Recent Topics
New computer to buy?
by Eddie
10/01/14 11:08 AM
Oxygen Sensor Brand Dilemma
by 01_celica_gt
10/01/14 11:07 AM
Correct OEM Honda Part Number
by lancerplayer
10/01/14 10:14 AM
Sulfur Smell. Cat Issue?
by Miller88
10/01/14 08:49 AM
Destination LE/2
by Char Baby
10/01/14 07:49 AM
Rockauto sent me the wrong part
by Klutch9
10/01/14 07:30 AM
Sibling rivalry
by supton
10/01/14 07:26 AM
Recalls - our reward card saved us ($10)
by Shannow
10/01/14 06:40 AM
Drawbacks of high detergent oil?
by Spetz
10/01/14 06:24 AM
10/1-11/16 5 qt's Napa Synthetic w/Silver OF$21.99
by tenderloin
10/01/14 02:45 AM
10/1-10/28 O'Reilly Sales Ad
by tenderloin
10/01/14 02:15 AM
Got the Hi-Power
by john_pifer
10/01/14 12:03 AM
Newest Members
PAssatGuy, mcn1970, KCChemist, bbuice, Hemingway
51460 Registered Users
Who's Online
89 registered (440Magnum, 01_celica_gt, 147_Grain, adolan21, 123Saab, 8 invisible), 1766 Guests and 157 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
51460 Members
64 Forums
220071 Topics
3475125 Posts

Max Online: 2862 @ 07/07/14 03:10 PM
Donate to BITOG

Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >
Topic Options
#1530138 - 07/13/09 12:33 AM Is their such thing as a bad oil???
FastSUV Offline


Registered: 01/18/09
Posts: 1081
Loc: oklahoma
I am thinking LUCAS or RP would be the most controverscial engine oils, but seriously if someone is using ANY dino that is rated for their car & changing at 5k or less, or ANY blend and changing at 7500k or less, or ANY full-syn and changing at 10k or less, then is their an brand or type of oil that we can say is more prone to cause more engine wear or sludge or problems of any kind; or just a "bad" choice?

If the answer is "no" then what are we all doing here LOL
_________________________
'01 Jeep GC 4.0L - 110k (current setup is 6k OCI w/ 10w30 Rotella T5)
'98 Jeep 5.9 Limited - 183k (current setup is 5k/or 1yr OCI w/ 10w30 Rotella T5)

Top
#1530145 - 07/13/09 12:45 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: FastSUV]
hpichris Offline


Registered: 06/13/09
Posts: 1654
Loc: Eden Prairie MN
No. There really isn't bad oil. There is wrong choice of oil due to weight or weather. We are here to discuss what the best oil is for what conditions, cars, driving habits etc. Not the other way round.
_________________________
Mazda RX-8 Shinka - Valvoline WB 5W-30
Nissan 350Z - Mobil 1 5W-30
VW Jetta - Shell Rotella T6 5W-40
BMW X3 - Mobil 1 0W-40

Top
#1530149 - 07/13/09 12:46 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: hpichris]
Quest Offline


Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 6369
Loc: beaver land EH?
Not on the motoring North American general public's retail shelves.

Q.

p.s. I've seen some pretty poor quality motor oils in places such as mainland China, Thailand, Malaysia, some mid-east countries, etc.
_________________________
"Internet discussion boards act as echo chambers for conspiracy dittoheads" A.Allen

Top
#1530155 - 07/13/09 12:52 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: Quest]
hpichris Offline


Registered: 06/13/09
Posts: 1654
Loc: Eden Prairie MN
Middle east and Malaysia? The lands that extracts these oil? Get out of here... :) j/k I believe you.
_________________________
Mazda RX-8 Shinka - Valvoline WB 5W-30
Nissan 350Z - Mobil 1 5W-30
VW Jetta - Shell Rotella T6 5W-40
BMW X3 - Mobil 1 0W-40

Top
#1530165 - 07/13/09 01:15 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: hpichris]
72customdeluxe Offline


Registered: 03/16/09
Posts: 131
Loc: texas
Royal Purple is controversial, but it cleaned my motor pretty well. I put it in along with a FRAM (I blame both on not knowing about this site yet) filter as soon as I got my truck. I cut open the filter at 1000 miles and it was filled with big chunks of junk. Of course I didn't know what oil was in there before and for how long... Still not worth 8-9$ a quart by far though
_________________________
'72 Cheyenne Super C10 stepside, 350/350 drivetrain, a/c,p/s,p/b, huggar orange

Top
#1530203 - 07/13/09 04:31 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: 72customdeluxe]
DeeAgeaux Offline


Registered: 05/29/09
Posts: 325
Loc: Los Angeles
How about the generic stuff at the dollar store or at 7-eleven?

The 7-Elevens in my are carry heavy PYB and either some generic stuff or 7-eleven branded oil.

When its 3 AM and your dipstick is dry.
_________________________
03 Honda Accord I-4 5AT
96k Miles
PP 5w-20 10k OCI

Top
#1530204 - 07/13/09 04:34 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: DeeAgeaux]
ZZman Offline


Registered: 03/17/08
Posts: 4229
Loc: Michigan
I would say "weak" oils......not bad per say.
_________________________
2002 Buick Regal GS (3.8 Supercharged) PP, Pure 1 filter
2008 Sebring Hardtop convertible (2.7) M1, Pure 1 filter.

Top
#1530266 - 07/13/09 07:10 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: ZZman]
tomcat27 Offline


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 2494
Loc: Midwest
now, there certainly are some bad engines!
In fact, Amsoil issues a TSB recommending short OCI's on certain "sludge" engines. on my DC 2.7 Amsoil recommends 3k miles! also on the dodge 3.9, 5.2, 5.9 and 5k on certain vw, toy, lexus, saab models

Top
#1530399 - 07/13/09 09:26 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: tomcat27]
FastSUV Offline


Registered: 01/18/09
Posts: 1081
Loc: oklahoma
 Originally Posted By: tomcat27
now, there certainly are some bad engines!
In fact, Amsoil issues a TSB recommending short OCI's on certain "sludge" engines. on my DC 2.7 Amsoil recommends 3k miles! also on the dodge 3.9, 5.2, 5.9 and 5k on certain vw, toy, lexus, saab models


Wow I did not know the "Magnum" engines were sludge prone...I knew all the newer 2.7, 3.7, & 4.7 were marked as sludge monsters, but I did not know the older push rod engines were? Are you sure?

If that is the case, then maybe I did good by doing 3k OCI on my 5.9 with M1 regardless of being told I was wasting my money.

I also was aware the Camry 4cyl in some years were marked. VERY interesting that Amsoil had the presence of mind to issue a TSB - good for them for being on top of things when so many others are not.
_________________________
'01 Jeep GC 4.0L - 110k (current setup is 6k OCI w/ 10w30 Rotella T5)
'98 Jeep 5.9 Limited - 183k (current setup is 5k/or 1yr OCI w/ 10w30 Rotella T5)

Top
#1530444 - 07/13/09 10:13 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: FastSUV]
ottotheclown Offline


Registered: 06/21/09
Posts: 2040
Loc: new york
great to hear amsoil notified user about sludge engines anddoing 3000 oci. now that is company on the ball.or should i say they are really thinking with their dipstick....

Top
#1530453 - 07/13/09 10:19 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: ottotheclown]
ekpolk Offline
The Regenerator


Registered: 04/05/04
Posts: 8881
Loc: Pensacola FL
That's a trickier question than it appears. The pivot point is what do we mean by "bad". May sound simple, but it's really not, at least in this context. Is "bad" a spec-oil that has a skimpy add pack? Is bad a true non-spec oil like an SA used in an SM car? I think we could probably all agree that would be bad...

My opinion is that for "normal" contemporary vehicles, if it meets the SM standard, it's serviceable (good or bad up to you...). If you have a car that needs a strong EP and/or AW additives (like everyone's favorite ZDDP), things get trickier. And so on.

Need a better definition of "bad".
_________________________
09 Camry Hybrid, Black (M1 5w-20, std flavor).
07 Avalon XLS, Cassis Pearl (GC 0w-30).
04 Prius, Black (GC -- 0w-30).

Top
#1530540 - 07/13/09 11:43 AM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: ekpolk]
FastSUV Offline


Registered: 01/18/09
Posts: 1081
Loc: oklahoma
 Originally Posted By: ekpolk
That's a trickier question than it appears. The pivot point is what do we mean by "bad". May sound simple, but it's really not, at least in this context. Is "bad" a spec-oil that has a skimpy add pack? Is bad a true non-spec oil like an SA used in an SM car? I think we could probably all agree that would be bad...

My opinion is that for "normal" contemporary vehicles, if it meets the SM standard, it's serviceable (good or bad up to you...). If you have a car that needs a strong EP and/or AW additives (like everyone's favorite ZDDP), things get trickier. And so on.

Need a better definition of "bad".


If you did an oil test and took say 10 different dino oils of the same weight and ran them in a chevy 350 changed every 3-5k for 250k miles for the same operating conditions and then disassymbled the motors and compared the wear, cleanliness, etc. Then would their be one oil that SUBSATNTIALLY stood out as the poorest performer with no debate about it. And then it could be said that all the other oils did a "good" job protecting the motor but OIL #10 is a "bad" oil and don't use that in your car.

does that help a little?


Edited by FastSUV (07/13/09 11:43 AM)
_________________________
'01 Jeep GC 4.0L - 110k (current setup is 6k OCI w/ 10w30 Rotella T5)
'98 Jeep 5.9 Limited - 183k (current setup is 5k/or 1yr OCI w/ 10w30 Rotella T5)

Top
#1530556 - 07/13/09 12:01 PM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: FastSUV]
ekpolk Offline
The Regenerator


Registered: 04/05/04
Posts: 8881
Loc: Pensacola FL
 Originally Posted By: FastSUV
 Originally Posted By: ekpolk
That's a trickier question than it appears. The pivot point is what do we mean by "bad". May sound simple, but it's really not, at least in this context. Is "bad" a spec-oil that has a skimpy add pack? Is bad a true non-spec oil like an SA used in an SM car? I think we could probably all agree that would be bad...

My opinion is that for "normal" contemporary vehicles, if it meets the SM standard, it's serviceable (good or bad up to you...). If you have a car that needs a strong EP and/or AW additives (like everyone's favorite ZDDP), things get trickier. And so on.

Need a better definition of "bad".


If you did an oil test and took say 10 different dino oils of the same weight and ran them in a chevy 350 changed every 3-5k for 250k miles for the same operating conditions and then disassymbled the motors and compared the wear, cleanliness, etc. Then would their be one oil that SUBSATNTIALLY stood out as the poorest performer with no debate about it. And then it could be said that all the other oils did a "good" job protecting the motor but OIL #10 is a "bad" oil and don't use that in your car.

does that help a little?


No, unfortunately not very much. The point I'm trying to make is that, while there certainly will be variation in performance between different oils, it's still very hard to isolate what such variation means. For example, if the test engine you choose to use is a flat tappet design, as it appears you've chosen, then among the many variables in oil performance, perhaps the characteristics of the EP and AW additives become the critical controlling factors. If you choose another engine for your test, say an early Toyota 1MZ V-6 that had the unfortunate habit of roasting its oil to death, but no EP issues in the valvetrain, then perhaps heat tolerance or oxidation performance becomes the critical variable that will define what's good and what's "bad".

I'm not simply "playing dumb" on this question. I'm just trying to point out that when you're looking at a product like motor oil, that may vary from a similar product in dozens of different ways, using overbroad labels like "good" and "bad" doesn't help much, unless we do more to define what we mean by good or bad, for a given situation.

Ironically, the standards (SAE, ILSAC, etc), which have been so helpful and positive overall, may actually help to mask and obscure real differences between lube products. For most apps, you can safely grab whatever oil carries the right approvals. Hey, if it says SM, and your car calls for it, you're very probably totally safe grabbing any SM that suits you. But if you want to parse it out more, you'll have to dig deeper to find the individual data points about the oil that you find important for your application.
_________________________
09 Camry Hybrid, Black (M1 5w-20, std flavor).
07 Avalon XLS, Cassis Pearl (GC 0w-30).
04 Prius, Black (GC -- 0w-30).

Top
#1530559 - 07/13/09 12:06 PM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: ekpolk]
Gary Allan Offline


Registered: 09/28/02
Posts: 39806
Loc: Pottstown, PA
 Quote:
Ironically, the standards (SAE, ILSAC, etc), which have been so helpful and positive overall, may actually help to mask and obscure real differences between lube products


Yes. Many tests are PASS:FAIL ..and some oils PASS better than others.

Use their oil and the rewards would be ....

How much?

..Well, more than you can imagine.

I don't know, kid. I can imagine quite a bit.
_________________________
http://lube-direct.com/gallan/

Top
#1530594 - 07/13/09 12:47 PM Re: Is their such thing as a bad oil??? [Re: Gary Allan]
StevieC Offline


Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 14339
Loc: Niagara Falls, ON, CA (near)
I would say there is no Bad oil provided it is the correct weight, meets your engine specification and is changed at the OEM's recommended OCI or something other OCI that is reasonable for the oils composition and your driving conditions.

With that being said. Even Synlube is a good oil, I just think their "Life-Time" fill is a bit of nonsense but they do claim that they have proof running it in a Kia engine for something like 200K miles with only top-off's.
_________________________
'06 Hyundai Sante Fe - 330K KM's
Current Oil: RLI 0w30 (Ask me why)

Don't be part of the Sheeple, check frequently for wool over your eyes. wink

Top
Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >