A friend of mine has a 1996, maybe 1997 TDI passat; I believe he has always used mobil 1, car can use gasser oil. Should I be warning him against using SM rated oil, even if synthetic?
-Thomas
-Thomas
In the light of the VW PD failure thread....
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The engine in the 1996 and 1997 (1Z or AHU) Passat is not the same as the unit injector engines of the 2004 and newer VW diesels.
You should tell your friend to use a synthetic oil that meets VW 505.00 or CH-4 or newer in the viscosity of 5W-40. This is what VW dictated in a service bulletin back in 2001 when they noticed piston ring sticking on the ALH engines.
Oils such as Mobil-1 15W-50 do meet the VW 505,00 specification but they're not optimum for use in the TDI. Mobil-1 0W-40, 5W-40 or Shell Rotella-T 5W-40 are good Wal-Mart available oils for his application. Castrol 5W-40 is
available at AutoZone and is specifically recommended for the 505.00 application.
You should tell your friend to use a synthetic oil that meets VW 505.00 or CH-4 or newer in the viscosity of 5W-40. This is what VW dictated in a service bulletin back in 2001 when they noticed piston ring sticking on the ALH engines.
Oils such as Mobil-1 15W-50 do meet the VW 505,00 specification but they're not optimum for use in the TDI. Mobil-1 0W-40, 5W-40 or Shell Rotella-T 5W-40 are good Wal-Mart available oils for his application. Castrol 5W-40 is
available at AutoZone and is specifically recommended for the 505.00 application.
Non-PD TDIs thrive on M1 5W-40 TDT for really long OCIs, at Wal-Mart as FowVay said. But it doesn't meet VW specs but maybe this engine is out of warranty anyway.
SM oil by itself isn't bad, rather it's a potentially bad situation if someone assumes that SM oil is the best oil to ever have been provided for use by the general public, and is thus all that is needed. For warranty or minimum/most requirements use what the maker recommends.
Motor oils designed for gasoline engines are for the most part unsuitable for diesels. A diesel-rated oil has the capacity to hold soot in suspension, in some cases up to 2-3%. Mobil 5w40 is one of the best synthetics, Mobil 0w40 not quite as good but still okay. Mobil doesn't really sell anything else in NA that works in TDI engines. (Or anything at all for 2004-and-newer TDI PD engines.)
He is not budging. It appears it will be Mobil-1 SM/5W-30.
Thanks for the input.
Thanks for the input.
How many miles on his engine? If he sells the Passat, will he warn the prospective buyers that the wrong oil was used... even if it lowers the resale value by several thousand dollars?
156K; right now he is waiting for a $400 computer ($1600 at the dealer) from Der Fatherland.
I sent him a link to Hot Rod magazine's article about premature cam wear from SM oils and reduced ZDDP. Also mentioned VW spec'ed the oil gasser oil not knowing "what the future held" I suggested SL rated fleet oils as minimum (even cheaper too); you can lead a horse.......
Like a coworker of mine who has a 2000 Jetta who also uses Mobil-1 5W-30, he has been bamboozled by the "Mobil-1 5-30 is the best" syndrome. I have pointed both of them to the M1 0W-40 PDS showing them the VW approval, again, no dice.
I am giving up on both of them.
I sent him a link to Hot Rod magazine's article about premature cam wear from SM oils and reduced ZDDP. Also mentioned VW spec'ed the oil gasser oil not knowing "what the future held" I suggested SL rated fleet oils as minimum (even cheaper too); you can lead a horse.......
Like a coworker of mine who has a 2000 Jetta who also uses Mobil-1 5W-30, he has been bamboozled by the "Mobil-1 5-30 is the best" syndrome. I have pointed both of them to the M1 0W-40 PDS showing them the VW approval, again, no dice.
I am giving up on both of them.
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It is shortening the life of those engines. My Golf has always had Mobil Delvac 5w40, except for a brief experiment with Elf CRV 0w30 (supposedly better but not in my case). I am planning on 400k miles and hoping for 500k+. But those engines getting gas-engine-only M1 5w30 will never last as long, no matter how often the oil is changed.
Figure on $4000 for a new (reman) long block -- that's how much to deduct from the value of your friends' cars.
A co worker of mine has a pretty new bug TDI that uses Syntec 5W30 he always complains how dirty the oil gets right after he changes the oil. He hasnt had any problems.
My oil is black as coal 5 minutes after an oil change. It's normal.
At least Mobil 1 5w30 warns you on the label that it's for "Gasoline Engines Only". That Syntec is wrong, wrong, wrong.
Diesel engines need a diesel oil. He's doing serious damage to that engine.
I don't suppose you could point him to the owners manual. I don't get it!!! Why doesn't the dealer COACH people correctly.
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Several years ago I went directly to Audi AG after not getting through when talking to the folks at Audi of America. In the end I was told that Audi of America was a separate entity from Audi AG and thus, while Audi AG regretted the issues brought to their attention, there was nothing they could do about it.
As long as AoA and VWoA don't care, the dealers won't care. As I said years ago, out of principle alone I'd never again buy a new VW or Audi in the US.
"Why doesn't the dealer COACH people correctly. "
VW dealers are probably the worst at doing right for the customer. They use the wrong oil, etc... , and the stories are legend.
Don't know if its intentional or just a lag in time before procedures and information is correctly available at dealerships.
If you do find one that is accurate, fair and sympathetic to customers, share, I'm sure they're out there.
The ownership turnover in my area is an issue, so I can't say names good or bad, other than the misinformation, misdiagnosis, and incorrect fluids I received. I run to the gurus in the VW clubs and avoid the dealers if at all possible. Seems to work.
VW dealers are probably the worst at doing right for the customer. They use the wrong oil, etc... , and the stories are legend.
Don't know if its intentional or just a lag in time before procedures and information is correctly available at dealerships.
If you do find one that is accurate, fair and sympathetic to customers, share, I'm sure they're out there.
The ownership turnover in my area is an issue, so I can't say names good or bad, other than the misinformation, misdiagnosis, and incorrect fluids I received. I run to the gurus in the VW clubs and avoid the dealers if at all possible. Seems to work.
A "pretty new bug TDI" could mean either a PD (2004-and-after) or a VE (1998-2003).
For the VE engine, the oil requirement is either:
VW505.00 or better, or
API CH-4 or better, or
ACEA A3/B4
CF does not cut it. B5 does not cut it.
Syntec 5w30 is a poor choice for any diesel engine. German Castrol 0w30 would be okay, Syntec 5w40 would work.
For the PD engine, the requirement is more demanding. VW505.01 or better.
TR,
As long as you go with the ACEA rating first, what you've said is correct. As good as they might be, even the 505.01 oils are only rated API CF.
As long as you go with the ACEA rating first, what you've said is correct. As good as they might be, even the 505.01 oils are only rated API CF.
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TR,
As long as you go with the ACEA rating first, what you've said is correct. As good as they might be, even the 505.01 oils are only rated API CF.
Everytime you turn around VW has introduced another oil spec. It's almost ridiculous. I can just see the owners manual now for the 2020 VW Bug: "Only use oils that meet VW 505.29542332352."
I still maintain that the guy using 5w30 Syntec is not doing any "serious damage" to his engine as long as he changes it at reasonable intervals.
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