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#1666049 - 11/10/09 04:16 PM Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research
modularv8 Offline


Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 694
Loc: Texas
Is Motorcraft oil good? UOA's consistently say yes, but what is in it that makes it so good?

Ford has consistently held for the years the top spot for R&D spending in the world.

http://spectrum.ieee.org/images/dec05/images/rdf1.pdf

Ford powertrain engineering works very closely with its suppliers to insure there is a quality standard that is consistent with their product specifications.

MC 5w20 Base Oil (MSDS): http://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/Main/msds/us173219us.pdf

HIGHLY REFINED MINERAL OIL 8042-47-5D 60-100%
ZINC COMPOUND 7440-66-6Z 0.5-1.5%

Let's start with the base oil. Highly refined base oil could be Group II/II+ or III, but more importantly is its purity and lubricating properties. Castrol, Valvoline, etc that are synthetic use Group III HC derived base oil CAS#64742-54-7 (DISTILLATES (PETROLEUM),HYDROTREATED HEAVY PARAFFINIC. http://msds.ashland.com/msds-ext/msdsDow...archHC&id=4

So what is the difference between 8042-47-5 and 64742-54-7? One thing we know is that the quality of a hydrotreated derived synthetic base oil depends on its purity, viscosity index, and level of saturation (hydrogen/no double bonds).

Finding this information was very difficult, but found some ecological studies based on motor oil.

So click on the link and go to pg. 42. http://www.petroleumhpv.org/docs/lube_oils/lubeoils_robustsummary_March%2024%20.pdf

Here you will see both of these base oils compared by their Physico-chemical properties (HBO = 64742-54-7/Synthetic GrpIII) (WTO 8042-47-5). Note:The pour point listed under WTO should be -15C. You can see this in the report on pg. 5 or pg.82 attachment 1 and also on the Conoco/Phillips site.

Notice on pg. 43 the 60% distribution of paraffins for WTO relative to HBO. This is a property you want in a lubricating fluid (Van der Waal/London Forces). Next notice that WTO contains no aromatics due to the harsh/severe hydrotreating relative to HBO. Another property of superior lubricating fluid and purity. Finally, notice that WTO does not contain impurities Furfural, S, N, etc. In fact, WTO is not toxicologically significant. Because of its purity, it can be pharmaceuticas/food grade upon certification.

Impurities in conventional lubricants leave deposits in engines. WTO is pure, more pure than HBO which is what most synthetic motor oil are based.
Motorcraft site also mentions the purity of this base oil. Unusual because very hard to find motor oils that use this base stock outside of Conoco/Phillips, Petro Canada.

The hallmark of a synthetic is its inherent VI. Click on http://www.petroleumhpv.org/docs/lube_oils/lubeoils_testplan_March%2024%20Final%20.pdf
Go to pg. 8 physical properties. Here you will see the KV for HBO & WTO.

VI for WTO (8042-47-5) b]108[/b]
VI for HBO (64742-54-7) 97

So the base oil in MC5w20 has a higher VI than the synthetic base oil that most other synthetics utilize.

Now, I am aware that there are formulations and base oils are only part of the equation. But the effort is only to demonstrate the difference in base oils used by Motorcraft and the other synthetics.

Then there is the additive package. Notice that Motorcraft is using some other form of Zn? ZDDP competes in certain base fluids (esters). May also explain the use of Boron; again Motorcraft is not using the standard Boro-Nitride. Perhaps some of the newer sophisticated organic AW/EP additives. I believe Ford is giving every effort to go as green as possible and is developing some new technologies.

I'm convinced that MC5w20 is more of a bargain that we thought it was for $11.50/5 gal. container at WM. So if it's that good, then why isn't priced higher. There is no marketing advertisement of Motorcraft oil, cuts into FCSD margins in order for Ford to push 5w20.

Q. Does the difference in price between Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 and SAE 5W-30 really reflect a better oil?

A: Yes, Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 is a better oil than Motorcraft® SAE 5W-30. However, in response to Dealer Council Ford Motor Company has priced Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 Premium Synthetic Blend Motor Oil exactly the same as Motorcraft® SAE 5W-30 Super Premium Motor Oil if you purchase it in BULK, 55-GALLON DRUMS, or the 5-QUART JUG. Only individual quart bottles of Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 cost more than Motorcraft® SAE 5W-30. Again, the better base oils, and increased additives such as friction modifiers and anti-oxidants used to formulate for the performance levels in the SAE 5W-20 do cost more, and reflect the significant increase in performance.


By the way, I don't work for Ford. I just think they have a great product.

So what do you all think? Does this make sense? I used to work as a research scientist (chemist) at SWRI, so I find this stuff fascinating but lately has taken too much of my time.


Edited by modularv8 (11/10/09 04:21 PM)
_________________________
2006 F150 5.4L

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#1666068 - 11/10/09 04:30 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: modularv8]
Andrew MKZ Offline


Registered: 10/04/09
Posts: 2811
Loc: USA
To much information confused
_________________________
2010 Lincoln MKZ
23,500 miles

Formerly DT466E_bus

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#1666075 - 11/10/09 04:39 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: modularv8]
2oldtommy Offline


Registered: 10/29/06
Posts: 838
Loc: Ohio
I have used MC 5W-20 in my Honda since 2003.From what I have read elsewhere, Ford worked closely with Conoco-Phillips to develop their Motorcraft 5W-20. Thank you for the post of various sites to study for more info. FWIW Oldtommy

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#1666080 - 11/10/09 04:41 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: modularv8]
lewdwig Offline


Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 645
Loc: Southwest Michigan
Anyone have a Chemical Abstract Service (CAS) database?
_________________________
1996 Saturn SL2
2001 Saturn SL2
2001 Subaru Forester L
2004 Mitsu Endeavor

Google search:
(search terms here) site:bobistheoilguy.com


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#1666085 - 11/10/09 04:44 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: Andrew MKZ]
DieselTech Offline


Registered: 10/27/09
Posts: 1969
Loc: AZ
so your looking at MC full synthetic then if it's Group III. Yes a very good oil especially for the price. I can buy Kendall full syn for 3.20 a qt right now to. Mixing apples to apples I would quite jump to say 5-20 is better then 5-30.....Apples to Apples.

Yes oil weight has alot to do with what the manufatures would like to see you use, but Climate also plays a huge roll. Especially where it's 120 degrees in the summer.

Good post, we all know MC is a quality product with likely the best pricepoint in the industry. I use the syn blend in our 07, but just picked up some Kendall full syn for the next go round ( Same as MC full syn )
_________________________
03 Ford F250 7.3 (Lots of Mods). Redline & baldwin 7039
07 Ford F150 fill. Penz Ultra 5-20 & Bosch 3410
99 ford F150 4.6 fill. Redline 5-30 & P1

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#1666097 - 11/10/09 04:53 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: Andrew MKZ]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 8657
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
Intersting, but I will never crack the nut of the witchcraft of base oil blending for motorcars. Purity, I'll take 4x distilled vodka v. 3x*. if its going in the gut; if in the motor, I suppose there is a limit in the blend and additisation where impurities would impede the desired properties of the lubricant - but what is this limit and how much am I willing to pay extra for it? Moot argument as the oil wont be food grade after residing in the crackcase for a few hundred hours, how much unused oil is added to the environment?

* Rethinking this, give me some dirtied Scotch Whiskey instead!


Edited by ARCOgraphite (11/10/09 04:56 PM)
_________________________
2014 Nissan Rogue S CVT, OC#0 56mi-Factory 5W30 + NISSAN
Filter
2015 Forester 6MT 5Door, OC#1 4361mi-VSP 0W20(?)+ Blue service "FRAM" Filter

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#1666100 - 11/10/09 04:57 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: Andrew MKZ]
SuperDave456 Offline


Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 2259
Loc: Dallas, Texas
From what I have taken from everything I have read is that it takes better base stocks and additives to make a 5w20 than to make a 5w30.

The interesting part is if Ford is actually choosing an additive package and telling a distributor how to manufacture it.

Now THAT would be interesting data to review. Although I doubt I would understand it.

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#1666109 - 11/10/09 05:05 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: modularv8]
Art_Vandelay Offline


Registered: 11/30/08
Posts: 1339
Loc: USA
Ford delivers tremendous value. The more I read about the company the more I realize they know what they're doing. The Motorcraft filters, spark plug wires and this semi-synthetic are all about the best of their kind for the money.

It's impressive.
_________________________
It all started when I decided to get my oil analyzed instead of my head examined...

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#1666116 - 11/10/09 05:11 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: Art_Vandelay]
daves87rs Offline


Registered: 02/23/09
Posts: 13610
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: Art_Vandelay
Ford delivers tremendous value. The more I read about the company the more I realize they know what they're doing. The Motorcraft filters, spark plug wires and this semi-synthetic are all about the best of their kind for the money.

It's impressive.


+1
_________________________
“The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing.”

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#1666122 - 11/10/09 05:13 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: daves87rs]
DieselTech Offline


Registered: 10/27/09
Posts: 1969
Loc: AZ
My sig says it all about ford, not to mention they pull a profit and deliver great vehicles. Cant wait until the 6.7 diesel is back to being a ford engine. 6.0 have kept me in business for awhile though.
_________________________
03 Ford F250 7.3 (Lots of Mods). Redline & baldwin 7039
07 Ford F150 fill. Penz Ultra 5-20 & Bosch 3410
99 ford F150 4.6 fill. Redline 5-30 & P1

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#1666183 - 11/10/09 05:51 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: daves87rs]
pbm Offline


Registered: 04/19/04
Posts: 5306
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: daves87rs
Originally Posted By: Art_Vandelay
Ford delivers tremendous value. The more I read about the company the more I realize they know what they're doing. The Motorcraft filters, spark plug wires and this semi-synthetic are all about the best of their kind for the money.

It's impressive.


+1


+2.
I saw an article about the 2010 Fusion in todays NY Post (or maybe it was The NY Daily News since I looked at both papers at lunchtime). It really is an impressive car and the new 2.5 4 cyl. delivers more power AND better fuel economy than the previous 2.3. They really liked the 6 spd manual version.
At least one American car company is competing...

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#1666186 - 11/10/09 05:52 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: pbm]
bustednutz Offline


Registered: 01/18/08
Posts: 942
Loc: Virginia Bch. VA
Ireally like the new Fusion as well. May trade my Mazda 3 for one down the road. As for the MC 5w20, this is great info as I just changed both cars oil over to it two days ago.
_________________________


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#1666237 - 11/10/09 06:24 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: DieselTech]
mechtech2 Offline


Registered: 09/05/06
Posts: 19479
Loc: Chicago Area
modularv8 - That is a LOT of homework! Thank you.
My clues to how good MC is is from UOAs, and simply how darn clear it is out of the bottle.

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#1666252 - 11/10/09 06:33 PM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: Art_Vandelay]
Jason2007 Offline


Registered: 04/05/07
Posts: 591
Loc: virginia
+1

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#1666844 - 11/11/09 07:44 AM Re: Motorcraft 5w20 Synthetic Blend Base Oil Research [Re: modularv8]
sayjac Offline


Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 8357
Loc: The Old North State
Let me first say, I've used MC 5w20 in an 01 Civic since new. It was the first 5w20 that I can remember finding for DIY in 5qt. jugs at Wally World. The first 5w20 that said syn blend, and always been a great value. Just a couple points though.

Quote:
Q. Does the difference in price between Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 and SAE 5W-30 really reflect a better oil?

A: Yes, Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 is a better oil than Motorcraft® SAE 5W-30. However, in response to Dealer Council Ford Motor Company has priced Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 Premium Synthetic Blend Motor Oil exactly the same as Motorcraft® SAE 5W-30 Super Premium Motor Oil if you purchase it in BULK, 55-GALLON DRUMS, or the 5-QUART JUG. Only individual quart bottles of Motorcraft® SAE 5W-20 cost more than Motorcraft® SAE 5W-30. Again, the better base oils, and increased additives such as friction modifiers and anti-oxidants used to formulate for the performance levels in the SAE 5W-20 do cost more, and reflect the significant increase in performance.

Though initially not the case, NOW and for some time, both the 5w20 and the 5w30 NOW say synthetic blend. IMO, I would consider both viscosities equally good. Many BITOGers lament the fact that the 5w30 doesn't come in the less expensive jugs.

As for the price, at Wally World all the MC viscosities in qts. cost the same, ~$2.77.

Depending on your vehicle's recommended oil spec, one could use any of the MC syn blend viscosities with confidence. The 5w20 in jugs is the best value though.

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