Other GM teams concerned Gibbs is going to Toyota
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Good, Toyota needs a top team on board. I wonder how Tony will feel about this though?
Jon
Jon
Wouldn't that be something. Tony in a Toyota.
gzzzz!!! toyota belongs back in japan not here!!!
It's good to see that Jack Roush has no interest in Toyota. I just wonder when NASCAR is going to let Ford develope a new engine for Cup, just like Toyota, GM, and Dodge has been allowed to do in the last few years.
It just a parade of self propelled billboards. Toyota gives the rednecks something to throw the empties at besides Jeff Gordon.
xen·o·pho·bi·a / Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[zen-uh-foh-bee-uh, zee-nuh-] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
an unreasonable fear or hatred of foreigners or strangers or of that which is foreign or strange.
[Origin: 1900–05; xeno- + -phobia]
—Related forms
xen·o·pho·bic, adjective
That Toyota Camry you hate so much for being a Japanese car is made in America and contains more American made parts than the Ford Fusion, Chevy Monte Carlo, and Dodge Charger it will be racing against in NASCAR. Sorry to disappoint ya.
Jon
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It would be a great thing for Toyota to be with a first rate team. Waltrip hasn't done them all that well although the top 35 qualifying scheme has hurt them too. What a silly set of rules left over from when there were fewer big sponsors than starting spots.
I can see why Roush has no interest in Toyota. He made his forture from Detroit and Ford in particular. Why abandon that now. Anyone remember the Gapp and Roush pro stock cars?
http://www.draglist.com/photoimages/Photos-RayRay/Full Size/gapproushtaxi.jpg
http://www.draglist.com/photoimages/Photos-RayRay/Full Size/express.jpg
I agree the Fords need a new engine. It seems everyone else has gotten one. Toyota even had to build another for Cup racing. Nascar wouldn't allow them the use of the engine or parts developed for the truck series.
Just a bunch of rednecks blah blah... That stuff just never gets old...
I can see why Roush has no interest in Toyota. He made his forture from Detroit and Ford in particular. Why abandon that now. Anyone remember the Gapp and Roush pro stock cars?
http://www.draglist.com/photoimages/Photos-RayRay/Full Size/gapproushtaxi.jpg
http://www.draglist.com/photoimages/Photos-RayRay/Full Size/express.jpg
I agree the Fords need a new engine. It seems everyone else has gotten one. Toyota even had to build another for Cup racing. Nascar wouldn't allow them the use of the engine or parts developed for the truck series.
Just a bunch of rednecks blah blah... That stuff just never gets old...
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Production Chevy Monte Carlos contain 90% North American sourced parts, can you show me some facts that indicate the Camry contains more?
According to this article the Camry as the same domestic content as the Ford 500 (Taurus) 80%
http://www.boston.com/cars/news/articles/2006/09/24/made_in_america_hard_to_tell/
http://www.boston.com/cars/news/articles/2006/09/24/made_in_america_hard_to_tell/
North America is an important distinction, how does money spent in Canada or Mexico help the US economy (both are NAFTA members and as such can be classified as "North American" content)? Also, why don't you show me some facts that the Monte Carlo is 90% NA built, you have your facts on the Camry from the post above me. My city's tool and die industry has lost basically all of their so called "domestic" contracts to Canada, Mexico, and China and now are stuck depending on "foreign" manufacturers such as Nissan, Toyota, Honda, and Hyundai. My uncle runs one of these shops and his corporation hasn't received a meaningful contract from one of the big 3 in more than 3 years yet has received multiple multi-million dollar contracts from each of the aforementioned companies.
Jon
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Too bad this thread turned away from racing as a subject.
Might as well lock it now. The Detroit/Made in USA vs. the world subject has been done to death...
Might as well lock it now. The Detroit/Made in USA vs. the world subject has been done to death...
HondaF1Fanatic,
Now it's your turn to tell us how a company(Toyota) that imports 46% of it's cars from Japan, which would be over 1 million cars per year ,is more American than GM, Ford or Chrysler.
And if you want to talk about Xenophobia, Japan as a nation is virtually the epitome of that word. Trust me, I could start pasting link after link of Japans' quite famous Xenophobia. To me it's a good justified reason to have a reciprocal policy of keeping them out of traditional American racing.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/21/automo...nyt&emc=rss
"In 2006, 46 percent of Toyota’s vehicles were imported from Japan compared with 38.4 percent in 2005 and 37 percent in 2004.
Toyota sold 2.54 million vehicles in the United States last year, a record for the automaker, which passed DaimlerChrysler to rank third behind General Motors and the Ford Motor Company. It has forecast that its American sales will rise to 2.68 million this year.
Toyota accounts for 9 percent of automotive manufacturing jobs in the United States and roughly 16 percent of the vehicle market, while G.M. accounts for 29 percent of the jobs and about 24 percent of the market, Mr. Doyle said.
“We lose 10 for every one job that they bring,” Mr. Doyle said.
And despite the start of Camry production here, Toyota will still import 60,000 Camrys from Japan this year, Mr. Lentz said. Along with that, Toyota also expects to import about 70,000 more Priuses than in 2006, when it sold just under 107,000 in the United States."
Now it's your turn to tell us how a company(Toyota) that imports 46% of it's cars from Japan, which would be over 1 million cars per year ,is more American than GM, Ford or Chrysler.
And if you want to talk about Xenophobia, Japan as a nation is virtually the epitome of that word. Trust me, I could start pasting link after link of Japans' quite famous Xenophobia. To me it's a good justified reason to have a reciprocal policy of keeping them out of traditional American racing.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/21/automo...nyt&emc=rss
"In 2006, 46 percent of Toyota’s vehicles were imported from Japan compared with 38.4 percent in 2005 and 37 percent in 2004.
Toyota sold 2.54 million vehicles in the United States last year, a record for the automaker, which passed DaimlerChrysler to rank third behind General Motors and the Ford Motor Company. It has forecast that its American sales will rise to 2.68 million this year.
Toyota accounts for 9 percent of automotive manufacturing jobs in the United States and roughly 16 percent of the vehicle market, while G.M. accounts for 29 percent of the jobs and about 24 percent of the market, Mr. Doyle said.
“We lose 10 for every one job that they bring,” Mr. Doyle said.
And despite the start of Camry production here, Toyota will still import 60,000 Camrys from Japan this year, Mr. Lentz said. Along with that, Toyota also expects to import about 70,000 more Priuses than in 2006, when it sold just under 107,000 in the United States."
Ford doesn't need a new engine, they've been competative every year since NASCAR gave them their new Cylinder design not that long ago. 03 and 04 had Ford drivers win the championship, and the last two years saw Ford get the runner up spots. Wasn't too anlong ago all Rousch's Fords made the chase, and Yates has always been known for having the engines that get down the staright away. If Ford has lost something it is in the handling, Nose or body, they've got the engine. I didn't expect Toyota to do good out of the gates when up against all the money Chevy puts in, but I would like to see Gibbs go to Toyo personally. I like Toyota, lets see what a good team can do.
I never claimed that Toyota was a more American COMPANY than GM, Ford, or Chrysler so don't try to put incorrect words in my mouth. My original claim, if you actually read it before you replied, was that the Camry was as much if not more American than the SPECIFIC models it races against in NASCAR. The Ford Fusion is largely based on the Mazda 6 and the Dodge Charger is underpinned by the previous generation Mercedes-Benz E-class. I was wrong about the Monte Carlo however, it is mainly a NA design.
This attitude shows that you are obviously believe that two wrongs making a right. If you see someone steal something from you, do you believe it is justified to steal from them? I used to think that way.......in preschool. Also, if you actually looked at the JGTC which is Japan's version of NASCAR you would see multiple Corvettes and Dodge Vipers racing in it, so much for the Japanese being more xenophobic than us.
In this group of info, you quote a member of the Level Field Institute, a group founded by retired UAW workers to try to discredit the fact that the number of "foreign" cars being built in the US is constantly growing while the number of "domestic" cars being built in the US continues to fall as GM, Ford, and Chrysler outsource production to lower costs so the can compete with the so called foreign companies all the while being saddled with ridiculous legacy costs. This method of argument would be similar to me quoting a member of the Tobacco lobby showing information that smoking doesn't cause cancer. If a RJR lobbyist told you cigarettes weren't addictive and used unverifiable statistics to "prove" it, would you believe them?
Also, you may have missed the main point of the article. The majority of the increase in foreign produced Toyotas being imported to the US are hybrids, something that no US manufacturer has yet to start mass producing (GM's pseudo hybrids don't count as they are not true hybrids and Ford's hybrids use licensed Toyota technology). The battery and transmission technology used by the Prius, Camry Hybrid and Highlander hybrid is simply not available at a reasonable cost from any US manufacturer yet. Americans are voting with their wallets by buying hybrids in ever increasing numbers so Toyota had to import more to keep up with demand.
I am sure you will continue to find ways to justify your myopic and xenophobic view of the world all the while typing on your computer (where are the vast majority of the components for that made?), watching your television (How about that?) and wearing clothes (hrm, wonder where they are made?). It makes sense to me.
Jon
I believe Ford messed up on the nose design of the new Fusion (pre-COT). They also have less team owners with 7 post shaker rigs which have proven themselves to be invaluable with the COT. Finally, I think they were slow to learn that they needed to pool as much data as possible from all of the owners to stay competitive. It sucks for me as a fan because I have always been a big Ford supporter in NASCAR. Mark Martin and Dale Jarrett are far and away my two favorite drivers.
Jon
If Gibbs wins with Toyota it's because of a lot of things. Nascar is not about excellent engineering because all the vehicles are the same. If Gibbs starts winning they will just start inspecting him a lot more which is how they keep the competition even. They will make competition adjustments.
COT will bring the competition a lot closer, 7 shaker rigs may give some teams an advantage in early development of COT, but if NASCAR keeps COT for a long time the teams with less money will catch up. As they test, and gather information from race to race and make adjustments and changes, they will have just as much advantage to having these expensive toys. The key is for them to actually make a lot of changes and see what works. I think the biggger hinderance for smaller teams is horse power. If they catch up in this area, be ready for a whole bunch of different people winning these races. These cars have never been the "same", but they are getting closer.
The Yates Ford cylinder head was from the mid-90's, I would say an upgrade is in order.
If NASCAR continues the IROC route, the near future will bring an EOT, or Engine of Tomorrow. It will be some V-8, FI engine with NASCAR supplied engine management systems that will be tamper proof. It will lease the engine to the teams.
With TV ratings dropping, next year will be the turning point in NASCAR. When ALL the races will be with the COT, brand identity will basically be a thing of the past. NASCAR becomming PC will turn off a lot of people. It's already started.
If NASCAR continues the IROC route, the near future will bring an EOT, or Engine of Tomorrow. It will be some V-8, FI engine with NASCAR supplied engine management systems that will be tamper proof. It will lease the engine to the teams.
With TV ratings dropping, next year will be the turning point in NASCAR. When ALL the races will be with the COT, brand identity will basically be a thing of the past. NASCAR becomming PC will turn off a lot of people. It's already started.
Greg Biffle mentioned a few weeks back on Inside Nextel Cup that the Roush teams were behind the curve on the COT cars because Jack Roush didn't believe they'd stick around. So they did little development on them. The Roush teams were always strong on the tracks where the COT ran this year so that certainly hurt them.
The new Ford engine idea seems simple enough to me. Everyone else seems to be getting one, why can't the Ford teams? Of course that won't happen until the Nascar rule of the week committee decides it's required to keep all of the brands "equal"
As if...
The new Ford engine idea seems simple enough to me. Everyone else seems to be getting one, why can't the Ford teams? Of course that won't happen until the Nascar rule of the week committee decides it's required to keep all of the brands "equal"
As if...
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