Redline 5W40, 55-58K mi, Subaru WRX (modded)

[TedMeyer]

This is my first UOA. I did two samples from the same change of Redline 5w40. The first sample was taken after a long run of full-tilt trackday driving, ~200 miles in one day on Pocono South, plus a day of slow, rainy track driving at NHIS, and the only other mileage was basically highway driving to/from the track. As Blackstone notes, the lead is troubling. One thing I did not mention to the lab was that I installed a larger (18G) turbo at 52,000 miles (making 270 awhp) -- not sure if that might explain the lead. (I ran Castrol dino oil for turbo break-in, then a brief stint on Mobil 1 synth before I read some alarming reports about M1.)

 

[TedMeyer]

The second sample contains one more day of hard track driving at NHIS, the rest of regular commuting. Lead still high. In the most recent change I used Pennzoil 5w30 full-synth -- hopefully things improve.

 

[saaber1]

The UOA image is not showing up. Can anyone else see it?

Note that you have to post a URL from an image hosting site such as photobucket to paste the image. OR you can just copy the list of wear metals, viscosity etc. from someone elses post, paste into a word processor, add your info., then paste it into the post without any image or url etc.

Also it is helpful to hit the preview button to see if it is visible before submitting

 

[TedMeyer]

sorry, having issues....

 

[Pablo]

There is something wrong with the address/location. Just type the numbers in. It's easy, just copy someone elses and carefully replace the numbers with yours.

 

[TedMeyer]

Sorry, BITOG keeps crashing me while I'm entering the data. Here are the numbers for 1380 / 3880 miles. Filter is OEM.

ALUMINUM 2 / 3
CHROMIUM 0 / 1
IRON 5 / 8
COPPER 2 / 2
LEAD 9 / 13
TIN 1 / 1
MOLYBDENUM 587 / 574
NICKEL 0 / 1
MANGANESE 0 / 0
SILVER 0 / 0
TITANIUM 0 / 0
POTASSIUM 18 / 17
BORON 14 / 15
SILICON 23 / 25
SODIUM 2579 / 2549
CALCIUM 7 / 7
MAGNESIUM 1266 / 1235
PHOSPHORUS 1471 / 1391
ZINC 0 / 0
BARIUM 3 / 2

Viscosity was 71.6/71.5. Insolubles were 0.2/0.3.

 

[Pablo]

Your number must have slipped a notch when entering. Double check.

 

[buster]

I wouldn't listen to b/s labs on the Pb. Roy Howell knows all about the Pb in UOA's with RL. It's not wear. It makes it tough though to detect actual engine wear though so you could run it by Dave at RL and he will give you his thoughts. With Redline, you might be able to drop down a grade to a 10w30.

 

[TedMeyer]

Thanks for bearing with me -- I love computers...
1380 mi / 3880 mi

ALUMINUM 2 / 3
CHROMIUM 0 / 1
IRON 5 / 8
COPPER 2 / 2
LEAD 9 / 13
TIN 1 / 1
MOLYBDENUM 587 / 574
NICKEL 0 / 1
MANGANESE 0 / 0
SILVER 0 / 0
TITANIUM 0 / 0
POTASSIUM 3 / 2
BORON 18 / 17
SILICON 14 / 15
SODIUM 23 / 25
CALCIUM 2579 / 2549
MAGNESIUM 7 / 7
PHOSPHORUS 1266 / 1235
ZINC 1471 / 1391
BARIUM 0 / 0

Viscosity was 71.6/71.5. Insolubles were 0.2/0.3.

 

[SubLGT]

What was %fuel and flash point?

 

[TedMeyer]

SuS viscosity 13.38 / 13.34
Flash 420 / 430
Fuel Water&Antifreeze both 0 / 0

and I'll throw in that the initial sample was drawn 10/27/07 (using a Blackstone pump) and the second sample was drawn 1/26/08 (from the drain, mid-stream). Car is in New England, so that oil saw temps from 80+ on the track to below zero at Stowe over New Years.

I used the 5w40 after a bunch of Subaru drivers reported spun bearings using Mobil1 5w30 and some other 30w oils. I knew this car was going to see 3-4 track days, so I bought a case of Redline (at my Pocono track day, oil temps were in the 100c range -- it was a warm day). I'm currently running 5w30 Pennzoil synth for the remainder of the winter.

 

[bluesubie]

I would do like buster says and speak to Dave at RL. A lot of RL UOA's show high lead at first and then it settles down. Although, you probably won't get consistent readings switching back and forth between PP and RL.

And as far as being afraid to use RL xW30, the HTHS is very high so you will have better protection than with an Energy Conserving xW30. No comparison, IMO.

What EM are you running and what air filter?

-Dennis

 

[TedMeyer]

Running Cobb Accessport EM w/ a Pro-Tune by XX Tuning in CT (had been running off-the-shelf stage2 Cobb map before the Turbo install last summer). Air filter is a K&N w/ Maxima filter oil (been using the KN since I bought the car).

My original plan was to go Redline 5w30 in the spring and back to RL 5w40 for summer/track. I thought for winter I'd save some coin and go with something more easily accessible -- sadly I can't find GC or non-energy conserving oils in the proper viscosity anywhere near me.

Does anyone have an email for Redline? I didn't see anything on their site.

Thx,
Ted

 

[buster]

Originally Posted By: TedMeyer
Running Cobb Accessport EM w/ a Pro-Tune by XX Tuning in CT (had been running off-the-shelf stage2 Cobb map before the Turbo install last summer). Air filter is a K&N w/ Maxima filter oil (been using the KN since I bought the car).

My original plan was to go Redline 5w30 in the spring and back to RL 5w40 for summer/track. I thought for winter I'd save some coin and go with something more easily accessible -- sadly I can't find GC or non-energy conserving oils in the proper viscosity anywhere near me.

Does anyone have an email for Redline? I didn't see anything on their site.

Thx,
Ted


Just call them. I have their email somewhere... ask for Dave or Roy. The Pb is an interaction with the moly and bearings.

 

[SubLGT]

Fuel and flash indicate that you do not have a big problem with fuel dilution. Your tuner has done a good job.

 

[TedMeyer]

I spoke to Dave at Redline and asked some questions -- he said these Pb levels were far from anything to worry about. He attributed it to oxidation on the bearing surface in reaction to the additives, and said the quantities were too minute to have any appreciable impact on bearing longevity. He suggested levels closer to 100 would be indicative of a problem.

As for the tuner: he did a nice job... the A:F ratios were exceptionally steady. I would have loved a bit more power from the 18G, but heat was an issue with the TMIC (IIRC, this tuner has since moved to The Shop to tune and no longer works as XX.

 

[bluesubie]

Smart move getting a pro-tune at XX.

-Dennis

 

[JohnBrowning]

How about you let us see what thing things looks like on a 5000-7000 mile run on Redline 5W40 with no track time at all! Then we can see what we see. I do not see anything that alarming since it is track time. But with out a pace line I do not know. You might also try their 10W40 and see how that does with track use.

 

[TedMeyer]

That's probably not gonna happen. That's a long time to go without track time, and I only log 10-11K miles per year.

On the plus side, I stopped by the local Autozone and they had German Castrol 0w30 back in stock! I picked up 10 quarts (much to the shock of the checkout guy), so that'll be my fill for the spring. They also had Castrol 5w40 that was labelled "European Formula, now Blended in the US". It's not energy conserving, so I assume it's the good stuff. But that'll have to wait until I deplete the case of Redline 5w40 in the garage.

 

[bluesubie]

With some searching around here and nasioc, you should be able find some GC UOA's on tracked WRX's. I believe FD777 is one.

IIRC, the Syntec 5W40 isn't that spectactular. GC would probably be more shear stable.

-Dennis