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#1491331 - 06/08/09 06:56 AM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: stang5]
bubbatime Offline


Registered: 03/18/08
Posts: 1194
Loc: South Florida
2005 Accord 4 cyl with 140,000 miles. No problems whatsoever besides new tires, brakes, oil changes, and a set of spark plugs, all of which would be considered normal maintenance items. Fantastic car.


Edited by bubbatime (06/08/09 06:57 AM)
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#1491361 - 06/08/09 07:55 AM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Cardinal49]
millerbl00 Offline


Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 629
Loc: Louisiana
Yes I am. It was a long nightmare!

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#1491524 - 06/08/09 11:10 AM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: tonycarguy]
opus1 Offline


Registered: 12/13/04
Posts: 1974
Loc: Chicago Area
 Originally Posted By: tonycarguy
 Originally Posted By: BrianWC

I still don't see what the deal is, though, with saying they are overpriced and low quality. Sure, the Malibu is a nice car, but even Lutz admitted that was the best GM could do, engineering and fit and finish-wise and frankly, I don't see how it stands out vs. the competition.


GM overpriced the Malibu. An Accord LX auto goes for $19k and a similar Malibu goes for $20.7k. WTH is GM doing? They need to undercut Honda by AT LEAST $1k to get people to buy it




Don't forget that GM rebates the heck out of cars. Right now, they're offering $2000 off ($1000 rebate and $1000 owner appreciation cash) or 0% for 60 months. Plus the dealers will deal more, and if you get someone like me with the original GM card and a $3500 balance built up, I reckon I could get that overpriced Malibu for less than $15K without dealing too hard.

Even if the Malibu winds up having more problems over its life than the Honda, end result out of pocket, I think the total cost would be the same. At least that's my estimate with my current Malibu.

Oh, and I'm wondering how realistic that $19k Accord is? Not busting your chops, I'm just looking at the dealers in my area; I don't think I've seen an Accord with a MSRP of less than $23K on the lot, and they all then have their "mandatory" dealer add-ons that add $$$ to the sticker.
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#1492812 - 06/09/09 12:28 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: opus1]
Cardinal49 Offline


Registered: 06/04/09
Posts: 135
Loc: NJ

 Originally Posted By: opus1
 Originally Posted By: tonycarguy
 Originally Posted By: BrianWC

I still don't see what the deal is, though, with saying they are overpriced and low quality. Sure, the Malibu is a nice car, but even Lutz admitted that was the best GM could do, engineering and fit and finish-wise and frankly, I don't see how it stands out vs. the competition.


GM overpriced the Malibu. An Accord LX auto goes for $19k and a similar Malibu goes for $20.7k. WTH is GM doing? They need to undercut Honda by AT LEAST $1k to get people to buy it




Don't forget that GM rebates the heck out of cars. Right now, they're offering $2000 off ($1000 rebate and $1000 owner appreciation cash) or 0% for 60 months. Plus the dealers will deal more, and if you get someone like me with the original GM card and a $3500 balance built up, I reckon I could get that overpriced Malibu for less than $15K without dealing too hard.

Even if the Malibu winds up having more problems over its life than the Honda, end result out of pocket, I think the total cost would be the same. At least that's my estimate with my current Malibu.

Oh, and I'm wondering how realistic that $19k Accord is? Not busting your chops, I'm just looking at the dealers in my area; I don't think I've seen an Accord with a MSRP of less than $23K on the lot, and they all then have their "mandatory" dealer add-ons that add $$$ to the sticker.


There can be good deals on GMs, Chryslers and Fords. It does seem that they list a higher price with rebates that end up making them competitive. I have seem amazing deals when they are trying to close out old stock/models. An even better deal is buying a 2-3 yr old car from GM or Ford.

3 of my 4 Hondas I got for below invoice. You should be able to get most Accords and Civics for invoice or below. Their model line up makes this possible (some people do not like this). When I bought my Accord I told the dealer the car I wanted and the price I wanted to pay ($500 under invoice). His intial response was something like "these are popular cars and in high demand blah blah blah". I handed him his dealer printout that stated there were over 60 Accord LX models in stock (you can pull this off most dealer's websites). He asked what color I wanted and offered it to me for $300 under invoice. The process took less then 5 minutes. You can get an Accord LX 4 cyl for about $19k or less. The EX models and V6 models will go up from there.

Popular models with limited supply can be difficult to get for invoice or below. When I was looking for my Odyssey there was a 2-3 month wait. Honda could not keep up with demand. One dealer by me was adding a $2500 charge on top of MSRP. I have heard similar stories when the new CRV and Fit came out.

With any purchase, you need to do your homework and know what you should pay. There are good and bad salespeople/dealers with all brands. In my experience, Honda is no better or worse then others.

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#1493016 - 06/09/09 03:08 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Cardinal49]
MrCritical Offline


Registered: 08/04/07
Posts: 2340
Loc: La.
Under invoice or under MSRP?

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#1493102 - 06/09/09 04:07 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: MrCritical]
Cardinal49 Offline


Registered: 06/04/09
Posts: 135
Loc: NJ
 Originally Posted By: MrCritical
Under invoice or under MSRP?


You can get most Accords and Civics for invoice or below, far below MSRP. I bought my Accord LX for $300 below INVOICE. The invoice including destination charges was close to $19K with an MSRP of over $20K. It was not a problem car. We settled on the price before I picked the car off the lot.

I once read (can not verify) that Honda allocates it's higher margin vehicles (Pilots, Odysseys, etc) based on volume of Accords and Civics sold. Many dealers are willing to move units of Accords and Civic (especially the generic ones)at little to no profit to get more of the other models.

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#1493262 - 06/09/09 06:58 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Cardinal49]
Audi Junkie Offline


Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 11247
Loc: PA
I paid $20,800 for my 07 Accord, stickered at $24,600
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#1493318 - 06/09/09 07:49 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Audi Junkie]
Quest Offline


Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 6344
Loc: beaver land EH?
dad's 7th gen civic was bought new, and has over 130,000kms to clock. Both rear struts (dran KayWhyBees proportedly US made) were shot, and replaced by Japanese made Tokico blues and still hold their pressure after 6 yrs of running. Now it's time to replace the front KayWhyBees (again, proportedly made in US of A), and I'm not that impressed with NA'sourced parts (rather pay a bit more for Japanese built/made Hondas and Toyotas).

My 07 fit (bought 06) has been trouble free for all these years, but then again: I paid a premium for it just because it's built in Suzuka, Jpn. All components that came within are still Japanese sourced, and reliability should be good.

As much as some posters would want to pursuade me into believing, I'm not a big believer in any NA'sourced auto parts quality (they are still considered sub-par), citing my dad's 7th gen civic and also my wifey's 04 camry.

Q.
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#1493366 - 06/09/09 08:43 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Quest]
sciphi Offline


Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 8425
Loc: Upstate NY
Got the fiancee's 09 Fit Sport auto for a couple hundred below MSRP after taxes. We didn't get fleeced, but we didn't get a screaming deal either. It was a "used" car, apparently a demo-day car for the corporate types. No dealer [censored] on it.

She already refuses to go back to the dealer we bought the car at. Not a good experience with buying it. They had price and not much else. The markups on the extended warranty we didn't get were ridiculous.

The Fits in particular are one of the only cars to increase sales over last year. Dealers aren't willing to part with them for any real deals.

It's 100% Japan-sourced, and it shows. It doesn't ride like an American car, or even a 7th gen Civic. Fit/finish is a bit better on the Fit than my friend's 06 Civic.
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#1493478 - 06/09/09 10:30 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Quest]
brianl703 Offline


Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 10487
Loc: Manassas, VA
 Originally Posted By: Quest
I'm not a big believer in any NA'sourced auto parts quality


I'm not a big believer in any NA'sourced-made-by-Japanese-firm auto parts quality, the biggest example being the Yazaki wiring harnesses that Ford put in the Contour that start disintegrating after a few years.

Find me a Delphi harness that did the same thing. I don't care where it was made. I bet you can't.

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#1493575 - 06/10/09 01:04 AM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: brianl703]
Audi Junkie Offline


Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 11247
Loc: PA
The build quality of my 2006 Acura RSX was HORRIBLE. Made in Japan. My Accord from Ohio has been 100% better.
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2008 Opel Astra 1.8 VVT 5M
2010 VW Tiguan 2.0 TSI 6M
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#1494016 - 06/10/09 12:32 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: BrianWC]
Win Offline


Registered: 02/05/03
Posts: 3313
Loc: Arkansas
 Originally Posted By: BrianWC
Sciphi, the Fit mpg gauge is typically 4.5 mpg high. This is common to many trip computers.


They've been very accurate on my last four Jaguars and last two Holdens.

Maybe Honda needs a little more legal action to get their odometers right.
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#1494214 - 06/10/09 03:18 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: Win]
sciphi Offline


Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 8425
Loc: Upstate NY
The odometer on the Fit is accurate. It's the MPG gauge that's wildly optimistic.

Already heard the babble they're spouting at the dealers about why it's off. No good reason for it to be off either.

There are $50 DIY MPG gauges out there far more accurate than the Fit MPG gauge. And that's a product of some guy cobbling bits together in his spare time. Honda can and should do better.
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2009 Honda Fit Sport
2012 Chevrolet Cruze Eco

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#1494263 - 06/10/09 04:07 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: sciphi]
BrianWC Offline


Registered: 02/09/06
Posts: 6873
Loc: Louisiana
Yes, the odo is accurate, although I DID here there was a class action on some 06 and earlier models that resulted in honda extending everyone's warrenty by 1800 miles.

On the Fit Forum, the inaccurate mpg gauge seems to be everyone's BIG concern with the car. I don't really mind b/c the error seems to be consistant, as it was on my two SAABs. My Scangauge is also a tad off but also consistant. Would I love it to be spot on? Sure! MPG is a big reason people buy these cars. Is it a reason to keep someone from buying a Fit, though?
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2002 Honda CR-V EX AWD
2009 Honda Odyssey EX-L
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#1494344 - 06/10/09 05:35 PM Re: Anyone else dissapointed by Honda cars? [Re: BrianWC]
sciphi Offline


Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 8425
Loc: Upstate NY
It's not. The rest of the car is fantastic.

At least it's good for real-time feedback. That's more important than the number figure.

Just irks me that there's this bug that likely could be easily fixed but they choose not to.
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2009 Honda Fit Sport
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