Recent Topics
Wix Beta Ratio
by Stelth
07/28/14 08:59 AM
New struts - Softer ride?
by Spetz
07/28/14 07:45 AM
Gordon's restart strategy - Brickyard 400
by ledslinger
07/28/14 07:35 AM
Amsoil 20W50 5,663 miles in BMW Motorcycle R1100S
by SouthernYankee
07/28/14 07:20 AM
phosphorus question
by dharry
07/28/14 05:48 AM
Replcaing just one injector?
by Spetz
07/28/14 04:01 AM
Craftsman Programmable Digital Tire Gauge $9.99
by Warstud
07/28/14 03:43 AM
Cutting open oil filter...?
by Wordfreak
07/28/14 01:44 AM
The BITOG LOL smiley is AWAL
by Merkava_4
07/28/14 01:43 AM
antifreeze leak on back corner of engine
by ram_man
07/28/14 12:03 AM
Man killed, daughter injured in plane crash...
by hatt
07/27/14 11:25 PM
Hyundai Elantra manual trans fluid change help
by dja4260
07/27/14 10:51 PM
Newest Members
Samial, TomHh, JPowell490, LubeMan52, Powermax
50782 Registered Users
Who's Online
95 registered (antonmnster, 147_Grain, 2010_FX4, 4wheeldog, 2sld3kf2bt, 123Saab, 5 invisible), 1810 Guests and 223 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
50782 Members
64 Forums
216938 Topics
3414946 Posts

Max Online: 2862 @ 07/07/14 03:10 PM
Donate to BITOG

Page 3 of 15 < 1 2 3 4 5 ... 14 15 >
Topic Options
#1198410 - 07/21/08 02:21 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
SpeedyMan Offline


Registered: 09/27/07
Posts: 51
Loc: Bulgaria
Could be that they rival the group 4/5 lubricants!
MOBIL1 is no longer 5W-40 but 0W-40, and there is MOBIL SYNT which is 5W-40. Same with Castrol Edge and other Castrol brands.

So there is a big jump in these technologies.
_________________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=xpmThYTn60o

Top
#1198418 - 07/21/08 05:16 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
LexusAussie Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 215
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
 Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hi,
LexusAussie - You said this:
"It's a good product but not a synthetic oil."

This is incorrect!

It was superceded by GTX Magnatec (with UMA) 10W-40 around 1998-9 and was also advertised as a "synthetically enhanced" lubricant. In their terminolgy it was stated to have a semi-synthetic base fluid


Doug,

First of all, apologies to the Forum for highjacking this thread.

GTX Magnatec did indeed come onto the market in 1988/99 as a 10W-40. I've used it in my vehicles from 1999 until 2007. It is a Semi-Synthetic (ie a Mineral Based oil blended with Synthetic Oils). It is NOT a full Synthetic Oil.

It's base specs are outlined in the TDS:

http://www.tds.castrol.com.au/pdf/5052_Castrol_Magnatec_10W40_119369_2006_10.pdf

They are not those of a Synthetic Oil and there is no claim from Castrol that Magnatec is a synthetic oil.

Wikipedia defines a Semi-Synthetic oil as "Semi-synthetic oils (also called 'synthetic blends') are blends of mineral oil with no more than 30% synthetic oil. ". Castrol Magnatec is a Semi-Synthetc Oil

The Castrol Magnatec Professional is a "Fully Synthetic" according to Castrol's Marketing Speak yet I have confirmed with Castrol's Tech Division that it is Group III oil.

Again, Wikepedia states "Group III base stocks are considered synthetic motor oil ONLY in the United States. Group III based lubricants are not allowed to be marketed as "synthetic" in any market outside of the USA."

I have the following response from Castrol's Technical Line in an email to me dated 16/1/2008 regarding Magnatec Professional:

" Hi David.
Thank you for your e-mail enquiry regarding Magnatec Professional 5W/40.

The base oil is Grp 111 (hydrocraked, high Viscosity Index).
Most oils whether mineral, semi or full synthetic would be compatible to mix.

If you have any further enquiries please contact the Technical Helpline on 1300 557 998, Mon - Fri, 8.30am - 5.00pm."

Regards,

Product Applications & Projects
Castrol Lubricants
ph: 1300 557 998
fax: 03 9268 4394"

Based on all the above:

1. Castrol Magnatec is NOT a Synthetic Oil exactly as I stated. It is a Semi-Synthetic at best;
2. Castrol Magnatec Professional is NOT a Synthetic Oil. It is a Group III Dino Oil

I am not in the habit of using products that I have not thoroughly researched

BTW. My name is Dave if you read my signature

Regards
_________________________
Dave "Dave's not here man"
2010 Lexus RX350 Sports Luxury, 2006 Lexus SC430
AMSoil Series 3000 HDEO 5W-30
BMW's are German Chevy's

Top
#1198420 - 07/21/08 05:23 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
LexusAussie Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 215
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
 Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
For us as users there is probably a much simpler explantion - Group 3 lubricants are the "semi" or "part" synthetics. Group 4, 5 and 6 are the "synthetics"


Group III are highly refined Dino Oils. The US legal definition only applies in the USA. Semi-Synthetics would have to be a Group II oil mixed with no more than 30% Group 4,5 or 6.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil#Synthetic_Base_Stocks

I have no issue with your comment that Group III lubricants now rival or exceed the performance of some older formulation Group 4/5 products and at a much better price too.
_________________________
Dave "Dave's not here man"
2010 Lexus RX350 Sports Luxury, 2006 Lexus SC430
AMSoil Series 3000 HDEO 5W-30
BMW's are German Chevy's

Top
#1198768 - 07/21/08 03:47 PM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: LexusAussie]
Doug Hillary Offline


Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 4816
Loc: Airlie Beach Australia
Hi,
Dave - you said this;
"BTW. My name is Dave if you read my signature"

A touch of rudeness perhaps?

As for your comments well MUST we assume that YOU are correct and that Castrol's advertising data produced in 1997-8 and onwards is WRONG then?

I will stay with Castrol's comments thanks - I have worked closely with their Chemists and Lube Engineers since 1980 but I suppose that matters little too!




Edited by Doug Hillary (07/21/08 03:47 PM)
_________________________
Regards
Doug

Top
#1198812 - 07/21/08 05:10 PM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
Johnny Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 14013
Loc: Retired | Wausau, WI
It matters to most of us Doug. \:\!

Top
#1198838 - 07/21/08 06:03 PM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: m6pwr]
MI_Roger Offline


Registered: 12/31/07
Posts: 249
Loc: Ypsilanti, MI
 Originally Posted By: m6pwr
FWIW, TOTAL/ELF has come out with a new oil, TOTAL Quartz Energy 9000 0w-30 that meets most all of the euro car mfrs standards and which is, according to their MSDS, a Group IV PAO base stock (and priced accordingly - - its expensive). As soon as I can get hold of a bottle I will do a VOA and post the results here on BITOG.


I have been using ELF/TOTAL branded oil in my two Saabs for about a year now. Previoulsy I used only Mobil-1. I switched to ELF/TOTAL because their grade of oil with the necessary GM-LL-025-A specification compliance for the newer car is actually less expensive than the appropriate Mobil-1 grade in my local area! Although only slightly. Check specialty shops in your area for this oil as you may be surprised by the price too

Top
#1199051 - 07/22/08 12:05 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: MI_Roger]
SpeedyMan Offline


Registered: 09/27/07
Posts: 51
Loc: Bulgaria
I will not put xW-30 oil in my car.
_________________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=xpmThYTn60o

Top
#1199081 - 07/22/08 03:34 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
LexusAussie Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 215
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
 Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hi,
Dave - you said this;
"BTW. My name is Dave if you read my signature"

A touch of rudeness perhaps?

As for your comments well MUST we assume that YOU are correct and that Castrol's advertising data produced in 1997-8 and onwards is WRONG then?

I will stay with Castrol's comments thanks - I have worked closely with their Chemists and Lube Engineers since 1980 but I suppose that matters little too!


Doug,

it is not my intention to be rude. Just pointing out my name. Sigantures are there for a reason, that's all. If you take offence, I can't help that.

Your knowledge and experience are invaluable to this Forum and I respect your opinion.

Having said that, you do tend to nitpick though (I do as well) and bristle when someone challenges your views (as you have done here and as I do as well at times). I was merely pointing out that what you had stated was not in accordance with what Castrol is publishing and what is the generally accepted definition of Semi-Synthetic and Synthetic oils as outlined in the links in my post.

Castrol's own marketing material and comments re Magnatec do NOT align with your opinions based on the link to the TDS for Castrol Magnatec and the email from Castrol's own Technical line.

If you can provide links or other physical evidence to back your claims, I am more than happy to be proven wrong.

Fairs, fair Doug. I have read other posts from you asking other Forum members to provide proof to back their claims. It works both ways.

Always happy to agree to disagree and I enjoy a robust debate. You have strong opinions and so do I.

Again, apologies to the Forum for highjacking this thread. Perhaps we should set up a different thread?
_________________________
Dave "Dave's not here man"
2010 Lexus RX350 Sports Luxury, 2006 Lexus SC430
AMSoil Series 3000 HDEO 5W-30
BMW's are German Chevy's

Top
#1199087 - 07/22/08 04:02 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: LexusAussie]
SpeedyMan Offline


Registered: 09/27/07
Posts: 51
Loc: Bulgaria
Hello D.Hillary & Dave,

No problem for me, I enjoy your debate.
Anyway, I have posted another topic in this forum: CASTROL MAGNATEC vs. MOBIL SUPER S. It is better if the administrator or moderator of this forum moves your debate there.
But not a real problem about this.

So CASTROL EDGE, MOBIL1 & MOBIL SUPER S have a similar smell, quite different than the CASTROL MAGNATEC. I really believe magnatec is not that good, it is more like a dino oil.
I am not an expert in oil or chemistry, but with this simple test I suppose that Magnatec is made from quite different base oils than the others mentioned above.

What do you think?


Edited by SpeedyMan (07/22/08 04:08 AM)
_________________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=xpmThYTn60o

Top
#1199089 - 07/22/08 04:17 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: LexusAussie]
Doug Hillary Offline


Registered: 05/30/03
Posts: 4816
Loc: Airlie Beach Australia
Hi,
Dave - You said;

"Magnatec is a conventional dino oil (semi-synth at best)"

I reacted to that as it was wrong!

I only want the facts out on Topics and that is why I will not contribute unless I can back up my statements!

I will provide scanned data to you if you PM me your e-mail address. It will be from the 1998-9 and 2001-2 Castrol Lube Guides


Edited by Doug Hillary (07/22/08 04:20 AM)
_________________________
Regards
Doug

Top
#1199091 - 07/22/08 04:18 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: SpeedyMan]
LexusAussie Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 215
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Edge is a good oil as is Mobil 1. Magnatec is a good Dino oil (10W40)(I'm sure Doug will disagree and say it is a Semi Synthetic ;o))I used the Magnatec myself for nearly 7 years and have no issues with it. My only reason for changing is that it doesn't come in recommended Viscosity Range for my Lexus. No experience with the Super S.

I would say you can't really go wrong with either Edge, M1 or the Magnatec as long as the viscosity range is what you need.

You may also wish to consider an oil from Elf. The Excellium range has had good reviews on various forums. An earlier poster also suggested this.
_________________________
Dave "Dave's not here man"
2010 Lexus RX350 Sports Luxury, 2006 Lexus SC430
AMSoil Series 3000 HDEO 5W-30
BMW's are German Chevy's

Top
#1199094 - 07/22/08 04:28 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
LexusAussie Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 215
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
 Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hi,
Dave - You said;

"Magnatec is a conventional dino oil (semi-synth at best)"

I reacted to that as it was wrong!

I only want the facts out on Topics and that is why I will not contribute unless I can back up my statements!


Doug, I'm awaiting the proof. Castrol's own material appears to back me up notwithstanding your beliefs.

The killer for me was your comment that "For us as users there is probably a much simpler explantion - Group 3 lubricants are the "semi" or "part" synthetics. Group 4, 5 and 6 are the "synthetics".

The only Group III lubricants in the current Magnatec range is the Magnatec Professional which the Castrol Tech Line acknowledged was Group III. Standard Magnatec is not a Group III. Castrol still have the hide to market the Magnatec Professional as a "Full Synthetic" (which it is not as acknowledged by their Tech Line).

It's time for you to put up hard evidence! More than happy to be proven wrong but I want to see hard evidence.

Come on Doug! Share!
_________________________
Dave "Dave's not here man"
2010 Lexus RX350 Sports Luxury, 2006 Lexus SC430
AMSoil Series 3000 HDEO 5W-30
BMW's are German Chevy's

Top
#1199108 - 07/22/08 05:29 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: Doug Hillary]
LexusAussie Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 215
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
 Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hi,
I will provide scanned data to you if you PM me your e-mail address. It will be from the 1998-9 and 2001-2 Castrol Lube Guides


Doug,

For some reason, part of your earlier post didn't show up on my screen. I didn't mean to leave it out. My apologies.

Great offer but I'm looking for current evidence as the current publications from Castrol simply don't state that Magnatec is a Synthetic Oil.

The TDS for Magnatec can be accessed via this link:

http://www.tds.castrol.com.au/pdf%5C5052_Castrol_Magnatec_10W40_119369_2006_10.pdf

Please understand, based on the content stated in Wikipedia a Synthetic Oil must be Groups IV,V or VI. A Semi Synthetic Oil can have a Group II or III base with no more than 30% Group IV, V or VI. Only Americans regard Group III as Synthetic. You and I are Aussie's.

If you can provide an extract from the Castrol Tech Line advising what the Base Oil is (ie Group II or III) and what Group the "Synthetic" potion of the oil is (ie Group IV) hat will more than suffice.
_________________________
Dave "Dave's not here man"
2010 Lexus RX350 Sports Luxury, 2006 Lexus SC430
AMSoil Series 3000 HDEO 5W-30
BMW's are German Chevy's

Top
#1199118 - 07/22/08 06:00 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: LexusAussie]
Johnny Offline


Registered: 05/27/02
Posts: 14013
Loc: Retired | Wausau, WI
Dave, I really love reading these debates between you and Doug, highly respect both of you, but I have to ask you, do you really make decisions based off what you read on Wikipedia? The way that system is set up, we could go in there and tell you Group IV was made from maple syrup.

Oh, and speaking to what Americans regard, BMW is not a Chevy.

Top
#1199119 - 07/22/08 06:04 AM Re: MOBIL1 0W-40 vs. CASTROL EDGE 0W-40 [Re: LexusAussie]
SpeedyMan Offline


Registered: 09/27/07
Posts: 51
Loc: Bulgaria
 Originally Posted By: LexusAussie
 Originally Posted By: Doug Hillary
Hi,
I will provide scanned data to you if you PM me your e-mail address. It will be from the 1998-9 and 2001-2 Castrol Lube Guides


Doug,

For some reason, part of your earlier post didn't show up on my screen. I didn't mean to leave it out. My apologies.

Great offer but I'm looking for current evidence as the current publications from Castrol simply don't state that Magnatec is a Synthetic Oil.

The TDS for Magnatec can be accessed via this link:

http://www.tds.castrol.com.au/pdf%5C5052_Castrol_Magnatec_10W40_119369_2006_10.pdf

Please understand, based on the content stated in Wikipedia a Synthetic Oil must be Groups IV,V or VI. A Semi Synthetic Oil can have a Group II or III base with no more than 30% Group IV, V or VI. Only Americans regard Group III as Synthetic. You and I are Aussie's.

If you can provide an extract from the Castrol Tech Line advising what the Base Oil is (ie Group II or III) and what Group the "Synthetic" potion of the oil is (ie Group IV) hat will more than suffice.


Well... if this is so - then according to my "smell" theory MAGNATEC should be Group II base oil + < 30% Group IV/V/VI and SUPER S should be Group III base oil + < 30% Group IV/V/VI.
Anyone who can check the truth of this statement?
It is really interesting for me..


Edited by SpeedyMan (07/22/08 06:06 AM)
_________________________
http://youtube.com/watch?v=xpmThYTn60o

Top
Page 3 of 15 < 1 2 3 4 5 ... 14 15 >