Amsoil XL 5W20 2200 MI 2006 Honda Odyssey

[Laminar Lou]

Why does this site fight me when I try to post anything in columns? Augh. I really wish I could just post HTML and be over with it.

This UOA is really to see what the metals were at and to do a particle count before I put on an oil filter magnet. The only thing that is interesting is that the Viscosity is low. I added 4oz of LC20 at fill and 1 oz at 1500 miles. Not sure if that could have caused it.

Code:

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Honda Odyssey

3.5L V-6

Gasoline

Vehicle miles: 7,693

Miles on oil : 2,181

Life of oil : 2 months



Lab: Blackstone



Slowly but surely, your odyssey is progressing past wear-in. Aluminum and

silicon were reading most out of line, and they both dropped again, as did the other metals.

The viscosity read a little low, though we didn’t find any fuel

that would have caused the viscosity shift. We are finding that some Honda

engines tend to cause the viscosity to drop, and it doesn’t seem to hurt

anything. The PC read 16/12, clean for an engine oil. The complete particle

breakdown is attached to the hard copy that is on its way to you. No

contaminants found.





Date 12/06/06 09/28/06 06/26/06

MI on oil 2181 2754 2666 Universal Average

Unit MI 7693 5420 2666

Aluminum 10 11 14 4

Chromium 0 1 1 1

Iron 7 10 20 13

Copper 22 29 81 34

Lead 0 0 1 1

Tin 0 0 0 0

Moly 125 518 345 72

Nickel 0 0 0 0

Manganese 0 1 0 1

Silver 0 0 0 0

Titanium 0 0 0 0

Potassium 2 3 9 1

Boron 152 41 190 49

Silicon 18 30 91 46

Sodium 5 7 14 11

Calcium 2018 1947 1717 2223

Magnesium 7 6 11 63

Phosph 595 589 654 692

Zinc 692 717 782 825

Barium 0 1 4 0



Sub Viscosity @ 210 = 49.3

Should be 52-61



Flashpoint = 375

Should be >355



Fuel % =
Should be


Antifreeze % = 0

Should be 0



Water =
Should be


Insolubles = 0.2

Should be

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[Laminar Lou]

Here is the clean version

 

[buster]

Quote:

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I added 4oz of LC20 at fill and 1 oz at 1500 miles. Not sure if that could have caused it.

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I can't read your fuel number, is it
Things are definitely going in the right direction. Looks good. The additive package looks great and must have changed again. The are using a good amount of Boron and Moly.

Pablo, is it me or is Amsoil using the same/similar additive packages in the XL/ATM/ASL now? Looks like they are very similar.

 

[lindermant]

cool - looking forward to the before/after filtermag PC results. And to verify, the oil was not changed at this sample correct?

for comparison, here's the PC results from my 04 Ody:

Code:

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Blackstone Labs

2004 Honda Odyssey 3.5L



Brand: Havoline

Weight: 5w20

Grade: SM/GF-4

Unit Miles: 30,016

Oil Miles: 5,954

Oil Weeks: 22

Miles/week: 270

Day: Oct 16

Year: 2006

Oil Filter: Honda

Filtech



Particle Count



ISO Code (2) 15/11 clean

NAS 1638 Class 0

ISO Code (3) 15/14/12

>= 2 micron 479

>= 5 micron 177

>= 10 micron 49

>= 15 micron 19

>= 25 micron 4

>= 50 micron 0

>= 100 micron 0

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[Laminar Lou]

Thanks for the PC numbers. I will post mine when they arrive in the mail.

And, yes, the oil was not drained.

Buster,

You can have my LC20 when you pry it from my cold dead fingers.

 

[Laminar Lou]

Buster,

I made a typo - it is a .2% I can't fix it because it says the maximum time has expired to edit the post, but thanks for the catch.

Also, I am not so sure that the Moly is really in the Amsoil. It could be left over from the Factory Fill and the Havoline that was in there previously. But it is possible.

 

[buster]

The Moly level is probably from the Havoline. This oil does use some though. Lou, the viscosity could be low due to the LC. You're using a good oil that really doesn't need LC IMHO. But keep playing around with it and see what happens. Nice report.

 

[Laminar Lou]

Quote:

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Buster,

I made a typo - it is a .2% I can't fix it because it says the maximum time has expired to edit the post, but thanks for the catch.

Also, I am not so sure that the Moly is really in the Amsoil. It could be left over from the Factory Fill and the Havoline that was in there previously. But it is possible.

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whoops, nope I was right the first time. It is
Interestingly, my fuel has been
Maybe I got lucky and have a nice tight motor, or maybe they changed the fuel map recently.

 

[Laminar Lou]

Received the Particle count numbers in the mail. Here they are:

ISO Code (2) 16/12
NAS 1638 Class 1
ISO Code (3) 16/15/13

>=2 Micron 909
>=5 Micron 336
>=10 Micron 93
>=15 Micron 36
>=25 Micron 8
>=50 Micron 0
>=100 Micron 0

 

[lindermant]

double L,

what oil filter are was in place for this OCI (and the next for your filtermag experiment)?

 

[Laminar Lou]

Quote:

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double L,

what oil filter are was in place for this OCI (and the next for your filtermag experiment)?

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Amsoil EAO, and I did not remove the oil filter. I just slapped on the FilterMag to the existing filter.

 

[lindermant]

A-EAO, thanks; and duh, I should've remembered it remained in place for the next 2k+ miles

 

[TeeDub]

Buster,

The additive package for the XL series is very similar to the ASL/ATM formulations, but the additive "treat" level is lower. Hence the XL series has a baseline TBN closer to 10.0, rather than the 12+ for ASL and ATM....

It does look like the level of borate esters has been significantly increased for the XL series...

 

[benjamming]

Just b/c the fuel test comes back with < .5% doesn't mean you don't have fuel dilution issues. It would simply mean there was < 0.5% fuel in the sample. Wear rates will be affected by fuel dilution.

 

[TeeDub]

LL,

Once this engine has broken in and the wear pattern has stabilized, your best bet is to change to the Amsoil Series 2000, 0w-30 in this application. The Amsoil 0w-30 will last about 50% longer than the XL series (yes, the XL series is THAT good) and will give you a thicker oil film in the bearings and valvetrain. (Note that if you lived in a cold climate, I'd actually recommend sticking with 5w-20 or even 0w-20.)

The combination of the EAO oil filter and the Amsoil 0w-30 should get you consistent 15,000 mile/1 yr service intervals, vs a 10,000 mile/1 yr interval with the XL series.

 

[Laminar Lou]

Quote:

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LL,

Once this engine has broken in and the wear pattern has stabilized, your best bet is to change to the Amsoil Series 2000, 0w-30 in this application. The Amsoil 0w-30 will last about 50% longer than the XL series (yes, the XL series is THAT good) and will give you a thicker oil film in the bearings and valvetrain. (Note that if you lived in a cold climate, I'd actually recommend sticking with 5w-20 or even 0w-20.)

The combination of the EAO oil filter and the Amsoil 0w-30 should get you consistent 15,000 mile/1 yr service intervals, vs a 10,000 mile/1 yr interval with the XL series.

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Not sure I am too comfortable with going with a 0W30 on an engine spec'd for a 5W20. Don't get me wrong, I use the 0W30 series 2K in my Tundra. But I'd be interested to hear your reasons why a 0W30 would be good in this motor.

I won't be doing extended drains while under the powertrain warranty. I don't want a fight on my hands if something ever happens. I have been in litigation before on warranty claims, so I am gun shy. Even though I won, it wasn't worth the hassle.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Quote from TeeDub:"The combination of the EAO oil filter and the Amsoil 0w-30 should get you consistent 15,000 mile/1 yr service intervals, vs a 10,000 mile/1 yr interval with the XL series."

The only down side to this combo is dollar cost per mile. It would be twice the cost for 5 K more miles.

Laminar Lou, what is the max miles on a OCI the OEM wants with the engine? How many miles is the engine warranted for? and it would be nice if you could one oil (0-30) your family fleet. It will be interesting what TeeDub say's.

 

[buster]

LL, I wouldn't use S2k until you're ready to extend drains beyond 10k miles. S2k would be a good, although expensive, choice for very long drain intervals. The way it's formulated now, you might not even know the difference. It's on the low end of the 30wt scale and heavily friction modified. My .02

 

[TeeDub]

LL,

If Amsoil made a 12 TBN, PAO/Ester based 5w-20, I'd recommend that for best performance. Right now, the S2000 and the S3000 are their best two gas engine oils for 5w-20/5w-30/10w-30/0w-40/5w-40 applications...

The only drawback to using the Amsoil 0w-30 in a 5w-20 application is a small decrease in fuel efficiency.


LCM,

With the S2000 and a 15k interval, you can eliminate 1 out of 3 oil/filter changes, assuming a 10k interval with the XL Series. If you also take into account the value of your labor ($20.00-$25.00?), to do an oil/filter change and clean up the mess afterwards, this is the more cost effective option....

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Quote:

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LL,

If Amsoil made a 12 TBN, PAO/Ester based 5w-20, I'd recommend that for best performance. Right now, the S2000 and the S3000 are their best two gas engine oils for 5w-20/5w-30/10w-30/0w-40/5w-40 applications...

The only drawback to using the Amsoil 0w-30 in a 5w-20 application is a small decrease in fuel efficiency.


LCM,

With the S2000 and a 15k interval, you can eliminate 1 out of 3 oil/filter changes, assuming a 10k interval with the XL Series. If you also take into account the value of your labor ($20.00-$25.00?), to do an oil/filter change and clean up the mess afterwards, this is the more cost effective option....

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TeeDubb, it's true that the filter is about 11 dollars and 6 quarts of XL about 30 dollars and 25 dollars for labor = $70 saved by eliminating one oil change. But the additional cost of the series 2000 or 3000 is about 3 dollars more per quart = about 36 dollar more in cost for 2 oil changes.

If you drop the labor charge figure its very close leaning towards the series 2000 and 3000 just a tad....I am just wondering at this point TeeDubb, it seems at this point you really lean towards the group IV/V synthetic oils, What is your take on group III synthetic oils and the closing gap so many folks are talking about on this site?

To be fair....this is a loaded question and I am sure many triggers are cocked out there