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#1596542 - 09/11/09 11:57 AM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: StevieC]
ottotheclown Offline


Registered: 06/21/09
Posts: 2040
Loc: new york
Though I am running Mobil 1 we read not only the UOA problem with iron, but also the start up tick, oil burning, valve noise etc. So that makes me think how could this be a good oil with all these problems? Real life I have none of these problems but why bother ?Other oils are just as good. The UOA might not be the best, but hardly do you see PP in trouble. Mobil now that is another story. So UOA might not be the best for everyting , atleast it can give you a pretty overall picture of how a oil performs. Yes I agree XOM should atleast address this website if they sponsor it.

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#1596546 - 09/11/09 12:00 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: OVERKILL]
aquariuscsm Offline


Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 10012
Loc: South Texas,USA
Mobil 1 0W40 and 15W50 I`ve read to be grp IV/V.

On the UOA topic,dinos always seem to produce less wear metals than synths,and you also never hear any reports of excessive engine noise with dinos. In my experience,my engine runs MUCH smoother with dinos,but,the manual tranny and read diff perform night and day difference better with synths. That made me believe the Timken test definitely applies to gears and not engines.
_________________________
1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
Syntec 10W40/Fram Ultra
Amsoil MTG(tranny)
Amsoil 80W90 GL5(rear diff)
Mobil 1 ATF
Redline Water Wetter

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#1596573 - 09/11/09 12:19 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: OVERKILL]
7777 Offline


Registered: 08/02/09
Posts: 166
Loc: NY
Use Redline, no speculation here,Its a group 5 and its the real deal and costs 1 dollar more! Its a no brainer!!

This is what i use.. slobber smile2 slobber

_________________________
09 Suzuki SX4 Touring (nav)5sp,black,RedLine 5-30

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#1596584 - 09/11/09 12:37 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: ottotheclown]
OVERKILL Online   content


Registered: 04/28/08
Posts: 26730
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: ottotheclown
Though I am running Mobil 1 we read not only the UOA problem with iron, but also the start up tick, oil burning, valve noise etc. So that makes me think how could this be a good oil with all these problems? Real life I have none of these problems but why bother ?Other oils are just as good. The UOA might not be the best, but hardly do you see PP in trouble. Mobil now that is another story. So UOA might not be the best for everyting , atleast it can give you a pretty overall picture of how a oil performs. Yes I agree XOM should atleast address this website if they sponsor it.


In 20+ years now of using M1, I've never had ANY of those problems.
_________________________
Network Engineer
02 Expedition
01 BMW ///M5
06 Charger R/T

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#1596603 - 09/11/09 01:02 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: OVERKILL]
deven Offline


Registered: 06/28/05
Posts: 2149
Loc: Massachusetts
_________________________
ROYAL PURPLE GUY

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#1596619 - 09/11/09 01:15 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: deven]
StevieC Offline


Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 14339
Loc: Niagara Falls, ON, CA (near)
There will be no talking bad about M1 or face the consequences... LOL


_________________________
'06 Hyundai Sante Fe - 330K KM's
Current Oil: RLI 0w30 (Ask me why)

Don't be part of the Sheeple, check frequently for wool over your eyes. wink

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#1596644 - 09/11/09 01:37 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: StevieC]
1999nick Offline


Registered: 01/14/04
Posts: 1085
Loc: Germantown TN 38138
Originally Posted By: StevieC
Originally Posted By: buster
I think there is a good chance M1 will be mostly PAO/V going forward, if it's not already. It's possible the Katrina disruption impacted their move to some Grp III along with price. Their oils still contain significant amounts of PAO, more than any other oil readily available. Some are all Grp IV/V based, others are blends.
I'm pretty sure that Amsoil has more PAO that Mobil-1 Just look at their cold pour point comparison. The SSO 0w30 is -60oF


M1 10W30 High Mileage also has a pour point of -60 (actually the chart says -54 degrees Centigrade). Don't forget that there are about 20 different formulations and weights of M1, as there are formulations of Amsoil.

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#1596657 - 09/11/09 01:45 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: deven]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 26224
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: deven

I will ask my question over and over until I get the answer that I want to hear! LOL
_________________________
'02 530i (PU 5W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T
'13 F700 GS (BMW HP 15W-50)

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#1596687 - 09/11/09 02:10 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: 7777]
BerndV Offline


Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 244
Loc: Kalispell, Montana
Redline is the ONLY company that will unequivocally answer questions about base stocks. Their customer service is the best in the business. These two indisputable facts alone make their products worth the money to me. Mobil 1 absolutely leaves everyone else choking on their dust when it comes to marketing a product that was at one time among the very best. However, their obfuscation and evasiveness regarding wear issues (re:TomNJ post) and base stocks would make most politicians blush.
_________________________
2014 Mercedes E550 4Matic
Das Beste oder nichts!

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#1596692 - 09/11/09 02:13 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: buster]
BerndV Offline


Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 244
Loc: Kalispell, Montana
Originally Posted By: buster
I think there is a good chance M1 will be mostly PAO/V going forward, if it's not already.
Buster, please elaborate.
_________________________
2014 Mercedes E550 4Matic
Das Beste oder nichts!

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#1596697 - 09/11/09 02:18 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: BerndV]
tig1 Offline


Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 9957
Loc: Illinois
Even though I've used M1 oils for 31 years, don't you idi---, I mean guys use it. It will clog up your valve train and cause noise and produce rod knocks. I have to scrape out the sludge every year and that's with 3000 mile OCIs. 50,000 miles is the longest I've gone before an overhaul is required. Boy I'm glad I finally got that off my mind!
_________________________
2007 Ford Fusion 146,000 miles
M1 0-20
2007 Ford Focus 130,000 miles
M1 0-20
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF
M1 10-30 in all OPE

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#1596700 - 09/11/09 02:22 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: tig1]
StevieC Offline


Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 14339
Loc: Niagara Falls, ON, CA (near)
I will repeat again as I have said in other threads... WHO CARES WHAT BASE STOCK AN OIL FORMULATOR USES, IT IS REAL WORLD PERFORMANCE THAT COUNTS! ... M1 seems to have countless testimonials and proof of this!

_________________________
'06 Hyundai Sante Fe - 330K KM's
Current Oil: RLI 0w30 (Ask me why)

Don't be part of the Sheeple, check frequently for wool over your eyes. wink

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#1596707 - 09/11/09 02:28 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: StevieC]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 26224
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: StevieC
WHO CARES WHAT BASE STOCK AN OIL FORMULATOR USES, IT IS REAL WORLD PERFORMANCE THAT COUNTS!


Waiting for Art_Vandelay to jump on this one. LOL
_________________________
'02 530i (PU 5W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T
'13 F700 GS (BMW HP 15W-50)

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#1596709 - 09/11/09 02:29 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: StevieC]
tig1 Offline


Registered: 01/03/09
Posts: 9957
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: StevieC
I will repeat again as I have said in other threads... WHO CARES WHAT BASE STOCK AN OIL FORMULATOR USES, IT IS REAL WORLD PERFORMANCE THAT COUNTS! ... M1 seems to have countless testimonials and proof of this!



See my above testimonial above.
_________________________
2007 Ford Fusion 146,000 miles
M1 0-20
2007 Ford Focus 130,000 miles
M1 0-20
10,000 mile OCIs on both engines
M1 ATF
M1 10-30 in all OPE

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#1596713 - 09/11/09 02:31 PM Re: is Mobil 1 a group 4, true synthetic? [Re: elwaylite]
JohnBrowning Offline


Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 9448
Loc: USA
Hard to say unless we take up a collection like we did with German Castrol and have it tested and then have Terry and the other offical Tribologists and Chemist take a look at the results! Short of that we are all just guessing. For M1 being junk they sure do get a lot of OEM and Racing Endorsements! Funny how Honda could have chosen anyone for their Turbo oil requirement yet they ended up only recommending Mobil-1? Same thing for Corvette and many other high end engines!!! Notice I am not saying M-1 is as good today as it was in years past but I do not think it is junk though. In fact I think it is still better then it's competition on the shelf at major retail stores. It also seems to come out in pretty good shape when Amsoil does it's test's and put's the results up! In fact last I checked M-1 always comes out as being second only to Amsoil over all.

For the most part until you get into ester's PAO is only slightly cleaner then group II+ and group III base stock oils. You have to keep in mind that it was not that long ago that dino oils had no or very little G-II or G-II+ in them. So the diffrence between dino and a 100% PAO product was huge. Once G-II+ and G-III's came into the market the difference in cleanliness was very very close. The big thing was that synthetics had additive packages that could easily go 25K miles. M-1 was advertised at first as being a 25K mile oil back when it was only available in 5W20this is going back to my Dad's generation. Ester's on the other hand still have a huge huge gap in how much cleaner they can keep an engine and all of it's parts. As for the actual performance of the oil in normal driving a G-III can today perform just as well as an all PAO product if they have identical additive packages. The problem is that for the most part anyone going to use a G-III to meet a price point is not going to use more additives then the product needs because they are trying to keep cost down and profits high.

Now if you where to talk about hard core racing and simalar abuse say mining operations, jet aviation, space craft etc... then you would be able to see the difference in product base stocks and their additive packages very clearly. The old frying pan test works well still. If you did an all ester product like NEO then did a combo product like PP you would easily be able to see the difference in what is left inthe frying pan and how easy it is to remove which one had the better base stocks and additives.


As far as not hearing from EM on the higher Iron trend I do not see it as a big deal. We are talking a few digits increased nothing major. In fact I have not even seen this higher iron trend in my vehicles so I do not see the concern. I could see if we where talking about someones iron going from 7ppm to 100ppm or something major but in most case we are talking about a 10ppm change or less which is not a cause for alarm.

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