I think I'm going to change direction for a race car...

[crossbow]

You fella's catch the new Azenis's?

quote:

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I went to sema today, and I'm holding the brocure in my hand for these tires. They're called the Azenis RT-615, and that is exactly what they look like. They uses light weight nylon sidewalls instead of steel (like the old azenis sport), and the tread compound is not supposed to get greasy when they heat like the sport does. The tech rep was telling me that they can be mounted with the large blocks on the inside of the rear rims to help produce oversteer for drifting or race tuning. They are aysemetrical and non directional, so you can rotate them front to back and side to side, and the sidewall is supposed to be as stiff (if not more) as the sport.

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They're now available in 18's (which should make many of you happy) and appear to be replacing the Azenis Sports. They also come in 235/40/17 W00t!!!!!!!!!!

Q1 2005
195/60/14

205/50/15
225/50/15

205/40/16

205/40/17
215/40/17
255/40/17
275/40/17
225/45/17
245/45/17

225/40/18
235/40/18
245/40/18
255/40/18
225/45/18
275/35/18

Q3 2005
185/60/14

195/50/15

235/40/17 (YAY)
215/45/17

255/35/18
265/35/18
315/30/18

 

[Solo2driver]

Hurray, new Azenis! The new Hankook Z212 street tire is nothing to scoff at either.

None of the CRX's (84-91) came with power steering, altough you could adapt it from a 4gen Civic LX if you absolutely couldn't muscle the wide tires around the course. Not sure on the backspacing, but rubbing is not an issue inside or outside when you are running the kind of rates required for ST2 or CSP...the ST cars run 500# front with the HF front sway bar (or none) and 550# rear with a custom splined 1-1/4" bar or larger. Add urethane bushings and good chassis bracing, and you're ready to go. I'd personally work on the engine hop-ups last...you can actually make decent decent power just by adhering the stock air filter into the top of the airbox housing and running a straight pipe...after that SP rules go as high as your credit limit.

An HF is still around 1950lbs stock, but you will be gaining weight back with bracing and using DX or Si control arms, as the HF pieces are thinner and are not a wise choice for racing. The DX is not a lot heavier, and it is easier to do the MPFI swap with the 1.5L (freer reving than the 1.6L) than swap the 1.6L longblock into an HF shell.

If you are going to do it, do it right. If you start out with an Si, I would not run CSP. ST2 is a new class that needs to be explored, and a CRX can EASILY win in that class with a little bit of work and street tires.

BTW-- the 84-87 Civics/CRX's use torsion bars up front and a twist-beam axle rear end, that is why there are no springs available for the front, only messy greasy torsion tubes and 30mm bars that cost (and weigh!) a ton.

-JamesW

 

[crossbow]

You guys keep reminding me that I drive one **** of a pig of a car

.

Here I am trying to reach 3000 lbs even, and your all shooting for 2000. LOL.

Ya i've been watching the hankook's too. Lots of tire choices this upcoming year. Now I just gotta decide to continue running the SSR 17x8's, or drop down to the 16x7.5 Rx8 ATX rims (which puts me back in STS).

 

[Thomas Pyrek]

quote:

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Originally posted by Solo2driver:
Not sure on the backspacing, but rubbing is not an issue inside or outside when you are running the kind of rates required for ST2 or CSP...the ST cars run 500# front with the HF front sway bar (or none) and 550# rear with a custom splined 1-1/4" bar or larger. Add urethane bushings and good chassis bracing, and you're ready to go.

If you are going to do it, do it right. If you start out with an Si, I would not run CSP. ST2 is a new class that needs to be explored, and a CRX can EASILY win in that class with a little bit of work and street tires.

-JamesW

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FWIW, this is NOT going to be a nationals car. This is going to be a local area car only for the next few years. No one runs sts2 so that would be boring. CSP is filled with people who have done basic suspension and engine mods, so this is where I intend to race for now.

In the past few days I've decided to start looking for a 84-87 civic/crx for dual use as a beater/solocar. I'm not looking for a nice car as my limit is $500. Just one that isn't terrible with rust and mechanically pretty good. Right now I'm looking at an 86 DX hatchback.

I was looking up the torson bars for a few days now but only found 27.5mm as the largest. Where are they 30mm available? What spring rate are poeple running for the rear (still 500)? How long of a spring should I need to buy (I'm planning on buying the ground control perch, but buying my springs at a local race shop that I like to support.

The only things I'm really going to do to this car are wheels and tires, springs and torsion bars, shocks and regular maintenance. Maybe I'll pick up other parts along the way that also can work on a 84-87 crx as well, but who knows. The goal of this car is not to outspend anyone, but it is to have a car that is competative in a relatively relaxed class that I race with locally. However, it is to have a good enough foundation that when I get out of school I can buy a rust free/good CRX and then swap the parts over and do the nationals thing. Is this making more sense now? Once I get another car, my prelude will be sold. I just doesn't get good enough fuel milage.

By chassis bracing, do you mean the panhard bar, or something else?

quote:

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Originally posted by crossbow:
You guys keep reminding me that I drive one **** of a pig of a car

.

Here I am trying to reach 3000 lbs even, and your all shooting for 2000. LOL.

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Eventually I'll be shooting for well under 2000lbs with driver, but that will come later.

[ November 12, 2004, 01:22 PM: Message edited by: Thomas Pyrek ]

 

[Solo2driver]

2000lbs? Dude, we're shooting for 1600lbs!!
Bret Norgaard's (Bilstein engineer) 84 CRX built to the teeth for CSP weighed 1595lbs with 1 gallon of fuel and made probably 160hp with the EW4 1.5L and individual throttle bodies.

My Suzuki weighs 1865lbs right now and has 113hp, and a 225-width street tire fits just right.

The '86 DX probably weighs around 1870lbs depending on how it is optioned, right from the start. By chassis bracing I mean upper strut tower braces and possibly a custom torsion-to-torsion brace. For the rear beam axle setup, I would look for an adjustable panhard rod or have one made with heim-joint ends and heavy-wall steel tubing. I would weld the roller bearing on the passenger side of the twist beam, effectively creating a big 3" hollow sway bar...if that still doesn't work, there are still aftermarket bars from Addco or OPM Motorsports (also camber plates and torsion bars), and I would go with 300-500lbs in the rear depending on how much rear bar you are running and how much street driving you will be doing.

Definitely look into urethane bushings for that car, as there are only 1 pickup point up front and 1 in the rear that has stock rubber, and when you tie in all that force on one point, it becomes very important to have those points contain good strong bushing material and does not bind up.

Go to Summit Racing for headers for that car...I got mine for like $100 and weighed like 25lbs less than stock, and are 50-state legal. I have a titanium muffler from a Suzuki Hyabusa street bike if you are interested--it fits in the stock non-Si muffler location for the 3rd gen Civic/CRX.

Whew, there is so much info! I should just write something up and send it to you...

-JamesW
Suzuki Swift GT 1.3L DOHC

 

[Thomas Pyrek]

My questions and statements are getting much more specific and word important.


The goal I have is to have well under 2000 lbs w/ driver. I'd imagine when I build that car I will weigh somewhere between 200-240. Add that to a 1600 lb car and that's still well under 2000. I'm still shooting for the same goal you are.


I very much appreciate your help. This car isn't going to see too much street driving (that's what my Z is for), I just can't drive it to work (but I normally ride a bike) nor have it at school (Which I'll need the car to be at school for the end/beginning of the school year to go to the races). Any more tuning and parts aquisition information would be greatly appreciated.


Of the parts I am planning on buying soon...

-Where can I get 30mm torsion bars? I've only found 27.5

-What length and rate spring should I use for the rear assuming little to no swaybar modification?

-I'm going to use off the shelf Tokico Illuminas. I'm assuming this is a fine choice for what I am doing right now.

-How much for the muffler?

-does this muffler from summit work with the carbed cars? I was unable to find it on summit to answer this question myself.

e-mail me, [email protected]

Any help that you're able to give me would help me immensely with my quest. You don't know how much I appreciate it. Plus, there I can tell you more of my driving style, experience and preferences.

[ November 13, 2004, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: Thomas Pyrek ]

 

[Solo2driver]

Ehaust header should work on the carb'd engine, but you'll have to get a universal catalytic converter and mount it UNDER the car instead of up against the cylinder head like the stock carb'd car has.

Sportbike muffler? What is your zip code, and we can work something out.

I *believe* that the 30mm bars are custom pieces from either OPM Motorsports or Addco (they used to make bars, and there may be some 30mm left over). In the mean time, the bars off of a Civic Wagon are stiffer than stock, and with a little filing they fit in the regular Civic/CRX. If you do not plan on using the rear bar modifications (but you should!!! you really don't have any idea how important that is...if you can't weld the bearing, which is very simple BTW, I would throw a bunch of dirt and metal into the bearing to make it seize up...you do not want it operational), you will need to run in the neighborhood of 500lbs-800lbs to compensate for the stock bar...you don't want to drive that down the street. The Tokicos should be fine, but I do recommend replacing the stock upper strut mounts in the front ($40 each at Pep Boys/AutoZone/Kragen), and slotting the holes for more camber (free important mod!)...just make sure you get the toe reset at a shop or with a tape measure, as increasing negative camber tends to wack out the toe and kill your tires and turn-in.

-JamesW
Made it in SportsCar and Grassroots Motorsports this month...hurray! I think we need BITOG decals

I

 

[Thomas Pyrek]

53140

The plan is to jsut do it slow and as I'm able to. Swaybars will be step two. However, I'm sure I can find a friend who can slap a small weld here and there.

Yup, I know all about toe and all that fun stuff. I didn't make a first gen 300zx fairly competative by just driving. I'm just not used to dealing with so many different parts and adjustments.


Would a BITOG sticker look good next to an anti-republican sticker?

 

[Solo2driver]

OT-- my W'04 decal cancels out your anti-republican decal....but the BITOG LIVES FOREVER!!!

-JamesW
Searching for "Bilstein R-2000 Flush Machine"