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#1529701 - 07/12/09 03:55 PM Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205
mrjoshm Offline


Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Pittsburgh
Here is my Blackstone Labs analysis. The oil was used for 3.5 months and 3770 miles. From 70K-108K miles I only used Mobil 1 5w-30 year round. I heard stories and decided to switch to Rotella T 5w-40 and this is the report from that oil. The oil filter is the new OEM Subaru blue style made by Honeywell in Canada. The air filter is OEM and was last changed around 80K. Driving consisted of about 50/50 highway and stop and go city driving. I took a 1000 mile roadtrip, but sat in traffic for about 2.5 hours so I figured it averaged out. The car has a turbo back 3" exhaust and the computer is tuned to Cobb Tuning's stage 2. I am concerned about the high lead content comments.

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'02 Subaru WRX Wagon, '92 VW Jetta

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#1529791 - 07/12/09 06:03 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: mrjoshm]
Boomer Offline


Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 741
Loc: Pennsylvania
Just a guess. Oil is too thick and you are starving the bearing so you see higher wear. Go back to M-1 5W-30 or 5W-30 EP.

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#1529800 - 07/12/09 06:19 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Boomer]
Solo2driver Offline


Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 1200
Loc: Houston, TX
I don't agree with Boomer. Subarus have always enjoyed a thick oil, unless something was wrong or a passage clogged, you would not see a starved bearing in the EJ20. Particle streak? Lab error? I would maybe ask for a re-test to confirm the numbers, everything else looks utterly fantastic, a great choice in oil for the WRX.
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2002 Subaru WRX: Ultra EURO 5w-40 140K mi
2000 Subaru Legacy AWD: Ultra Syn 10w-30 207K mi
2003 Ford Escape V6 4WD: MC Full Syn 5w-20 144K mi


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#1529953 - 07/12/09 09:01 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Solo2driver]
MtZion Offline


Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 24
Loc: Illinois
I am no where near an expert in this area, but (a question for our resident experts), would'nt the other wear metals be elevated as well if there was really a problem? If preignition was pounding away at your pistons, I would think we would see the other metals elevated as well. Also, have you tried data logging with your Cobb AccessPort to make sure you don't have any knock events? Cobb's OTS maps are pretty conservative though.
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2002 WRX stock (wife's car!)
2008 WRX w/Cobb DP, SPT CB and Stage 2 reflash

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#1529992 - 07/12/09 09:39 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: MtZion]
mrjoshm Offline


Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Pittsburgh
Thanks for the replys. I forgot to post that the oil sat in a plastic container for about a week while I waited for the sample container to come in. The Blackstone site said that it would not make a difference but I wanted to note it now. Also, I didn't think of it when I posted above, but I did have a couple of runs to about 6500 RPM (700 rpm short of redline) on oil interval but I have never seen the check engine light blink to indicate knock. I will datalog a run tommorrow night and then keep the RPM's low until I get my next UOA done in about 2K miles.
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'02 Subaru WRX Wagon, '92 VW Jetta

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#1530041 - 07/12/09 10:20 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Boomer]
Steve S Offline


Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 15742
Loc: Ka .li . for, nia
 Originally Posted By: Boomer
Just a guess. Oil is too thick and you are starving the bearing so you see higher wear. Go back to M-1 5W-30 or 5W-30 EP.
I do not think the lead is from the oil being too thick.
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#1530043 - 07/12/09 10:21 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Steve S]
Steve S Offline


Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 15742
Loc: Ka .li . for, nia
Is that the engine with the bearing problems ? I do not really keep up to date .
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#1530089 - 07/12/09 11:26 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Steve S]
Gary Allan Offline


Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 39170
Loc: Pottstown, PA
That's some nice Pb you have there. As was said, everything else looks great. Viscosity dropped about 3 Cst but the flash and the fuel % don't seem to match (that's how B-S calculates fuel, by FP).

Got me swinging on the reason for the Pb. I'd surely expect a more noisy UOA over all with that number. It's sitting so alone there it just doesn't seem right.
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#1530296 - 07/13/09 07:50 AM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Gary Allan]
Rob_Roy Offline


Registered: 10/26/08
Posts: 329
Loc: Northern, NY
Possible particle streak? I would run another OCI with the same oil and resample to see what the lead does.

Last year I got a UOA back on a large diesel with lead over 100 PPM, all other wear metals were close to single digits. We changed the oil and resampled after 100 hours, the lead had dropped to normal and hasn't increased since.
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#1530350 - 07/13/09 08:48 AM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Rob_Roy]
Eddie Offline


Registered: 12/07/03
Posts: 3587
Loc: Florida, Cape Coral
Do you have an early UOA from Blackstone when running Mobil 1 5w30?

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#1530405 - 07/13/09 09:31 AM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: Eddie]
mrjoshm Offline


Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Pittsburgh
This is the first UOA I have ever had done. I might still have some of the sample left over in the plastic container, I am pretty sure I clicked the lid down but I left the container outside for disposal. If the lid is secure then is the general consensus that I should send in another sample of the same oil or would it be safe to make a conclusion based on my next sample in 2K miles?
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'02 Subaru WRX Wagon, '92 VW Jetta

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#1530436 - 07/13/09 10:09 AM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: mrjoshm]
JoeFromPA Offline


Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 634
Loc: PA
It's either a big fluke or you'd got a bearing getting ready to bite it.

Since you've got no other signs of accelerated wear and since UOAs aren't good indicators of upcoming failures, my guess is it's a fluke. If you've drained and re-filled, resample in 2k miles like you plan on doing. If your lead is still elevated 10x normal, figure you've got some major engine work coming up (who knows when though).

Or call blackstone and ask if they can re-run the spectro analysis on the metals alone to confirm the high lead.

Joe
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06 Civic SI - PP 5w30 in there now for a 10k run.

08 5-speed Legacy GT - 3750 mile OCIs. Experimenting with M1 15w50, RTS 5w40, PP 5w30, and GC 0w30

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#1530524 - 07/13/09 11:20 AM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: JoeFromPA]
mrjoshm Offline


Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Pittsburgh
Well I plan on changing the oil again in 2K miles, so I'm just going to wait and see what that oil says. I called Blackstone and asked them if it was possible if that was a typo or error since no other wear metals were high and he said that it was not and that I should just wait to see on my next oil change so I guess that is the plan.
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'02 Subaru WRX Wagon, '92 VW Jetta

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#1530660 - 07/13/09 02:03 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: mrjoshm]
yannis Offline


Registered: 05/24/03
Posts: 702
Loc: Greece
I think the key elements are:

"From 70K-108K miles I only used Mobil 1 5w-30 year round."
Which is thin, especially when it is combined with "the computer is tuned to Cobb Tuning's stage 2."

and "The air filter is OEM and was last changed around 80K" , maybe a little overdue.

I am afraid you are experiencing a serious problem and you should contact Dyson Analysis.



Edited by yannis (07/13/09 02:07 PM)
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#1530681 - 07/13/09 02:31 PM Re: Rotella T 5w-40 3770mi '02 WRX EJ205 [Re: yannis]
mrjoshm Offline


Registered: 04/09/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Pittsburgh
Well my concern with using Mobil 1 should be clear since I switched to Rotella T. At 104K miles when I changed the timing belt the air filter looked perfectly clean. Subaru's recommended change interval is 30K miles, which I am right around and plan on doing. The car has been at Cobb's stage 2 from around 80K, when I last changed the filter, because it was recommended by Cobb that I stick with an OEM filter element. I also performed a compression check at 104K and each one came in between 150-155 psi, where Subaru's spec for new is 160 and the wear limit is something like 120. Since I have yet to hear any knock indicating that a bearing is going, I'm not going to jump the gun just yet but I think I will spend the extra money and send a sample to both Blackstone and Dyson Analysis to cover myself if this was a fluke.
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'02 Subaru WRX Wagon, '92 VW Jetta

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