there was no limitation on P and Zn. Typical PCMO's used 1000-1200 ppm or so.

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#1714253 - 12/20/09 04:54 PM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: ARCOgraphite]
FusilliJerry82 Offline


Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 779
Loc: Richboro, PA
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Glen - I like how NO ONE answered your question.


The fact that its less than standard SM levels answers his question IMO. He may have asked for exact levels, but thats only so he could compare it with others to determine what I said.
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#1714273 - 12/20/09 05:22 PM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: FusilliJerry82]
glen242 Offline


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 63
Loc: Western PA
Correct me if I am wrong, from what I am reading here, typical API SF oil contained 0.10-0.12 Zinc and Phosphorus?

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#1714281 - 12/20/09 05:31 PM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: glen242]
addyguy Offline


Registered: 09/08/05
Posts: 13915
Loc: Canada
Seriously, you want API SF oil? Here ya go, the real deal:

http://www.gulflubricants.net/CMSFiles/File/PDF/Engine-Oils/Security_Value_EOs_&_ATF_PB.pdf

Would LOVE to see a VOA of this product!
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#1714302 - 12/20/09 06:04 PM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: addyguy]
glen242 Offline


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 63
Loc: Western PA
Originally Posted By: addyguy
Seriously, you want API SF oil? Here ya go, the real deal:

http://www.gulflubricants.net/CMSFiles/File/PDF/Engine-Oils/Security_Value_EOs_&_ATF_PB.pdf

Would LOVE to see a VOA of this product!


No, I don't want SF oil! I just want to know what the Zinc and Phosphorus was in the SF oil so I can purchase new oil formulation oil that has the same amount of Z & P.

I am sure a modern oil, with at least as much Z&P as the SF oil had, will work fine on my Gen 1 flat tappet engine.

I was asking for hard numbers, not sales pitches for various oils, or opinions on what oils would work.

So far, the best info I can find here is that SF had between 0.10 and 0.12 Z&P. So any modern oil with these levels should work fine.

Pleas correct me if I am wrong.

Thanks,

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#1714319 - 12/20/09 06:24 PM Re: API SF rated oils [Re: glen242]
Gunatics_Adler Offline


Registered: 10/10/09
Posts: 268
Loc: Iowa, USA
If your assumptions on zinc levels are right you could use a SJ or possibly a SL. Very few off the shelf passenger car oils meet those levels. You should probably run a HDEO like Rotella.
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