Startup noise with GC

[Bobert]

When starting my Jetta VR6 today I had some terrible startup noise when the engine fired up-- it was really bad, lots of clanking and clattering

. My car sometimes sits around a few days at a time, and I'm thinking the 0w-30 drains too completely down into the oil pan, not really leaving a film on the mechanical parts within the engine during a cold start. GC is very quiet though after it's started, and when warmed up, so my engine seems to like GC except when it's first cranked during the first few seconds. If I start my car everyday, there does not seem to be much startup noise, but if it sits a few days, there is moderate startup noise--with today being the loudest it has ever been.

Not really in the mood to dump $30 worth of GC--expensive rinse

. I'm thinking about draining a quart of the GC out through the cartridge filter drain, and refilling with a quart of M1 15w-50 to thicken the brew a little. Would this be effective? Or should I just dump it and try to save in a gallon milk jug for another day since it only has about 350 miles on oil, then refill with 5w-40 Synpower?

 

[Bobert]

Maybe I could use 1 quart of straight weight 30wt. Castrol GTX dino instead of M1 15w-50 to thicken the cold viscosity during startup. Not sure which would work better.

 

[Brett Miller]

I'd be more inclined to believe the anti-drainback valve in the filter is leaking.

 

[Bobert]

It is a cartridge type filter that is positioned vertically so no oil would drain out of the filter housing. I'm not sure if there is a anti-drainback valve with this type of filter housing.

 

[labman]

I don't know about the Jetta, but my Ecotec definitely has an ADBV.
The little projection on the bottom with the O-ring defeats it when you loosen the cap to remove the filter allowing the oil in the filter and above it to drain out. Likely your manual drain is for the same purpose. After letting it set for a day or 2, try opening the drain. If no oil comes out, the ADBV isn't working.

 

[dropitby]

I have only used GC for a few weeks in my wife's car but it has never sounded better.There are several things it may be but a good NAPA gold or OEM filter is where I would look first if your oil is full up.If you feel you need to add try MOLA BREW 3:1 Schaffer #132 to LC. Just something I would probally do.

 

[427Z06]

quote:

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Originally posted by Brett Miller:
I'd be more inclined to believe the anti-drainback valve in the filter is leaking.

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I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[Bobert]

The oil pressure sensor is actually located within the filter housing itself, so if oil was draining from the housing the oil light would light up on the dash. The only time the oil light has ever come on is when I have changed the oil, and the housing is only half full. I can only fill the base of the cartridge up half way during an oil change, so it lights up for just a brief second after the engine is started, then goes out. Otherwise I will not see the light come on until I change the oil again.

Edit: here is a pic:

[ September 01, 2004, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: Bobert ]

 

[Pablo]

It sounds like the oil pump loses the prime. I'm not sure a thicker oil would help much. GC isn't exactly a thin oil.....are there any reports of oil pump problems with this engine?

PS Nice engine and pict. Supercharged, to boot!

 

[Dr. T]

What are the miles on the car? No other oil does this? Have you tried the Synpower 5-40 or M-1 15-50?

Interestingly enough my BMW makes noises with thicker oils on start-up because the lifters are having a hard time pumping up. I was told that they're either sludged or worn out. Or it could be sticky valves/stems.

 

[vvk]

What year Jetta?

Sounds to me like GC is too thick, not thin. Later model year VR6s require special oil, certainly not the plain SLX 0W-30 -- it's too thick.

Don't be mislead by the 0W part -- this oil is thicker at room temp than an ILSAC EC rated 10W-30.

 

[ebaker]

IF the motor has a cam chain it is probably the cam chain tensioner check valve leaking. The chain rattles until the tensioner gets oil pressure. Ususlly the check valve is a small steel ball. It can get a corrosion pit or a piece of debris that keeps it from seating.

 

[Virtuoso]

So you never see your oil pressure light on, even before you start your engine? Unless you *just* changed your oil?

That's scary.

 

[Mike_dup1]

What oil filter are u using, stock or another brand? Maybe the oil filter is slowing down the flow to the valve train just enough to make noise?

 

[moribundman]

Not sure about the Jetta engine, but my Audi motor has oil check valves in the heads (near the cams) that prevent all oil from draining out of the heads and back into the sump when turning off the motor. Those check valves are known to go bad and that results in valve clatter on startup. Have them checked, as I don't think VWs clatter normally loudly, especially not with a oil with decent thickness like GC.

 

[427Z06]

The ADBV not only keeps the filter and the oil pump full of oil, it many times keeps a column of oil in the oil passages. If it were me, I'd change the oil filter as a first step in troublshooting this problem. Costs: 1 filter, 1 qt of GC.

 

[Bobert]

Well thought I'd update. I started the car the other day (had sat for about 3 days) and the noise wasn't nearly as bad as last time, yet still moderate. I think I'm not the only person to notice harder starts with GC looking through some of the older posts, specifically this one

I topped up with some M1 15w-50 and will continue to do so for this drain interval. If I get another obnoxious cold start or two, I will consider pulling the plug on the GC experiment and use something different. The motor really loves GC and is very quiet, except for cold starts. Again, if I only wait 1 day to restart the motor, it fires up with minimal noise. It seems when the car sits around for a few days, the cold starts become louder.

BTW, im using the stock OEM Hengst oil filter, the car is 1999 Jetta GLX (A3) and has 45,000 miles. Don't think there is anything mechanically wrong with the motor, but will keep an eye on things. Hopefully the M1 15w-50 will tame the green elixer.

 

[KJA426]

I've heard way too many reports of engine noise on this stuff even if it does give decent UOAs. I used it once and encountered engine noise so I'll pass thank you.

 

[Grossomotto]

Just as many people, if not more, have had "start up noise" when switching to Mobil, Redline, etc. Most of the noise if fabricated in your head.

 

[KJA426]

I'm fully aware of what an engine tick sounds like as I'm sure many others are.