Do cartridge filter setup have an ADBV?

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I am not really familiar with cartridge type setup but on the Lexus ES 350 forums there are a lot of complaints of start-up noise which tends to go away after a couple of minutes. I was wondering if this was caused by a lack of ADBV? FWIW, the filter housing is horizontally mounted.
 
There is no anti drainback valve on the cartridge filters for the GM 2.2liter and 2.4 liter ecotec engines. That doesn't mean there isnt on the Lexus ones though.
 
No ADBV on the BMW cartridge filters either. If the car has such mechanism at all, it would be somewhere in the filter housing itself I'm guessing. I was looking through the literature, but wasn't able to find if my car has one. However, whenever I open the housing to change the filter, there is always plenty of oil there, despite the fact that it is top-mounted.
 
On my MINI, the filter screws downward, not straight down but well over 45 degrees. When unscrewing it, you can hear when the seal breaks and the oil inside drains back down into the sump and out into the pan.
 
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At the risk of sounding like a noob, what's a "business end"?




Input and output side
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I guess the Mini set-up proved my theory dead on arrival. I guess if it drains back it's not too messy.......interesting.....
 
On my Cadillac CTS 3.6L, the cartridge oil filter is up on top, same level as the top of engine. Every time I have changed the filter, its dry. Don't know if pressure holds the oil in the filter when engine is off. Maybe the service manual will explain this.

There is never any cold start noise in the engine. There is no ADBV in the oil filter.

This is a very easy to "change oil" vehicle, don't ever have to get your hands dirty.
 
If it takes 'minutes' then it isn't the ADBV. Bad ADBV means a 1-10 second startup clatter while pump is filling the filter area. This is no different then the startup noise you get immediately after an oil/filter change.

Wow, so these 3.5's have piston slap and valvetrain clatter when cold. Sorry guys, but just had to jab Toyota.

My recommendation for those complainers is to check their oil. Some engines get noisy when low even if level is within the crosshatch. Make sure oil is perfectly topped off when hot 3-5 minutes after shutdown.

You might want to experiment with filter brands. Could be overly restrictive media.

And, certain oils are noisier then others. They need to experiment with brands. I would even consider stepping up a weight.

Variables to play with: oil weight, oil brand, oil type, filter brand, and oil level
 
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When I worked at a Toyota dealership we had many of the same complaints from the Avalon owners. I hope this isn't a bad sign for future engine reliability from this engine.
Jon




Well Toyota reall dropped the ball on this new Lexus. A LOT of complaints in Clublexus forums and a lot of buybacks from Lexus due to a faulty transmission. There are a ton of 2007 ES's on Ebay with less than 5k miles because of buybacks due to the flaring transmission.
I dont think its a bad sign for reliability because I know of a lot of older corollas that had start-up noise but went on to be reliable for over 250k miles.
Its just annoying to hear this clack-clack noise and they say its much worse in winter and colder environment.
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My Volkswagen has a one-way seated ball in the oil line that prevents oil from draining back toward the oil pump. The filter itself uses a plastic standpipe that prevents oil from draining completely through the filter and on toward the pressure by-pass when the engine is not running.

The oil filter housing will remain half filled with oil indefinitely with this setup.

One thing of interest,, the plastic stand-pipe in the filter was not originally present on the filters when they first started using them. The pipe was installed to prevent the housing from draining dry and to reduce the length of time required to build bearing pressure. I never noticed any abnormal engine noises during the first few years of ownership but I ensure that all replacement filters now have the plastic stand-pipe before I purchase them.
 
My wife drives an 07 Avalon, which has the same 2GR-FE V-5 as the Lexus ES-350 (but thankfully, a very nice 5-spd auto, not the 6-spd seen in the ES and Camry). Anyway, I would give this engine an overall "A+" grade, were it not for the cartridge setup. Why put a complex cartridge setup on the underside of the engine where you must have the car on a lift or ramps to service it???

But anyway, back O/T, the 2GR's cartridge setup should not need an ADBV, as it's the functional equivalent of a spin-on whose mounting surface ("business end" in Pablo's terminology) is oriented upwards. In fact, Toyota elements even come with a purpose-specific filter emptying widget. First, you open a small access cover on the bottom of the housing. Then you click in the widget. This causes the 8 oz or so of oil that's sitting in the filter to come out through the widget's spout end. Then you actually open the filter housing and remove the just-drained element.

Toyota's inclusing of a special filter housing "draining widget" is pretty strong proof that this setup needs no ADBV.

BTW, I really don't like this design. It's much more of a PITA than a spin-on, and the little lid for the widget is sealed with an O-ring, and is nothing more than just another extra opening in the oil system that could one day start leaking.
 
Originally Posted By: FowVay
My Volkswagen has a one-way seated ball in the oil line that prevents oil from draining back toward the oil pump. The filter itself uses a plastic standpipe that prevents oil from draining completely through the filter and on toward the pressure by-pass when the engine is not running.

The oil filter housing will remain half filled with oil indefinitely with this setup.

One thing of interest,, the plastic stand-pipe in the filter was not originally present on the filters when they first started using them. The pipe was installed to prevent the housing from draining dry and to reduce the length of time required to build bearing pressure. I never noticed any abnormal engine noises during the first few years of ownership but I ensure that all replacement filters now have the plastic stand-pipe before I purchase them.


Hi
Can you please give more details on this, photo's, part numbers, etc.
And possibly how this stops the oil draining back.

How does the plastic stand-pipe work.
Any photo's of it, or part numbers, etc.

Thanks
 
Originally Posted By: rotor9
.....How does the plastic stand-pipe work.
Any photo's of it, or part numbers, etc......


Linked below is the best oil filter standpipe thread I've seen posted here. Not sure about your specific application but it does a good job of showing how a standpipe could/might be beneficial in some applications. But it is shown in a spin on filter application.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/1945352/1
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Originally Posted By: Pablo
Aren't most cartridge filters, by their nature, vertical with business end up? (not that this fact(?) would negate the need for a ADBV.....but........)


Not on the GM 3.5L "shortstar" V6. Its verically mounted under engine block. Messy and a PiTA... plus pricey.
 
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Originally Posted By: rotor9
.....How does the plastic stand-pipe work.
Any photo's of it, or part numbers, etc......


Linked below is the best oil filter standpipe thread I've seen posted here. Not sure about your specific application but it does a good job of showing how a standpipe could/might be beneficial in some applications. But it is shown in a spin on filter application.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/1945352/1
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That is a very good link for a spin on filter.

However, I was (Do cartridge filter setup have an ADBV) looking for info on the cartridge filters and how a stand-pipe might stop a cartridge filter from emptying overnight and causing dry starts in the morning.

Thanks
 
The cartridge filter and the filter holder don't have ADBV, it is in the engine of my MB E430. After I parked my car for few hours I can hear the oil drained back into the engine when I loosen the filter holder on top of the engine about 3-4 turns.
 
i know on my 2011 Hyundai santa fe 3.5 it is on top and the engine is very noisy at start up and when hot the oil light stays on for 2 to 3 seconds but its under warranty and its leased so in a couple of months its totally Hyundais problem. I see this with a few makes some not as bad
 
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