Recent Topics
Alignment done today.... Need help understanding
by mcrn
07/24/14 05:58 PM
Happy Birthday, Pablo!!
by Turk
07/24/14 05:47 PM
PAG oil: Available yet? Next Big Thing
by ElastoHydro
07/24/14 05:31 PM
2010 Silverado 5.3 16,412 Miles AMSOIL Sig Series
by Flareside302
07/24/14 05:27 PM
Best oil to quiet down kia 3.5L v6 at startup
by Alltherage
07/24/14 04:42 PM
a/c question
by OneEyeJack
07/24/14 04:19 PM
Mobil 1 Racing 4t or Valvoline 10w40 Motorcycle oi
by dslofti
07/24/14 04:15 PM
Biology and Chemistry II - Biological Polymers
by MolaKule
07/24/14 03:18 PM
got another one
by SteveSRT8
07/24/14 03:08 PM
following the users manual
by barkingspider
07/24/14 02:38 PM
Just got the General Altimax RT43s installed
by mcrn
07/24/14 02:14 PM
GM issues 6 new recalls.
by dave1251
07/24/14 01:08 PM
Newest Members
chancelee, XJSteve, joehupp, BwanaBob, gt40p
50744 Registered Users
Who's Online
118 registered (05LGTLtd, 2009Edge, 97tbird, 13Tacoma, 57ChevyLS, 9 invisible), 2010 Guests and 248 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
50744 Members
64 Forums
216737 Topics
3411392 Posts

Max Online: 2862 @ 07/07/14 03:10 PM
Donate to BITOG

Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 >
Topic Options
#1466548 - 05/16/09 12:39 PM -54C Pour Point and high PAO content
Art_Vandelay Offline


Registered: 11/30/08
Posts: 1339
Loc: USA
Is a pour point of -54C a fingerprint for high PAO content?

Please post links or reprints of MSD-sheets from the past if anyone has access to them. I want to see how many older/ current synthetics had -54C as a pour point. Then I'd just like to have a civilized discussion about it. That's all.

I know GC is still at -54C and everyone claims it is a high PAO based oil. I believe a lot of the older Mobil 1 oils were also -54C but I can't find any MSDS from the past.

Let me clarify:

- I mean exactly -54C. Not -53, -65, -48 etc.
- "lower" being a larger negative number so that -75C is lower than -54C. Higher obviously the opposite.

- Not interested at all in how pour point depressants can lower pour points beyond -54C. That is another conversation.




Edited by Art_Vandelay (05/16/09 12:39 PM)
_________________________
It all started when I decided to get my oil analyzed instead of my head examined...

Top
#1466556 - 05/16/09 12:44 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: Art_Vandelay]
chevrofreak Offline


Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 4899
Loc: Billings, MT
_________________________
I <3 Red Line oil

Top
#1466560 - 05/16/09 12:47 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: chevrofreak]
chevrofreak Offline


Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 4899
Loc: Billings, MT
_________________________
I <3 Red Line oil

Top
#1466568 - 05/16/09 12:54 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: chevrofreak]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10439
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
 Originally Posted By: chevrofreak

yup that why i had no issues running it through my MI winter this year.
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

Top
#1466572 - 05/16/09 12:56 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: daman]
StevieC Offline


Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 14339
Loc: Niagara Falls, ON, CA (near)
Speaking from experience... I ran Mobil from when my SUV was new until about 80K KM in the frigid winters up here and I never had lifter ticking or any cold-start problems that I have had with other synthetics. I know my engine is picky, but that should speak well for this oil.

It's excellent for cold weather application IMO, and has to have a good amount of PAO to achieve this I would think!
_________________________
'06 Hyundai Sante Fe - 330K KM's
Current Oil: RLI 0w30 (Ask me why)

Don't be part of the Sheeple, check frequently for wool over your eyes. wink

Top
#1466573 - 05/16/09 12:59 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: StevieC]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10439
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
^^ your area would be a good test too one would think.
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

Top
#1466582 - 05/16/09 01:07 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: daman]
StevieC Offline


Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 14339
Loc: Niagara Falls, ON, CA (near)
The Yukon... The company I work for has restaurants up in the Yukon and it gets very cold for extended periods like -50oC
_________________________
'06 Hyundai Sante Fe - 330K KM's
Current Oil: RLI 0w30 (Ask me why)

Don't be part of the Sheeple, check frequently for wool over your eyes. wink

Top
#1466594 - 05/16/09 01:14 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: StevieC]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10439
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
i was a little nervous at first when the cold set in but oil pressure was always right there and not much ticking at start up,very very little then gone.
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

Top
#1466611 - 05/16/09 01:34 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: Art_Vandelay]
Iain Offline


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 645
Loc: US/UK
 Originally Posted By: Art_Vandelay
Is a pour point of -54C a fingerprint for high PAO content?

Please post links or reprints of MSD-sheets from the past if anyone has access to them. I want to see how many older/ current synthetics had -54C as a pour point. Then I'd just like to have a civilized discussion about it. That's all.

I know GC is still at -54C and everyone claims it is a high PAO based oil. I believe a lot of the older Mobil 1 oils were also -54C but I can't find any MSDS from the past.

Let me clarify:

- I mean exactly -54C. Not -53, -65, -48 etc.
- "lower" being a larger negative number so that -75C is lower than -54C. Higher obviously the opposite.

- Not interested at all in how pour point depressants can lower pour points beyond -54C. That is another conversation.



I've been running current fill viscosity since 2006. PDS from that time indicate -54C pour point. Current PDS doesn't list that parameter but AFAICT, formulation hasn't changed; only packaging and marketing strategy has changed for that product.

Exxon-Mobil Corporation wrote in 2006:
 Quote:
Mobil 1 0W-30 Search Find an MSDS


Mobil 1 0W-30 Pdf

Advanced high performance synthetic engine oil Print View



Product DescriptionFeatures and BenefitsApplicationsSpecifications and
ApprovalsTypical PropertiesHealth and Safety

Product Description

Mobil 1 0W-30 is an advanced high performance synthetic engine oil
designed to provide outstanding wear protection and enhanced fuel
economy performance. Mobil 1 0W-30 exceeds the requirements of the
latest industry standards required by newer modern gasoline and
certain diesel powered automobile engines. Mobil 1 technology is
race proven and is the choice of race car drivers around the world.
Mobil 1 0W-30 is perfect for all types of driving anywhere in the
world and has the performance to protect where conventional engine
oils do not.


Features and Benefits

Mobil 1 0W-30 is made with a proprietary blend of ultra high
performance synthetic basestocks fortified with Supersyn Antiwear
Technology, the most advanced additive system available today. Mobil
1 0W-30, enhanced fuel economy formula, is uniquely designed to
provide unsurpassed levels of protection, especially at start-up in
the coldest environments for reduced engine wear. The oil meets all
of the industry standards for fuel economy, helping to save fuel and
reducing CO2 exhaust emissions. Key features and benefits include:



Features
Advantages and Potential Benefits
Active cleaning agents Prevents deposits and sludge build-up
to enable long and clean engine life
Outstanding thermal and oxidation stability Reduces oil ageing
allowing extended drain interval protection
Enhanced frictional properties Greater fuel economy
Excellent low temperature capabilities Quick cold weather
starting and fast protection
Extended engine and electrical system life
High Viscosity Index and Supersyn Antiwear Technology
Excellent overall lubrication and wear protection performance
for all driving styles and conditions

Applications

Mobil 1 0W-30 is recommended for all types of modern vehicles,
including high-performance turbo-charged, supercharged gasoline and
diesel multi-valve fuel injected engines found in passenger cars,
SUVs, light vans and trucks.
Mobil 1 0W-30 is especially suitable for extreme conditions, where
conventional oil often cannot perform.
Mobil 1 is not recommended for 2-Cycle or aviation engines, unless
specifically approved by the manufacturer.


Back to Top

Specifications and Approvals

Mobil 1 0W-30 meets or exceeds the following industry
specifications

ACEAA1,B1
APISM,SL,SJ,EC,CF
ILSACGF4
Ford WWSM2C929-A
General MotorsGM 4718M,GM6094M
ChryslerMS 6395


Typical Properties

Mobil 1 0W-30

SAE Grade0W-30
Viscosity, ASTM D 445
cSt @ 40C 63.1
cSt @ 100C 11.0
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 169
Sulfated Ash, wt%, ASTM D 874 10
HTHS Viscosity, mPas @ 150C ASTM D 4683 2.99
Pour Point, C, ASTM D 97 -54
Flash Point, C, ASTM D 92 228
Density @15 C kg/l, ASTM D 4052 0.845




Back to Top

Health and Safety

Based on available information, this product is not expected to
produce adverse effects on health when used for the intended
application and the recommendations provided in the Material Safety
Data Sheet (MSDS) are followed. MSDS's are available upon request
through your sales contract office, or via the Internet. This
product should not be used for purposes other than its intended use.
If disposing of used product, take care to protect the environment.
The Mobil logotype, the Pegasus design and Mobil 1 with Supersyn are
trademarks of Exxon Mobil Corporation, or one of its subsidiaries.





Exxon Mobil Corporation
3225 Gallows Road
Fairfax, VA 22037
1-800-Mobil25 (662-4525)

Due to continual product research and development, the information
contained herein is subject to change without notification.
Typical Properties may vary slightly. This product data sheet is based on
global product data sheets for use with products purchased in the U.S.
2001 Exxon Mobil Corporation. All rights reserved.

ExxonMobil Home | Help | Sitemap | Contact Us |
Privacy & Legal


Edited by Iain (05/16/09 01:42 PM)
Edit Reason: Added second quote box
_________________________
Running: Mobil 1 0W-30 SN oil-EaO11 filter and Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF

Top
#1466614 - 05/16/09 01:37 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: Iain]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10439
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
 Originally Posted By: Iain
I've been running current fill viscosity since 2006.

how's your 030 been doing? i have very little usage and great resualts from using it a year now.
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

Top
#1466615 - 05/16/09 01:38 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: daman]
tuckman Offline


Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Elk Point, Alberta
49 North CJ-4 5W-40 has the -54C you wanted
http://www.49northlubricants.com/product...205w-40_oil.pdf

http://www.49northlubricants.com/product%20info%20sheets/engine%20oils/21671_msds.pdf

Their 0W's have much lower pour points. When I posted the sheet for 0W-30 and then asked if it could be PAO I was told "NO, lucky to be grp IV" by a member here!



Edited by tuckman (05/16/09 01:39 PM)
_________________________
05 Ford Excursion 6.0L, PSD Esso XD3 0w-30
92 Ford Exploder 4x4 4.0L, Esso XD3 0w-40
86 Toyota Truck 2wd 22RE(2.4L), Esso XD3 0W-40

Top
#1466625 - 05/16/09 01:50 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: daman]
Iain Offline


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 645
Loc: US/UK
 Originally Posted By: daman
 Originally Posted By: Iain
I've been running current fill viscosity since 2006.

how's your 030 been doing? i have very little usage and great resualts from using it a year now.


It's doing great. I will not use any other oil in this car as it's HT/HS rating is slightly higher that that of Mobil 1 5W-20 but not as high as their 5W-30.

I was always nervous about that rating in 5W-20; 5W-30 was too thick as engine is rated for 5W-20 (2001 Ford 3.0L DOHC V-6).

Great oil. \:\!
_________________________
Running: Mobil 1 0W-30 SN oil-EaO11 filter and Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF

Top
#1466628 - 05/16/09 01:53 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: Iain]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10439
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
 Originally Posted By: Iain
 Originally Posted By: daman
 Originally Posted By: Iain
I've been running current fill viscosity since 2006.

how's your 030 been doing? i have very little usage and great resualts from using it a year now.


It's doing great. I will not use any other oil in this car as it's HT/HS rating is slightly higher that that of Mobil 1 5W-20 but not as high as their 5W-30.

Great oil. \:\!

I hear that.
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

Top
#1466641 - 05/16/09 02:03 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: daman]
ericthepig Offline


Registered: 12/26/06
Posts: 1648
Loc: Little Rock, AR
 Originally Posted By: daman
 Originally Posted By: chevrofreak

yup that why i had no issues running it through my MI winter this year.


I'm a fan of M1 HM 10w30 - but not in the winter months. Put a qt in your freezer over nite - it'll flow like honey (~ -10degF) - couldn't make it splash around in the qt bottle. I've also put M1 0w20 and PP 5w20 in the freezer over nite - stuff practically sounds like ice tea splashing in that qt.
_________________________
'06 Mazda 6 (97k) - Pennz YB 5w20 for summer (1 filter/yr)
'98 Sienna - (87k) - Pennz YB 5w30 1 yr OCI (but only ~5k miles)

Top
#1466650 - 05/16/09 02:10 PM Re: -54C Pour Point and high PAO content [Re: ericthepig]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10439
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
 Originally Posted By: ericthepig
 Originally Posted By: daman
 Originally Posted By: chevrofreak

yup that why i had no issues running it through my MI winter this year.


I'm a fan of M1 HM 10w30 - but not in the winter months. Put a qt in your freezer over nite - it'll flow like honey (~ -10degF) - couldn't make it splash around in the qt bottle. I've also put M1 0w20 and PP 5w20 in the freezer over nite - stuff practically sounds like ice tea splashing in that qt.

Yea like i said was a little nervous at first,i had no problems
with it but i do think this winter 0w30 will be in the pan.
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

Top
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 >