My 2008 Toyota Sienna was garbage. I wish Toyota luck in righting the ship but think they have gotten too big and would be in the same boat as GM if they were not given special treatment by the USA govt. and were under the business killing thumb of labor unions like the big 3.

Toyota makes nothing that compares to Ford currently.

All perceived quality? NOT!

My 2003 Saturn ION has had multiple A/C control panel failures, an ignition lock cylinder that totally fell apart, an evaporator that leaked water on the passenger side floor, and control arm bushings that must be replaced.

People I know with Hondas and Toyotas don't have this happen to them.

So now your saying a Ford is better??

Neither are better, and there is really no "best". It's all opinion, to some even todays Toyota's are better than Ford and vice versa.

I feel yes that Toyota did slack off in certain departments but they also made up for it in others. The Scion division was a resounding success in terms of "bringing in the younger generation". It also brought afford ability into the line up. Ford has also been in slumps and had its shares of ups and downs and only recently during its darkest hour was able to come up with a solid gameplan and produce some top notch vehicles, albeit longevity is yet to be known.

I am a Toyota guy, I am also an old school Jeep guy. Domestic or Import, I really don't care, so long as its affordable, priced right, reliable and the dealership doesn't treat its customer like [censored] then its good in my eyes!

I simply disagree that adding a whole car line (and its associated overhead) is a good or permanent way to fix that kind of problem. Oldsmobile didn't start out as an "old coot's car," it became that through neglect and corporate infighting that gave the youth-oriented cars to other divisions. Oldsmobile was once a muscle car powerhouse with a good young to mid-age following. Scion could easily become the next old folks car for Toyota, or get lost to youth in the next economic crunch. A more practical approach seems to be paring down the number of "nameplates" and diversifying models within existing lines to attract new buyers. Its working wonders for Cadillac, where the CTS and particularly the CTS-V is attracting pretty much the optimum customer- pre-middle-age people at the height of their purchasing power, not retirees and not youth that will bail to the used car market at the first hint of economic distress.

And since when did base Toyotas become "not affordable" so that a lower-end line is needed? If a fresh college grad can't buy a Corolla, then Toyota has truly lost one of its core values.

I think Toyota needs to look back to their "hey day" from 1980-1990...It is not a case of perception that at that point in time Toyota made the most reliable cars, and small trucks on the road.

They were far outpacing all other companies except maybe Honda in this respect.

I think Toyota needs to rethink the complexity factor as well, sure they need to remain competitive but in lesser models Corolla, Yaris, ect, they need to pare down the number of unnecessary items.


Most important INCREASE HARD PART COMPONENT QUALITY!!!!

I have to tell you that depending on what the car makes wants virtually any modern day supplier can provide rock solid realibility and durability depending on the cost factor.

Toyota needs to charge a little more, and pare down the gadgets to offer the kind of robust product they did back in the 1980-1990 period.

Post-modern thinking at it's finest!

If there is no car that is "best", then what is the definition of "best"? Have we not taken the whole category of qualitative words and made them nothing more than random assemblages of consonants and vowels?

Back to the previously interrupted topic...

Clark

+1 fire the engineers and designers the new Toyotas are Nissan ugly.

The car mfgs eventually realize that the car buying public has little discernment and will buy anything that is marketed to them.

This should be fairly easy for them as new vehicle sales will be down permanently here and they can slow the assembly lines down.

Every car manufacture has their flaws. I guess i got pretty lucky with my Tacoma....i wish they dropped a small diesel someday.

My dads cousin bought a 1980 Toyota when she started teaching in 1980 and she just retired and scrapped the car. The car had over 600K KM's (375K miles) and was still running fine with the original engine/transmission. The body gave out because she stopped rust proofing it some years back and our winters are harsh.

I'm trying to get a picture of my dad and her with it. My dad did all the service and he knows there is a photo kicking around somewhere.

This scenario doesn't surprise me at all. I am actually old enough to have some memory of Toyota cars of that era and cars like the Corolla were just about totally bullet proof and servicing was a snap to boot. I would even add that even Toyota late 77-79 models were also quite good. Although they still were lagging behind in rust resistance and AC functioning.

I remember driving an early 80's Corolla and while it was a boring car, it was just so well made and you knew you could beat up on it and it would just keep coming back for more. They were simple and not loaded with all these electronic baubles either but the satisfaction was that all the important bits lasted and REFUSED to break.

I think that someones comment about how the US customer will swallow any product that is marketed to them may have been true 5 years ago but it isn't that way anymore, especially with the economic situation, it has FORCED the consumer to be much much more decerning especially about longevity, durability, and ease of service. Times are much different than just a decade ago where I do think you had the typical 'Merican thinking "the dream" was a spend thrift, throwaway item economy. No more.

What? I will clarify.

Ford is better than toyota.

F150 better than tundra
focus better than corolla
fusion better than camry

easier to understand?

Well it would be if these rich buggers that control the wealth would give us a little instead of being so greedy.