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#1207158 - 08/02/08 03:52 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: OVERKILL]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 29134
Loc: NJ
He is not bashing Amsoil. You sell Amsoil, so you actually are convincing yourself it's that when you ignored all the facts OVERK1LL just posted.

I don't know of any Honda that will cause any API SM rated oil to "cake up". If there was sludge/deposits in there, any good synthetic will clean them out in time that could have freed up a few mpg along with all the other changes he made.
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#1207160 - 08/02/08 04:03 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: buster]
Mamala Bay Offline


Registered: 02/21/04
Posts: 2002
Loc: USA
I had a 97 Ranger 3.0. Amsoil at 1K and Amsoil gear and trans at 30K. Estimated EPA MPG was 17/21. Started using the Amsoil(TSO) at 72K and with 85-90% highway mileages I was getting 26mpg.

That is the reason I went with the TSO as the fuel savings more than paid for the oil. I don't believe I could have gotten the same results with dino oil. The SSO oil is presently a better built oil than the TSO.

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#1207162 - 08/02/08 04:06 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: Mamala Bay]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 29134
Loc: NJ
Back to the issue though, harry the oil analysis clearly says you can go a lot further on the oil.
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#1207165 - 08/02/08 04:12 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: buster]
lazaro Offline


Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 747
Loc: miami fl
 Originally Posted By: buster
harry some oils take time to fully lay down their protective layer. If you are draining oils every 3k and switching brands all the time, that could be one possible reason. .

I agree with this first half
 Quote:
I've tried more oils than most people I know and I've never had any difference with engine noise using Mobil 1. However it is possible I guess that some oils will be more quiet than others but generally speaking it's psychological

I cant agree with this half...

 Originally Posted By: buster
He is not bashing Amsoil. You sell Amsoil, so you actually are convincing yourself it's that when you ignored all the facts OVERK1LL just posted.

If there was sludge/deposits in there, any good synthetic will clean them out in time that could have freed up a few mpg along with all the other changes he made.

 Quote:
I don't know of any Honda that will cause any API SM rated oil to "cake up".


your not buying the carbon on the bumper, is oil caking up huh?
Im not ignoring OVERKILLS facts I just dont see where I said Overkill was bashing Amsoil?

you know it just could be possible I have done more oil changes and seen more dirty engines than alot of people in here??
I just threw out over half of my 28 year cast iron collection in the past 4 years about 20 tons worth.
blocks, heads, cranks, etc, etc,


Edited by lazaro (08/02/08 04:17 PM)
Edit Reason: update
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1969Ranchero351
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#1207170 - 08/02/08 04:24 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: lazaro]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 29134
Loc: NJ
You also have to account for the other things he also changed, which I believe contributed more to the gain. You seem to attribute all of it to the SSO. Why didn't I see any mpg gain in my car?
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#1207172 - 08/02/08 04:28 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: lazaro]
OVERKILL Online   content


Registered: 04/28/08
Posts: 26092
Loc: Ontario, Canada
lazaro:

My belief that it's carbon from gas stems from the fact that the OP said he had fuel dilution in his oil (as shown in the UOA) and the car was running rough!

My Mustang used to blacken the rear valance above the tails if I drove it hard (which I did often). But it used ZERO oil. I imagine it will do the same thing in the Capri body. They run slightly rich at WOT as a safety measure to ward off detonation.

And this is not isolated. My Town Car, when the top-end was swapped, was blackening the rear bumper above the tails. It was rich. I could SMELL it!!! Converting it to mass air got rid of the problem!!!

The symptoms of a rich running engine can be/often are:
- fuel dilution in the oil
- poor fuel economy
- darkened tail pipe
- stains/discolouration on the body around the tailpipe
- rough idle
- noticeable fuel smell to the exhaust odour

He had a number of those symptoms!!! And his two most prominent symptoms (fuel in oil, rough idle) went away after he changed the FPR.

Do you not feel it's the least bit more sensible to attribute the gain in fuel economy (as I said, I'm not doubting the economy figures, simply the means of obtaining them) was due to the rectification of the obvious rich condition with the changing of the FPR, rather than a simple change in oil BRAND?

Stand back for a second and think about this. Think about where I'm coming from here. I harbour no hatred for the product, it's users or it's dealers. I USE the products in question!!

I simply do not agree with you or the OP's interpretation of this scenario.
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#1207188 - 08/02/08 04:58 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: OVERKILL]
lazaro Offline


Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 747
Loc: miami fl
 Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
lazaro:

My belief that it's carbon from gas stems from the fact that the OP said he had fuel dilution in his oil (as shown in the UOA) and the car was running rough!

My Mustang used to blacken the rear valance above the tails if I drove it hard (which I did often). But it used ZERO oil. I imagine it will do the same thing in the Capri body. They run slightly rich at WOT as a safety measure to ward off detonation.

And this is not isolated. My Town Car, when the top-end was swapped, was blackening the rear bumper above the tails. It was rich. I could SMELL it!!! Converting it to mass air got rid of the problem!!!

The symptoms of a rich running engine can be/often are:
- fuel dilution in the oil
- poor fuel economy
- darkened tail pipe
- stains/discolouration on the body around the tailpipe
- rough idle
- noticeable fuel smell to the exhaust odour

He had a number of those symptoms!!! And his two most prominent symptoms (fuel in oil, rough idle) went away after he changed the FPR.

Do you not feel it's the least bit more sensible to attribute the gain in fuel economy (as I said, I'm not doubting the economy figures, simply the means of obtaining them) was due to the rectification of the obvious rich condition with the changing of the FPR, rather than a simple change in oil BRAND?

Stand back for a second and think about this. Think about where I'm coming from here. I harbour no hatred for the product, it's users or it's dealers. I USE the products in question!!

I simply do not agree with you or the OP's interpretation of this scenario.


thanks for the reply, I will agree that much of what you say has merrit.
The variables are many, without tearing into the engine we shall never put our finger on the culprit.
I can see the rings getting carboned up and sticking and allowing fuel to enter the crankcase.
After all there is ring gaps in these engines that will let some fuel pass, but like I said earlier the varibles are multiple here.
bottom line the original poster is having good results period!
_________________________
2buyAmsoilSiteSponsors:Pablo&GaryAllan.
1969Ranchero351
1987F250/7.3
1967fairlaneRcode
1967mustangGT/Scode
1993#96BondurantSHO
all Amsoiled


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#1207193 - 08/02/08 05:02 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: buster]
lazaro Offline


Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 747
Loc: miami fl
 Originally Posted By: buster
You also have to account for the other things he also changed, which I believe contributed more to the gain. You seem to attribute all of it to the SSO. Why didn't I see any mpg gain in my car?

now Im having some fun here
 Quote:
harry some oils take time to fully lay down their protective layer. If you are draining oils every 3k and switching brands all the time, that could be one possible reason


may I ask since I cant remember, how long did you use the run of Amsoil? and is that your first run of it?
if yes, let me say stick with the program and you will see gains


Edited by lazaro (08/02/08 05:03 PM)
Edit Reason: remove double text
_________________________
2buyAmsoilSiteSponsors:Pablo&GaryAllan.
1969Ranchero351
1987F250/7.3
1967fairlaneRcode
1967mustangGT/Scode
1993#96BondurantSHO
all Amsoiled


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#1207206 - 08/02/08 05:22 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: lazaro]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 29134
Loc: NJ
I ran SSO 8,500 miles and so no improvement in mpg compared to M1 5w30 EP from a year ago. What I should have compared is M1 0w20 to Amsoil 0w20. Never got around to it.
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#1207219 - 08/02/08 05:46 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: buster]
lazaro Offline


Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 747
Loc: miami fl
 Originally Posted By: buster
I ran SSO 8,500 miles and so no improvement in mpg compared to M1 5w30 EP from a year ago. What I should have compared is M1 0w20 to Amsoil 0w20. Never got around to it.

so for 8500 miles you did get a uoa? was the oil still good? did you put the same type oil back in?
severe service for Amsoil is 15,000 miles not 8,500.
let me ask anyone this question, who knows more about the service life of a engine full of oil? the oil manufacture or the car manufacture?
I rather trust the oil manufacture my opinion here.
and if anything negative happens on your first run of Amsoil do you blame the oil or do you blame the trailing history of the vehicle??


Edited by lazaro (08/02/08 05:47 PM)
Edit Reason: added one word
_________________________
2buyAmsoilSiteSponsors:Pablo&GaryAllan.
1969Ranchero351
1987F250/7.3
1967fairlaneRcode
1967mustangGT/Scode
1993#96BondurantSHO
all Amsoiled


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#1207224 - 08/02/08 05:59 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: OVERKILL]
harry j Offline


Registered: 12/16/05
Posts: 1454
Loc: Wilmington, NC
 Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Harry:

Just going back here, but I see this:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
I'm thinking that I have a leaky fuel injector. I plan to have them all changed soon. The dealer wants $153 each for them, so I'm looking elsewhere for them.


Then:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
The engine runs great, idle is a little rough and then there's the gas in the oil, now at 244,000 miles, it is high time by all indications for new injectors.


Then:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
On a hunch, I replaced the fuel pressure regulator today. The engine idles much better now. I wonder if a bad FPR was causing the fuel in the SSO. I look forward to the next UOA to see for sure. It may not have been the fuel injectors after all.


Followed by:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
As a follow up, the latest UOA shows that the gas intrusion problem has been solved. TBN that had previously been negatively impacted by this issue, now remains at a high level. I recommend that anyone with a Civic that is experiencing gas in their oil, change out the fuel pressure regulator.



THIS would be a very logical explanation as to why you had carbon on your rear valance. And then why it went away. And it also follows my theory of a rich condition, which revealed itself to you in TWO very prominent ways here:

1. Carbon on the rear bumper from an overly-rich fuel mixture
2. Gasoline in your oil from an overly-rich fuel mixture

This would definitely affect your vehicle's fuel mileage.



I first started using the Amsoil 0W-30 when I had 118,000 miles on the car. Shortly after that is when the oil burn stopped. I now have over 251,000 miles and still no oil usage and no black smudge on the bumper.

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#1207227 - 08/02/08 06:05 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: lazaro]
FZ1 Offline


Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4192
Loc: Texas
Buster's opinion is good enough for me. Going from one syn to another syn should make little difference. Certainly, not a double digit % difference!!


Edited by FZ1 (08/02/08 06:06 PM)

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#1207228 - 08/02/08 06:06 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: harry j]
lazaro Offline


Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 747
Loc: miami fl
 Originally Posted By: harry j
 Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Harry:

Just going back here, but I see this:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
I'm thinking that I have a leaky fuel injector. I plan to have them all changed soon. The dealer wants $153 each for them, so I'm looking elsewhere for them.


Then:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
The engine runs great, idle is a little rough and then there's the gas in the oil, now at 244,000 miles, it is high time by all indications for new injectors.


Then:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
On a hunch, I replaced the fuel pressure regulator today. The engine idles much better now. I wonder if a bad FPR was causing the fuel in the SSO. I look forward to the next UOA to see for sure. It may not have been the fuel injectors after all.


Followed by:

 Originally Posted By: harry j
As a follow up, the latest UOA shows that the gas intrusion problem has been solved. TBN that had previously been negatively impacted by this issue, now remains at a high level. I recommend that anyone with a Civic that is experiencing gas in their oil, change out the fuel pressure regulator.



THIS would be a very logical explanation as to why you had carbon on your rear valance. And then why it went away. And it also follows my theory of a rich condition, which revealed itself to you in TWO very prominent ways here:

1. Carbon on the rear bumper from an overly-rich fuel mixture
2. Gasoline in your oil from an overly-rich fuel mixture

This would definitely affect your vehicle's fuel mileage.



I first started using the Amsoil 0W-30 when I had 118,000 miles on the car. Shortly after that is when the oil burn stopped. I now have over 251,000 miles and still no oil usage and no black smudge on the bumper.

stop saying that stuff! nobody will believe that.
well at least more people will disagree than agree.
you wont win the popular vote.
sounds like your completely brainwashed.
it happened to me too Im in recovery now
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2buyAmsoilSiteSponsors:Pablo&GaryAllan.
1969Ranchero351
1987F250/7.3
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1967mustangGT/Scode
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#1207245 - 08/02/08 06:32 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: lazaro]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 29134
Loc: NJ
lazaro, to this day I have never seen significant mpg differences among different oils of the same grade viscosity whether synthetic or conventional. I'm not saying this can't happen. I'm sure some oils have lower friction and better FM's. I have just not experienced any double digit mpg gain. I've driven over 300k miles in the last 7 years using all different brands of oil.

The issue was why someone would drain an oil at 3k miles that is as expensive and still showing a lot of life left? It then led to mpg claims that were probably due to both the oil and changes he made. I do not believe any oil can improve gas mileage more than 10%. Maybe I'm wrong?
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#1207252 - 08/02/08 06:48 PM Re: Amsoil SSO 0W-30, 1993 Civic, 3,007 miles [Re: buster]
lazaro Offline


Registered: 07/01/07
Posts: 747
Loc: miami fl
 Originally Posted By: buster
lazaro, to this day I have never seen significant mpg differences among different oils of the same grade viscosity whether synthetic or conventional. I'm not saying this can't happen. I'm sure some oils have lower friction and better FM's. I have just not experienced any double digit mpg gain. I've driven over 300k miles in the last 7 years using all different brands of oil.

The issue was why someone would drain an oil at 3k miles that is as expensive and still showing a lot of life left? It then led to mpg claims that were probably due to both the oil and changes he made. I do not believe any oil can improve gas mileage more than 10%. Maybe I'm wrong?

I have to agree with you that the original poster should of left the oil in the car for 6 months longer and 15,000 miles but it's his car, he will cry if he wants too it's his party...
anyway I didn't believe the wild claims years ago either but I followed directions and now I believe those claims are possible.
it's kinda like a crazy dog you have to get rid of cause he bites your drinking buddies====== or you get the dog whisper and he teaches the dog to drink with your buddies.
what is better off in the long run? dead dog or drunk dog?
all depends, so many varibles ...
_________________________
2buyAmsoilSiteSponsors:Pablo&GaryAllan.
1969Ranchero351
1987F250/7.3
1967fairlaneRcode
1967mustangGT/Scode
1993#96BondurantSHO
all Amsoiled


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