GM Fell Behind Toyota in 2008

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General Motors Corp.’s 77-year run as the world’s largest-selling automaker has come to an end, beaten by Toyota Motor Corp.

The Detroit automaker announced today that it sold 8.35 million cars and trucks across the globe in 2008 – a 10.8% decline compared with 2007.

Toyota sold 622,000 more cars and trucks throughout the world. The Japanese automaker announced Tuesday that its global sales number was 8.972 million in 2008 – a 4% decline compared with a year earlier.


Read more at the Detroit Free Press
 
I don't know about setting woods on fire. But it appears more Toyotas sell on the merits of the car compared to GM. The economy is the same for both GM and Toyota. They were within 7000 cars of each other in 2007.

In 2008, both carmakers experienced lower sales. GM sales worldwide dropped 10.8% while Toyota only dropped 4%, making a 622K car advantage to Toyota.

That indicates to me that available financing is more critical to GM than it is for Toyota. I.E. many times GM buyers are not buying the car, but buying the financing. Once that financing became scarce, that was no longer a selling point for potential customers.
 
Take the fleet sales away and the true picture for GM is much worse than it appears- individual owners spending their own money arnt spending it on GM products.
 
So when someone now says big three, does that cover Toyota, GM, and Ford? Or is Big 3 just US cars?
 
Originally Posted By: javacontour
I don't know about setting woods on fire. But it appears more Toyotas sell on the merits of the car compared to GM.


That is due more to "perceived" quality rather than a quantifiable superiority in product.

The truth is, 2007 and newer GM models are just as good as (if not better than) comparable Toyota models. The 2008 Malibu is a better car than the 2007 Camry for example, a similar case could be made for the Silverado and Tundra and Acadia/Outlook/Enclave/Traverse and the Highlander.
 
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: javacontour
I don't know about setting woods on fire. But it appears more Toyotas sell on the merits of the car compared to GM.


That is due more to "perceived" quality rather than a quantifiable superiority in product.

The truth is, 2007 and newer GM models are just as good as (if not better than) comparable Toyota models. The 2008 Malibu is a better car than the 2007 Camry for example, a similar case could be made for the Silverado and Tundra and Acadia/Outlook/Enclave/Traverse and the Highlander.




GM needs nore gullable consumers that believe that statement in order to survive.....most are wiser and have moved up to Toyota/Nissan/Honda{the big 3 for educated consumers}
 
Way too many loyal GM buyers have been BURNED too many times. How about simple safety related items like BRAKE LINES that used to last 20 years but now ROT THROUGH in 3 or 4 years?? GIVE us a break... GM deserves their fate, a once fine company ruined by bad management. There's plenty of good reasons why Toyota is #1 and they've earned it via hard work! My hard earned dollars are going to companies that deserve it.
 
Originally Posted By: qship1996
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: javacontour
I don't know about setting woods on fire. But it appears more Toyotas sell on the merits of the car compared to GM.


That is due more to "perceived" quality rather than a quantifiable superiority in product.

The truth is, 2007 and newer GM models are just as good as (if not better than) comparable Toyota models. The 2008 Malibu is a better car than the 2007 Camry for example, a similar case could be made for the Silverado and Tundra and Acadia/Outlook/Enclave/Traverse and the Highlander.

GM needs nore gullable consumers that believe that statement in order to survive.....most are wiser and have moved up to Toyota/Nissan/Honda{the big 3 for educated consumers}


Who's gullible, the guy that lives in the 80s and 90s or the guy that follows the industry and realizes the Japanese quality gap has been being steadily whittled down over the last decade?
 
Originally Posted By: H2GURU
Way too many loyal GM buyers have been BURNED too many times. How about simple safety related items like BRAKE LINES that used to last 20 years but now ROT THROUGH in 3 or 4 years?? GIVE us a break... GM deserves their fate, a once fine company ruined by bad management. There's plenty of good reasons why Toyota is #1 and they've earned it via hard work! My hard earned dollars are going to companies that deserve it.


You can lay simple safety related problems at Toyota's feet as well.

Ball joint related loss of steering control in Toyota trucks
Pruises that accelerate uncontrollably
Sienna door opening problems due to problem with welds
Breaking frames in trucks

The list goes on. You crank out MILLIONS of products per year as complicated as automobiles and you are going to have some issues eventually.
 
Originally Posted By: qship1996
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: javacontour
I don't know about setting woods on fire. But it appears more Toyotas sell on the merits of the car compared to GM.


That is due more to "perceived" quality rather than a quantifiable superiority in product.

The truth is, 2007 and newer GM models are just as good as (if not better than) comparable Toyota models. The 2008 Malibu is a better car than the 2007 Camry for example, a similar case could be made for the Silverado and Tundra and Acadia/Outlook/Enclave/Traverse and the Highlander.




GM needs nore gullable consumers that believe that statement in order to survive.....most are wiser and have moved up to Toyota/Nissan/Honda{the big 3 for educated consumers}


You tell 'em fanboy! No bias in your posts.........
 
LOL.gif
I'm far from a GM fanboy. I'm not even a GM fan really.

Ford fanboy maybe...
banana2.gif
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
LOL.gif
I'm far from a GM fanboy. I'm not even a GM fan really.

Ford fanboy maybe...
banana2.gif



I was quoting qship1996, not you bud, don't worry
grin2.gif
 
Ford is slightly better than GM, but still lagging behind the Japanese competition. Sad, but true.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
LOL.gif
I'm far from a GM fanboy. I'm not even a GM fan really.

Ford fanboy maybe...
banana2.gif



I was quoting qship1996, not you bud, don't worry
grin2.gif



Yea, I figured as much. I didn't see qship's post after mine until after I made the post, I missed the scroll bar.
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Originally Posted By: qship1996
Ford is slightly better than GM, but still lagging behind the Japanese competition. Sad, but true.


Nothing like a well reasoned and informed argument.
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Last edited:
Originally Posted By: qship1996
Ford is slightly better than GM, but still lagging behind the Japanese competition. Sad, but true.


True to you perhaps? Most sources cite Ford as "on par" with the Japanese. But I am in a unique position to comment on Ford product ownership spanning 8 decades. And it has been an excellent experience, which is why we continue to own them. Our experience with GM has been... not all that great. But I still don't want them to go out of business.
 
Ok-

#1 - Toyota beat GM in sales. Ok, but that is just one race. You will see GM win one year and Toyota the next. Just because Toyota wins this year doesn't mean anything except that they are GM's biggest competitor and that's good. Doesn't mean they are better or that GM is dead. 600k units is not much in the grand scheme of things.

#2 - As expected, this thread instantly became a Detroit bashing thread.
 
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