The cost of analysis from Oil Guard is inexpensive, but it looks like the results follow the price. Questionable.
Strange Analysis - Amsoil 15W-40 in TDI
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Can you be more specific? I mean, which part of the analysis do you question? TBN, viscosity, my sodium??quote:
Originally posted by 59 Vetteman:
The cost of analysis from Oil Guard is inexpensive, but it looks like the results follow the price. Questionable.
It seems like all things being normal (as if they ever are), high Si and high Na would also go along with higher wear metals and water/glycol.
Is this maybe what you refer to?
thanks,
Tim
Tim,
Your wear is very good. I probably should not have commented on the Oil Guard Lab so negatively. They are fairly new in the business of Oil Analysis and I am always suspect of accuracy from them. BITOG had some business dealings with the Company owner, and failure to pay his bill for services rendered is my complaint. I finally had to remove their banner ad due to failure to pay after 6 weeks of displaying it on the Board. (Kick me for being a dumb %%%)
Your wear is very good. I probably should not have commented on the Oil Guard Lab so negatively. They are fairly new in the business of Oil Analysis and I am always suspect of accuracy from them. BITOG had some business dealings with the Company owner, and failure to pay his bill for services rendered is my complaint. I finally had to remove their banner ad due to failure to pay after 6 weeks of displaying it on the Board. (Kick me for being a dumb %%%)
I understand. Sour tastes have a way of lingering.
I think I am going to take another sample, but this time out of the bypass return line. We'll see how that comes out. Given the low wear metals and no water or glycol, I'm inclined to believe that perhaps I contaminated my sample ever so slightly with remants in the Mity-Vac.
Tim
I think I am going to take another sample, but this time out of the bypass return line. We'll see how that comes out. Given the low wear metals and no water or glycol, I'm inclined to believe that perhaps I contaminated my sample ever so slightly with remants in the Mity-Vac.
Tim
MolaKule
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Tim,
Wear metals look good. Viscosity is only one cSt over spec, and most likely due to soot buildup, nothing really to worry about. This is a SAE 40 weight oil.
Resample if suspect and change air filter.
Wear metals look good. Viscosity is only one cSt over spec, and most likely due to soot buildup, nothing really to worry about. This is a SAE 40 weight oil.
Resample if suspect and change air filter.
Thanks for the feedback. I've just never seen an analysis come back with a viscosity above 16 cSt. I guess that is right at the bottom of the 50wt range. 0.5% soot for 5000 miles is about average, I think.
If I hadn't gotten home from work at 9:15PM (
I still think the Mity-Vac and associated hoses got me. We'll see. I'm gonna leave the oil in and wait on another result. Doesn't appear to be anything ready to fall apart in there!
Tim
Need some feedback, please:
Oil Guard Analysis
Amsoil 15W-40 5,000 on oil, 36,000 on car
Oil Guard bypass, Eclipse
Fram air filter (suspect?)
5-speed
70% highway, 30% mixed Houston commute this sample
Soy Shield and Amsoil Cetane Boost
Visc at 100 16.8 (!! Can this be right?)
Soot 0.5%
Fuel 0
Glycol 0
FE 7
CR 3
PB 0
CU 4
SN 3
AL 3
SI 30 (!!)
Na 31 (!!?)
Mo 0
K 2
Oxid 60.2 (see comment below re: esters)
Nitr 4.6
TBN 6.8 (?)
Oil Guard comments: Oxidation is not available due to the strong interference of ester-based synthetic. All engine wear rates normal. Viscosity higher than typical for the given oil type. Check for source of coolant leak.
My comments: SI seems high - I change my air filter at 20K and clean the snowscreen every 10K. I drive in generally pretty clean conditions. Car is garaged. I have a Mann filter in the garage, I think I'll change early...SI did not seem to affect FE?
Is the high Na what makes them suspect a coolant leak? Why then are water and glycol zero? Any other source of Na...I'll have to check VOA for Amsoil 15W-40.
TBN is lower than I expected...figured on 10 or so at 5000 miles. Does Oil Guard typically read low?
I still have this oil in (now at 6500 miles). Maybe I better dump it...? Edit: On second thought, maybe I'll disconnect the return line from the bypass and take another sample from there. First sample was taken with Mity-Vac. I pulled 6 ounces of clean and several ounces of used oil through prior to filling the sample bottle, but I wonder if I got some dirt/brake fluid residue from the Mity-Vac?
Thanks,
Tim
[ July 14, 2004, 01:05 PM: Message edited by: Tim ]
Oil Guard Analysis
Amsoil 15W-40 5,000 on oil, 36,000 on car
Oil Guard bypass, Eclipse
Fram air filter (suspect?)
5-speed
70% highway, 30% mixed Houston commute this sample
Soy Shield and Amsoil Cetane Boost
Visc at 100 16.8 (!! Can this be right?)
Soot 0.5%
Fuel 0
Glycol 0
FE 7
CR 3
PB 0
CU 4
SN 3
AL 3
SI 30 (!!)
Na 31 (!!?)
Mo 0
K 2
Oxid 60.2 (see comment below re: esters)
Nitr 4.6
TBN 6.8 (?)
Oil Guard comments: Oxidation is not available due to the strong interference of ester-based synthetic. All engine wear rates normal. Viscosity higher than typical for the given oil type. Check for source of coolant leak.
My comments: SI seems high - I change my air filter at 20K and clean the snowscreen every 10K. I drive in generally pretty clean conditions. Car is garaged. I have a Mann filter in the garage, I think I'll change early...SI did not seem to affect FE?
Is the high Na what makes them suspect a coolant leak? Why then are water and glycol zero? Any other source of Na...I'll have to check VOA for Amsoil 15W-40.
TBN is lower than I expected...figured on 10 or so at 5000 miles. Does Oil Guard typically read low?
I still have this oil in (now at 6500 miles). Maybe I better dump it...? Edit: On second thought, maybe I'll disconnect the return line from the bypass and take another sample from there. First sample was taken with Mity-Vac. I pulled 6 ounces of clean and several ounces of used oil through prior to filling the sample bottle, but I wonder if I got some dirt/brake fluid residue from the Mity-Vac?
Thanks,
Tim
[ July 14, 2004, 01:05 PM: Message edited by: Tim ]
Might try http://www.avlube.com for your next analysis. Here's my analysis in my TDI using Amsoil 15w-40.
http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=26;t=000094
99,887 miles on engine
9921 miles & 6 months on oil.
Iron = 49
Chromium = 3
Lead = 0
Copper = 6
Tin = 1
Aluminum = 9
Nickel = 10
Silver = 0
Silicon = 4
Boron = 1
Sodium = 7
Potassium = 3
Magnesium = 25
Calcium = 3475
Phosphorus = 1623
Zinc = 1726
Molybdenum = 0
Fuel = A
Water = < 0.1
Glycol = N
Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt = 15.7
Oxidation = 61.00
Nitration = 12.00
Soot = 0.3
TBN = 8.43
New sample is on the way to Oil Guard. Took it from the bypass return line. Changed the air filter to the Mann as a precaution. As always, no detectable dirt in the upper portion of the air box.
I'm going to stick with Oil Guard for now, for two reasons: ability to directly compare results, and I have three samples already paid for (the first was free with the bypass filter).
Hopfully the Si and Na will be normal, and consistent with the rest of the analysis. I really liked that 7ppm Iron number
Tim
I'm going to stick with Oil Guard for now, for two reasons: ability to directly compare results, and I have three samples already paid for (the first was free with the bypass filter).
Hopfully the Si and Na will be normal, and consistent with the rest of the analysis. I really liked that 7ppm Iron number
Tim
Got a second analysis done, this one at 6300 miles and sampled from the bypass return:
FE 7
CR 3
PB 1
CU 3
SN 1
AL 3
Si 14
Na 0
K 3
Nitr 0
TBN 6.8
Vis 16.8 cSt
Soot 0.5%
fuel 0
Water 0
Glycol 0
Looks like the bypass return sample made a great difference! Na to zero and less than half the Si.
Iron still at 7ppm with 6,300 miles on the oil. Only make-up was to replace the sampled oil.
On to 10,000 miles.
Tim
FE 7
CR 3
PB 1
CU 3
SN 1
AL 3
Si 14
Na 0
K 3
Nitr 0
TBN 6.8
Vis 16.8 cSt
Soot 0.5%
fuel 0
Water 0
Glycol 0
Looks like the bypass return sample made a great difference! Na to zero and less than half the Si.
Iron still at 7ppm with 6,300 miles on the oil. Only make-up was to replace the sampled oil.
On to 10,000 miles.
Tim
I would think sampling at the exit of the bypass filter would be bad, no?
Amsoil recommends sampling from the dipstick tube or from the drain plug. I believe their sampling petcock is on the input side of their bypass filters as well. I would think the bypass filter removed all the nasties and would make any sample at its output inaccurate.
The bypass is constantly removing whatever nasties it will, at the tune of the entire contents of the sump every couple minutes or so (it took less than 10 seconds at idle to fill my sample bottle). So you will not see any detectable difference input vs output.quote:
Originally posted by Paul L Fisher:
I would think sampling at the exit of the bypass filter would be bad, no?Amsoil recommends sampling from the dipstick tube or from the drain plug. I believe their sampling petcock is on the input side of their bypass filters as well. I would think the bypass filter removed all the nasties and would make any sample at its output inaccurate.
Now, disconnect the bypass for 5,000 miles and you'll see a difference, no doubt. But not from just one pass. If you think about it, this makes sense. The molecules coming into the bypass have just, on average, been through the bypass in the past minute or so and have only made one pass through the engine in that time. It takes awhile for the impurities to build up, more than a single pass. Yes, the output oil is cleaner, but not that you would see it in an analysis...not enough delta from one pass.
Not to mention it is a much cleaner sampling method. No outside hoses or pumps introduced into the system to contaminate the sample (like I did with my Mity-Vac).
Tim
MolaKule
Staff member
I think your Fe wear is excellent considering you're still "breaking-in."
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