FWD, Limited Slip Differential, and Snow

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The Civic Si seems like a cheap throw-away car that is sporty enough to make it a fun car as well.



Interesting that you would make this attitude public. When my friend half-jokingly said his TSX was 'disposable,' he lost all hope of getting any thoughtful car advice from me. Perhaps it's not too late to redeem yourself before your BITOG brethren?




What is the issue??? Not trying to cause a flame war of imports vs domestics or other imports or whatever, but I think there is some truth to it. I know it is the apparent case in the situation of our 94 acura integra... It is as if acura engineers figured the car was disposable, and so they chose materials which just would not ever last... because compred to our 94 toyota previa, the acura has degraded to a disposable-like car in 185k of no cost is too big service, as opposed to our previa still being like new after 207k of the same treatment.

That isnt to mention looking at other cars, such as my 83 and 85 MB, which still both have the original radiators... maybe some have been lucky, but not my experience with respect to honda plastic top radiators. Perhaps we are just lucky, but it seems to be well with our domestic cars too.

The reality is that a civic and an accord are cars designed for the masses (and lets face it, a TSX is an accord too). In fact, more or less every car these days, even cars from good engineering companies such as daimler, BMW, etc. are designed more as throw away cars and less as take them apart, replace things and keep using them type cars.

maybe Im just spoiled by w123 chassis MB cars, but it seems to me that EVERY car manufacturer is more concerned with leasing and CPO and getting new cars out and old cars recycled, than they are at building robust products. Our recent experience with Honda certainly is no different.

So I think that Metroplex is fully justified in making that sentiment public. Sorry that he doesnt cater to the "Honda can do no wrong" crowd. After all, he is the one plunking down $20k of his hard earned money, and he darn well better get what he wants and expects -if the Si is not it, then that is all the justification in the world. Im not reading into what he says, but I find that his claims are accurate, and just as reasonable and correct as somebody that would kiss their acura to bed each night.

JMH
 
JHZR2 pretty much hit the nail square on the head. I meant no disrespect towards Honda/Acura owners. I just feel that the Si Coupe is a lot of car for the money, but it's also priced so that it is disposable and easy to part with should the need arise (accident, theft, no longer like it anymore). I could park it right next to other cars at the mall and not worry about dings. A $50k Audi TT (which is what I was looking at as well), on the other hand, is a much larger chunk of change and would be a bit harder to call "disposable" especially with a 12 year corrosion warranty.

I've never liked Japanese cars because of the bland designs and styling, but the 8th gen Si Coupe is attractive and offers a lot of performance for the price. It's small enough that it will be fun to drive and easy to wax/detail. Everyone I know that has a Toyota and/or Honda has nothing but praises for their car.
 
FYI: I've been a Ford owner all the way through, but they haven't done anything new with the Focus nor have they offered anything exciting other than the S197 Mustang. Had they released a Mk 2 Focus, or kept the ST trim for the 2008 MY, I may consider a Focus instead of a Civic since I can get the X-Plan discount and a $2500 rebate. I haven't found any supplier discounts or rebates for the Civic, so it's back to haggling with the dealer trying to make a factory order and I dread these type of transactions.
 
interesting. I found I got around better in my 91 ranger after I installed the LSD. Althought I have BFG All Terrian T/As out back and 420lbs of sand. Even before the sand it still got around good.

My buick roadmaster with winterforce tires never failed in the winter
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I guess it's a driver mod
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I had snow tires on my 81 T-bird (open diff, 3.08s) and I managed to get it stuck a few times but it wasn't too hard to get it unstuck. In each instance where it was bogged down, a LSD would have helped it move a bit easier.
 
I never got stuck when I was young (for that matter, it has not happened very often ever). I didn't ever have anything special...but I could "launch" well and had good aim. Now I don't think that I can even drive that way anymore. My jeeps allow me to be sensibly cautious ..no body language ..no backspin on the cue ball. When I lived in Noowingland ..there was actually enough snow (often enough and it stuck around long enough) to learn how to drive in it.
 
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What is the issue???



The issue is that anybody would consider any brand new car as being 'throw away' on a site mostly devoted to enthusiastic and devoted owner-maintainers. Pride of ownership is something I have for all my things, no matter what their price or origin, or how undependable they might have become. It makes me bristle when it sounds like someone has more money than sense, but it also seems in this case that the 'issue' has been explained to my satisfaction. Back to the topic.
 
On throw-away, I view my current car, 2004 Subaru WRX wagon, currently with 41,000 miles in that way. I purchased brand new for $21k cash. I only plan on another 5-7 years max in it and let some young person enjoy the it when it hits 150k miles and is well worn.

If I were to keep it longer I would not use 4000 RPM as my daily shift point.

I do maintain in it so that it remains reliable during my ownership. However to this boards likely dismay it only get bulk fill dino every 4000 miles not synthetic.

I see the pointof view of certain price range cars as "throw-away".
 
Kinda funny.
Out of my two 123s, I had to replace the radiator in one. Plastic tanks, you know?
In six Hondas I've never replaced a rad. Throw-away cars, like you said.
 
I have lived in MN. all my life ! Driving in snow to me is easy !!! Here's the basic part of driving in snow or ice (I have drivin on many lakes) If your tires move/spin faster or slower than your vehicle is moving, you will lose traction !! PERIOD !!!!!!!!!!!
 
Driving in snow is not new to me. I've dealt with the light snow from NJ and the light to medium snow in SE MI. I've driven my RWD Crown Vic in the heavy stuff and all I'm asking here is to assess the capabilities of a FWD car with a LSD in snow in case I need to drive in the white stuff.
 
I would like something with a manual transmission and preferably a 2-door coupe for under $25k. Ford makes AWD cars but all of them are CVT/auto and 4-door sedans. Subaru has 4-door/5-door sedans but does have a 5-speed manual. Since I have gotten around 7-8 winters using nothing but RWD cars, do I really need AWD?
 
You don't need it, but it sure is nice to have. I had a '00 legacy gt that went through the snow like it wasn't even there. Also, all manufacturers awd setups are not the same. My subaru was a far nicer car to drive than my wife's honda crv in the deep snow. I also have an f150 that gets through the bad weather, but you have to be careful where you go and how you drive with it to not get stuck. With the subaru's I never worried about winter driving.

-Doug
 
Audi used to use their Quattro setup, but I read that they switched to Haldex units a few years ago and is similar to the AWD units used in the Ford Fusion/500/Taurus (viscous coupling instead of Torsens). The Subaru Imprezza 2.5 is on-par with the Si Coupe in terms of pricing but gets slightly lower gas mileage. The WRX is about $6000 more but has the same weight to power ratio as the Si Coupe. Unfortunately none of the Imprezas look sporty. They look like something a family would use for vacation.
 
I agree, the latest subaru styling leaves alot to be desired. I now drive a 93 Sub. Loyale with the older on-demand 4wd setup and this last winter I probably only used the 4x4 a handful of times. With proper tires you can get through the winter easy with fwd, except on those few really bad storms that come through.
 
just wanted to add, that when driving in the slick stuff the awd setups just add a really solid feeling to the driving experience. You point the wheels and the car goes there without the sliding around manuevers you were used to doing. With a manual trans and abs you can stop as reasonable well too. It just feels a whole lot safer.
 
You make a good point about the tires. I'm not too impressed with the low ratings given by users to the OEM equipped tires on the Si Coupe and the Imprezas. It's almost as if the OEMs sourced out the most expensive tires that have the worst performance in the snow.
 
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