How 'bout a different racing thread?

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Lots of racing this week and one thing in common. Cars the same, engines the same, can't tell the players without a program. I know they are trying to keep the cost down but I'd like to see a class of racing that whould foster new stuff. Here's my rules:

1. A restrictor plate, calibrated for say 750 hp. Run any engine, no superchargers, turbochargers, only fuel E85, standard pump gas, supplied by organizers.
2. Wheel and tire spec, two or three sizes, keep the cost down and allow rwd or awd.
3. No exotic materials, min weight of 2000 pounds, keep the chassis cost down.
4. No ABS, traction control, paddle shifters, no electronic aids of any kind.
5. All the latest safety reqts.
6. Road racing and oval tracks distances from 100 miles to 500 miles with an annual 12 hour race.
7. Build any kind/shape car you want, any or all drive wheels connected to the engine.

I'll bet a set of rules with whatever refinements are needed would produce interesting racing and field a lot of different cars.
 
I'd leave out the restrictor plate, and control it by engine size (maybe throttle body total area too), but let whoever do whatever with their engine sans forced induction.
 
The restrictor plate would be their to allow the use of larger less expensive engines, and to use engine programs that already exist. I want to see cars that look different, work different and promote new ideas.
 
NASCAR has lost it. NHRA keeps it real. I mean come on, what NASCAR car can you even come close to buying on Monday? I would rather flush a pack of Skittles down the toilet and watch all the pretty colors go round and round than watch that joke called NASCAR.
 
While I don't agree with everything NASCAR does, the statement "NHRA keeps it real" is funny. It's been a long time since you could "Buy on Monday what won on Sunday". Racing has evolved into BIG buisness, and the principals of the governing bodies of most motorsport organizations allow rules that somewhat try to keep costs under control, yet allow serious competition between manufactures. Sponsors pay big money for those advertising billboards on most race cars, and without sponsorship bucks there would be no racing at the professional level.

While I like all forms of racing, it's entertainment, pure and simple. My favorite racing is F1, and I am a big Michael Schumacher and Ferrari fan. Drag racing is probably my least favorite type of racing, but I still respect the sport and watch it sometimes. To each his own.

I have just 1 question for you Coral. What dealer can I buy John Force's Mustang Funny Car from after he wins?

The most enjoyable racing was the Aussie Touring Car Championship that used to be on Speed TV. That was a terrific series for near production cars. Too bad Speed TV dropped it from it's line up.
 
Coral, my point exactly. The new class would make for a lot of different looking and working race cars. I hope you catch the Skittles before they go down. No use wasting good candy.
 
I found that since DE's death in '01 I haven't really watched as many races as I used to. Now the only cars I look for are the ones sponsored by products I use (42 Havoline for example). It's just my opinion (and bad experiences with a Japanese car
mad.gif
) that when it was announced that Michael Waltrip would be driving a rice burner next year but still have Napa as a sponsor that's when I decided no more Napa diecasts for my collection.
 
quote:

Originally posted by LarryL:
Lots of racing this week and one thing in common. Cars the same, engines the same, can't tell the players without a program. I know they are trying to keep the cost down but I'd like to see a class of racing that whould foster new stuff. Here's my rules:

1. A restrictor plate, calibrated for say 750 hp. Run any engine, no superchargers, turbochargers, only fuel E85, standard pump gas, supplied by organizers.
2. Wheel and tire spec, two or three sizes, keep the cost down and allow rwd or awd.
3. No exotic materials, min weight of 2000 pounds, keep the chassis cost down.
4. No ABS, traction control, paddle shifters, no electronic aids of any kind.
5. All the latest safety reqts.
6. Road racing and oval tracks distances from 100 miles to 500 miles with an annual 12 hour race.
7. Build any kind/shape car you want, any or all drive wheels connected to the engine.

I'll bet a set of rules with whatever refinements are needed would produce interesting racing and field a lot of different cars.


I see that type of racing on my 2 Speed Racer dvds.
lol.gif
Sorry, couldn't resist.
cheers.gif
 
I would propose something different:
1) open wheel version
A) The car must fit in a 2 metre by 1 metre by 6 metre box
B) The car can carry 4,000,000 BTUs of any liquid fuel (equiv to 32 galons of gasoline)
C) The car must weight at least 1200 pounds without driver but with other fluids (no fuel)
D) No visible aerodynamic devices allowed
E) single seat open wheel
F) 200 mile minimum, 2 hour maximum
G) no other rules

2) closed wheel version
A) The car must fit in a 2 metre by 2 metre by 6 metre box
B) The car can carry 4,000,000 BTUs of any liquid fuel (equiv to 32 galons of gasoline)
C) The car must weight at least 1600 pounds without driver but with other fluids (no fuel)
D) No visible aerodynamic devices allowed
E) passenger seat volume as big as drivers seat volume
F) 200 mile minimum, 2 hour maximum
G) no other rules

This would enable development of whatever kind of engine and fuel technology that can deliver the most power for the longest time.

Brakes, tires, suspension, cooling systems are all free.
 
Mitch, your ideas are the kind, like mine that would make racing interesting. Your classes would cost a bit more, though.
 
quote:

Restrictor plates blow..............

...no, just the way NASCAR does restrictor plates. Formula 1 does restrictor plates and it is really working. Last year the teams had a choice, spend a million dolars on a new engine or use a two dollar restrictor plate.

NASCAR used restrictor plates to cause accidents and that's what NASCAR fans come to see. The cars run so close together, that drivers start taking chances to get an advantage, then bam, you have an accident. Have you caught the new NASCAR format for some races, next year. Last car running wins. They are going to put 30 cars on the grid at Daytona, and each lap, the last car is eliminated. The race will be never exceed 30 laps, and with the talent in the NASCAR driver's pool, it may never make it to lap 10. Points will be awarded for each lap completed. Qualifing for the race will be done with three cars for each qualifing attempt. First car qualifies, second car advances to the next qualifing round, third car goes home. This will be the first of two new events for next year. The other is goind to be a class for SUV's. If the SUV's do as will as the pickup trucks they might drop the sedans. They are also thinking about adding a new class to the pickup races, where each pickup truck will haul a trailer and have a camper shell. What NASCAR wants out of this is more space for advertisers. Don't compare NASCAR restrictor plates with racing.
 
Technically, restrictor plates are for carb motors only. Inlet restrictors are what they are called when used on fuel injected/forced induction engines. I know it's semantics, but since most on this site are sticklers for detail/accuracy, I point this out.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Vuser:
I found that since DE's death in '01 I haven't really watched as many races as I used to. Now the only cars I look for are the ones sponsored by products I use (42 Havoline for example). It's just my opinion (and bad experiences with a Japanese car
mad.gif
) that when it was announced that Michael Waltrip would be driving a rice burner next year but still have Napa as a sponsor that's when I decided no more Napa diecasts for my collection.


HA! I agree. The only reason I watch it at all this year is to see Mr. Johnson kick Mr. Stewart's *** (I can't stand Home Depot). I will not watch it at all next year as TOYota will just keep dumping their Camry/Corolla trillions into their teams until they dominate and make for some really boring racing (as they've done in every other series they were involved with, save for F1, but give them time,they'll kill that series off also). Just look at the truck series this year to see my point! No other manufacturer/teams will stand a chance. Maybe they should just go all the way and make it a Nippon spec series??!
rolleyes.gif
 
NASCAR is just an ad campaign, only the billboards move. If Toyota gives NASCAR the most money, they will win. It's a simple formula, has nothing to do with a bunch of guys engineering a car, building the stuff, getting a good driver and then having a race with other like teams. That kind of stuff is called racing and it does not make enough money to pay for the cars. NASCAR is like Las Vegas for grease monkeys. Some of the only racing left is sprint cars, and the organizers are going to destroy them, too. Then its the go karts. Can you look at an unpainted NASCAR car and tell me if it's a Chevy or a Dodge. Now that Toyota has joined the party, I want to buy a rwd v8 Camry for my daily commuter, just like the one that they race. After all they are going to race one of their stock cars, aren't they?
 
^^^ i was thinking the same basic thing. what current toyota v-8 has a pushrod setup. im not into nascar so i dont follow the rules and such, but this just seems odd.

NHRA does not keep it real. I am a huge fan of NHRA drag racing, i try to watch every event and hope to be attending the maple grove, pa event in sept or oct (whenever it is, i forget). but a 500ci grand am, cobalt or stratus. the gto is kind of realistic as is the mustang, but i havent seen any 05+ mustangs in pro stock yet. funny cars arent even close, but they are cool to watch. the last event (topeka, kansas for those keeping track) had the closest racing in all the classes that i had seen in a while. it was great. i was looking at the tv (a 110" one, so i saw a lot) trying to figure out who won before the announcers said, i couldnt on a lot of the runs.

my rules would be a little different since i love drag racing. i think this is a variation on a few different types of racing

- 2700lb car, fwd or rwd (i know what would dominate, but you have to let some people try)
- 375whp MAX, you can use any engine to get there as long as it is not larger than 55 ci per cylinder, all cars will be dyno’d prior to the event and the top 5 finishers will be dyno’d following the event. the top 5 finishers are also subject to an engine teardown after each race.
- all cars must run on 100 octane unleaded fuel, which will be provided at each event. all cars will submit to a fuel check following the event.
- only conventional bore and stroke sizes may be used, no custom sizing as to create a more favorable power curve
- no turbo, superchargers or nitrous period, any violation will lead to permanent banning.
- automatic transmissions with no more than 3 forward gears or manual transmissions with no more than 4 forward gears
- body must be as it came from the factory or is available as a factory option
- front tires may be no larger than 225/55 and no smaller than 205/60
- rear tires may be no larger than 255/55 and no smaller than 235/60
- only 15” and 16” wheels may be used
- no exotic materials may be used in any part of the car
- racing will consist of a road course of no less than 150 miles and no more than 200 miles
- the road course will be immediately followed by 5 passes down a quarter mile (1320 ft) or eighth mile (660 ft), the average of all 5 passes will be submitted, a universal time of 14.50 seconds will be substituted for any missed run
- the road course and drag strip sections will be equally weighted in a point system

i think this would make for an interesting series. it would keep cost down, i think. i know the suspension needs to be addressed but it too would follow the same style as the other rules. crazy suspension setups will not be allowed. it would mainly be off the shelf parts.
 
quote:

Technically, restrictor plates are for carb motors only. Inlet restrictors are what they are called when used on fuel injected/forced induction engines. I know it's semantics, but since most on this site are sticklers for detail/accuracy, I point this out.

F1 calls them restrictor plates, all the offshore boat racing organizations call them restrictor plates, IRL, too, and they all have fuel injection, not one carb among them all. The F1 rules in French use the English words "restrictor plate", when referring to the V10 engines. The same words are used in the F1 introduction to the 2006 rules update. Renault uses the same words in describing their evaluation of their old V10 with such a device, and the new V8 engine without one. None of these groups have used the words, inlet restrictor. The real problem is that the word restrictor is probably a word not in the common English dictionary, yet, and is acceptable as technical jargon.
 
quote:

Originally posted by LarryL:

quote:

Technically, restrictor plates are for carb motors only. Inlet restrictors are what they are called when used on fuel injected/forced induction engines. I know it's semantics, but since most on this site are sticklers for detail/accuracy, I point this out.

F1 calls them restrictor plates, all the offshore boat racing organizations call them restrictor plates, IRL, too, and they all have fuel injection, not one carb among them all. The F1 rules in French use the English words "restrictor plate", when referring to the V10 engines. The same words are used in the F1 introduction to the 2006 rules update. Renault uses the same words in describing their evaluation of their old V10 with such a device, and the new V8 engine without one. None of these groups have used the words, inlet restrictor. The real problem is that the word restrictor is probably a word not in the common English dictionary, yet, and is acceptable as technical jargon.


If this is true, I stand corrected. I was stating this on the way I was corrected by the late Carl Merrill's crew chief (Lance Smith), at the Maine Forest Rally, when I called the 'intake air limiter' on his Escort WRC rally car a "restrictor plate". He said, "don't confuse Pro Rally/WRC with NASCAR, we call them inlet restrictors". Maybe the FIA only calls them this in the World Rally Championships??
 
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