A buddy of mine (not a very bright one IMHO) is using Mobil 1 5W-30 in the winter because he that's what he puts in his wife's car. I told him he was courting disaster, but his response was, "what's going to happen? I thought this was good oil?" I told him it was not designed for his engine, etc, etc, but you can only waste so much breath. What sort of grief is he in for?
Mobil 1 in a Powerstroke
- Thread starter Ron Jeremy
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MolaKule
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Diesels need a better detergent/dispersant package for soot control. Most diesels need at least a hefty 30 weight for the engine clearances and proper oil pressure.
Have him switch to Delvac 1 if he wants to stay with Mobil.
Have him switch to Delvac 1 if he wants to stay with Mobil.
Ron,
In the Power Stroke Diesel (PSD) Ford recommends a 15W40 for normal use, a 10W30 if temps are constantly below 20F and a 5W30 if temps are constantly below -10F. The key is constantly below. Also CF-4/SH or CG-4/SH or above ratings are the recommended ones. Most all Diesel oils OTC will meet these specs. I use CI/SL spec oil.
Now the 5W30 Mobil I is rated SL/CF. In a diesel engine the Commercial rating preference should be listed first then the Service rating as in CI/SL etc. The Mobil 1 won't blow the engine or drop a piston out the bottom, but the first thing that he will notice is rough idle and a skipping/hesitation symptom. This is caused because the Mobil 1, lacks the anti-foaming agent required by the HP Oil pump in this engine, which varies from 500 psi at idle to 3600 psi at WOT. This is a pump to supply oil pressure to the injectors. (HEUI injectors by CAT) The engine also contains the normal engine sump oil pump for the rest of the engine. If your friend would go to an IH dealer and get a bottle of anti-foaming additive, PN CH1824392 or Lubrizol 888, he can prevent the foaming issues.
IMO he used 15 quarts of oil not rated for use in this engine. If he wants to run this for the winter, add the anti-foaming agent, and change very early spring. I personally would not use this oil in any PSD except an emergency. Gasser, great. If he has any engine related problems, as noted earlier, change oil to the proper specked oil prior to taking it to the Ford Dealer. The easiest cure for a rough running PSD is change the oil first and if the problem persists then go on to further troubleshooting techniques.
Sorry for the long post.
[ November 27, 2002, 02:56 PM: Message edited by: 59 Vetteman ]
In the Power Stroke Diesel (PSD) Ford recommends a 15W40 for normal use, a 10W30 if temps are constantly below 20F and a 5W30 if temps are constantly below -10F. The key is constantly below. Also CF-4/SH or CG-4/SH or above ratings are the recommended ones. Most all Diesel oils OTC will meet these specs. I use CI/SL spec oil.
Now the 5W30 Mobil I is rated SL/CF. In a diesel engine the Commercial rating preference should be listed first then the Service rating as in CI/SL etc. The Mobil 1 won't blow the engine or drop a piston out the bottom, but the first thing that he will notice is rough idle and a skipping/hesitation symptom. This is caused because the Mobil 1, lacks the anti-foaming agent required by the HP Oil pump in this engine, which varies from 500 psi at idle to 3600 psi at WOT. This is a pump to supply oil pressure to the injectors. (HEUI injectors by CAT) The engine also contains the normal engine sump oil pump for the rest of the engine. If your friend would go to an IH dealer and get a bottle of anti-foaming additive, PN CH1824392 or Lubrizol 888, he can prevent the foaming issues.
IMO he used 15 quarts of oil not rated for use in this engine. If he wants to run this for the winter, add the anti-foaming agent, and change very early spring. I personally would not use this oil in any PSD except an emergency. Gasser, great. If he has any engine related problems, as noted earlier, change oil to the proper specked oil prior to taking it to the Ford Dealer. The easiest cure for a rough running PSD is change the oil first and if the problem persists then go on to further troubleshooting techniques.
Sorry for the long post.
[ November 27, 2002, 02:56 PM: Message edited by: 59 Vetteman ]
Ron,
The additive chemistry of Mobil 1 is not optimized for use in a HD diesel engine and it's also a bit too thin .... Some HD synthetic diesel oils to consider are:
1) Mobil Delvac 1, 5w-40
2) Amsoil Series 3000, 5w-30
3) Petro Canada, 5w-40
I have experience with all three of these and all are excellent for use in a Powerstroke in a cold climate. Amsoil will be the most expensive and the PC 5w-40 will be the least expensive of the three ....With oil analysis and filter changes every 5000-6000 miles, you should be able to go 3-4 times the 5000 mile drain intervals recommended by Ford. You do have to keep an eye on the foaming w/ the HEUI injectors, as 59 Vetteman mentioned
TooSlick
The additive chemistry of Mobil 1 is not optimized for use in a HD diesel engine and it's also a bit too thin .... Some HD synthetic diesel oils to consider are:
1) Mobil Delvac 1, 5w-40
2) Amsoil Series 3000, 5w-30
3) Petro Canada, 5w-40
I have experience with all three of these and all are excellent for use in a Powerstroke in a cold climate. Amsoil will be the most expensive and the PC 5w-40 will be the least expensive of the three ....With oil analysis and filter changes every 5000-6000 miles, you should be able to go 3-4 times the 5000 mile drain intervals recommended by Ford. You do have to keep an eye on the foaming w/ the HEUI injectors, as 59 Vetteman mentioned
TooSlick
Ben,
The factory fill for the newer 7.3L Powerstrokes is a 10w-30, CI-4 rated, Group II diesel oil. Ford went to the lighter stuff as they were having some cold weather issues running 15w-40. Amsoils' primary recommendation for this application is the Series 3000, rather than their 15w-40 ...
Yes, the PC 5w-40 is simply an excellent product - I'm sort of glad it isn't widely available in the US
So much for the "Group III synthetics are no good" nonsense ....I'd wager that 95% of the folks making that comment have never even used a Group III oil. You do have to use a higher additive treat level than you'd use with a PAO, but the fully formulated oil can be excellent.
TS
The factory fill for the newer 7.3L Powerstrokes is a 10w-30, CI-4 rated, Group II diesel oil. Ford went to the lighter stuff as they were having some cold weather issues running 15w-40. Amsoils' primary recommendation for this application is the Series 3000, rather than their 15w-40 ...
Yes, the PC 5w-40 is simply an excellent product - I'm sort of glad it isn't widely available in the US
TS
Really, I thought they still speced a 15W40. makes it kind of hard for powerstroke owners wanting to run a ci-4 dino oil as I am not aware of any 10W 30's meeting this spec.
Ben,
To be perfectly correct, it's CH-4 rated. I have seen a number of analyses on the Ford-Diesel.com website and it is definitely a 30wt oil. Ford does still recommend both 10w-30 for temps of -10F to 90F and 15w-40 as well.
It is certainly possible to make a 10w-30, CI-4 rated petroleum or synthetic blend diesel oil. The CI-4 spec requires a minimum HT/HS of 3.5 Cp for 10w-30 oils, so it would have to be something in the 11.0-12.5 Cst range @ 100C I'd suppose?
To be perfectly correct, it's CH-4 rated. I have seen a number of analyses on the Ford-Diesel.com website and it is definitely a 30wt oil. Ford does still recommend both 10w-30 for temps of -10F to 90F and 15w-40 as well.
It is certainly possible to make a 10w-30, CI-4 rated petroleum or synthetic blend diesel oil. The CI-4 spec requires a minimum HT/HS of 3.5 Cp for 10w-30 oils, so it would have to be something in the 11.0-12.5 Cst range @ 100C I'd suppose?
Ben,
I agree that the Cummins is a real clean running engine even when worked hard.
On the Powerstroke, the viscosity is not the real problem with the injectors, it is the loss or ineffectiveness of the anti-foam agent in the oil, and this is mostly in dino oil in the 15W40. Quite a few PSD's run the Amsoil 5W30 HDD with no problem. The oil analysis I have seen on PSD's run on the Amsoil 5W30 HDD and the 15W40 Marine and Diesel really don't show that much difference in the wear numbers. Personally, if you live up North the 5W30 HDD is the preferred choice and 15W40 Marine and Diesel for the Southern States.
Now, the 5W40 PC Duron is a fit for either climate along with Delvac 1.
In my 2001 I am using the Schaeffer's 15W40 because it has a good pour point, cold weather pumpabilty ect. So far analysis on this oil is good with low wear. Truck is to new to get a baseline yet though.
Tooslick, Judging by the numbers I am getting from my cummins using pc duron 5w40 I could go to at least 15 thousand mile drains. The oil is in really good shape after I drain at at 10K. I would imagine the new CI-4 duron will be that much better. As far as the powerstroke goes. I have heard that the HEVI injectors are really sensitive to viscosity. Dunno if the amsoil 5w30 would effect there operation or not, but I do know the dino oil when ran to long effects there operation. I would swag this is caused by the oil shearing down.
This might be of use. Start at page 28 of this document:
2003 6.0L Diesel Supplement, 1st Printing
[ December 18, 2002, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: BOBISTHEOILGUY ]
2003 6.0L Diesel Supplement, 1st Printing
[ December 18, 2002, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: BOBISTHEOILGUY ]
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[ December 19, 2002, 07:29 PM: Message edited by: Mike ]
[ December 19, 2002, 07:29 PM: Message edited by: Mike ]
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