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#1611477 - 09/26/09 10:04 AM Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock
BigBird57 Offline


Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 24
Loc: Florida
Has anyone had any long term experience with this new lubricant from DOW? It is a polyalkylene glycol based fluid.(PAG). It has a high viscosity index that is a direct replacement for an ISO VG 32 mineral oil.

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#1636805 - 10/18/09 08:08 PM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: BigBird57]
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 10541
Loc: Midwest
For what application, year, make, equipment, etc?
_________________________
Nothing astonishes men so much as common sense and plain dealing. R.W. Emerson

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#1636903 - 10/18/09 09:03 PM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: MolaKule]
BigBird57 Offline


Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 24
Loc: Florida
This a a combustion turbine oil. Relatively new to the industry.
GE Frame 7FA combustion turbine.

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#1637045 - 10/18/09 11:01 PM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: BigBird57]
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 10541
Loc: Midwest
_________________________
Nothing astonishes men so much as common sense and plain dealing. R.W. Emerson

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#1645202 - 10/25/09 11:42 AM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: MolaKule]
BigBird57 Offline


Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 24
Loc: Florida
Interesting. Thanks

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#1651230 - 10/29/09 08:34 PM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: BigBird57]
bruce381 Offline
Tribologist


Registered: 06/23/05
Posts: 3285
Loc: Millbrae, CA
very high dollar perhaps that is why PAG's are not used more.
bruce

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#1706392 - 12/13/09 06:23 PM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: bruce381]
JohnBrowning Offline


Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 9448
Loc: USA
I thought that POE would do much the same thing in this application would it not?

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#1917881 - 06/09/10 02:02 PM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: JohnBrowning]
BigBird57 Offline


Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 24
Loc: Florida
Polyol Esters are typically used in ac compressors and in refrigderation systems. Combustion Turbines subject the oil to high temperatures and doubles in most systems as a hydraulic fluid. I do not know how the varnish potential would hold with a POE.

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#1930455 - 06/22/10 10:47 AM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: BigBird57]
GaryC Offline


Registered: 06/22/10
Posts: 1
Loc: Las Vegas, Nevada
Did you learn any more since this previous post on Ecosafe TF25? Looks like they have it now in several GE 7FA combustion turbines. Any bad news on the product that has been placed for some time in a peaking unit?

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#1941356 - 07/03/10 05:16 AM Re: Ecosafe TF 25 PAG Basestock [Re: GaryC]
BigBird57 Offline


Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 24
Loc: Florida
No bad news that I am aware of. Calpine is using the product in several GE 7FA's. The cost seems to be the major drawback. However it would take about two failed starts due to a sticky IGV Moog valve to recover the investment. Varnish is a big issue in this industry. Group II oils give about two years of good service then the varnish gremlins return.
Innovation comes painfully slow in this industry. No one wants to be first. Demming, the father of Statisical Process Control gave creedance to the statement that we continue to do the same things over and over again and expect a different result.

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